The Kevin Nolan saga

**CraftyToePoke** · 24/07/2006, 2:21 PM

Originally Posted by gustavo

I'd rather come bottom with a team of players that wanted to play for us than top the group with a bunch for whom playing for us was a career choice or because they werent considered good enough to play for their own country

strong words, but one things for certain, i definately dont want this guy representing me, ever. its just not right.

each time the Nolan subject crops up on here, the strength of feeling in the anti-Nolan camp strikes me, whereas the pro-Nolan lobby seem to just not get it, they see it as a club signing almost, and totally miss the point in the process.

i wonder if he knew how we felt, if he would finally just fuuck off? as im guessing from the arrogant comments and his general attitude towards playing for us, he has never considered that we may not want his second-hand services.

for example, in the last seasons, birmingham city fans blocked the signing of Boyer, and several clubs have been shamed into pulling out of friendlies with mk dons by their fans protests.

if the fai/Stauton and Nolan in particular were to be made aware of how many fans really really dont want this boyo next or near international honours for us, would it make him go away??

thoughts........

BaZmO* · 24/07/2006, 2:55 PM

Thing I don't get about Nolan is when exactly is he gonna make up his mind whether or not he wants to play for us?

I don't mind him playing for us because if he qualifies under the rules well then he qualifies. Plenty of better players have played for the country of their parents or their grandparents so there's no problem there imo. But you have to want to play for the country you chose and I just don't think that Nolan wants to play for us.

**drinkfeckarse** · 24/07/2006, 2:57 PM

I would take him but as far as I'm concerned, anybody who doesn't bite the hand off you at an offer like that can fcuk off. I don't want Staunton to go begging to the guy and embarress us, the fact that he was indecisive all along should have told everybody something (that he'll only "use" us if all else fails). Who's the other fella again that Staunton was talking to for about 3 months??

**R�iteoir** · 24/07/2006, 3:07 PM

Clinton "O" Morrison Mk II?

**Jerry The Saint** · 24/07/2006, 3:41 PM

Originally Posted by BaZmO*

Thing I don't get about Nolan is when exactly is he gonna make up his mind whether or not he wants to play for us?

I don't mind him playing for us because if he qualifies under the rules well then he qualifies. Plenty of better players have played for the country of their parents or their grandparents so there's no problem there imo. But you have to want to play for the country you chose and I just don't think that Nolan wants to play for us.

Even worse than that though is that he doesn't qualify under the rules as they stand. So Staunton/FAI would need to appeal to FIFA to give Nolan an exemption because, um, he kinda might think about playing for us at some point in the future if he doesn't get picked for England before then...

**wws** · 24/07/2006, 3:47 PM

AND i SUPPOSE TONY CASCARINO and vINNY jones - to name but two from Saipan 88 and Jacks army should be ersed from the record books

they're as Irish as you or I is

**NeilMcD** · 24/07/2006, 3:50 PM

Originally Posted by wws

AND i SUPPOSE TONY CASCARINO and vINNY jones - to name but two from Saipan 88 and Jacks army should be ersed from the record books

they're as Irish as you or I is

What the hell does the above post mean, I can barely read it and what is Saipan 88 .

BaZmO* · 24/07/2006, 3:51 PM

Originally Posted by totalfootball

He doesn't qualify for us! What is so difficult to understand about that? It has been explained on this board, over and over again that, under the rules, he doesn't qualify for us.

Here, relax the kaks!! I said if he qualifies.

**Dodge** · 24/07/2006, 4:01 PM

Ah classic wws...

I concur

**NeilMcD** · 24/07/2006, 4:19 PM

Originally Posted by Dodge

Ah classic wws...

I concur

How is unreadable rubbish a classic. Vinny Jones never played for Ireland, Not sure what Saipan 88 is. The word classic is thrown about way to easily nowadays in my view.

**thelimerick** · 24/07/2006, 5:45 PM

Martin Keown could have played for us, Paul Scholes could have played for us, Wayne Rooney could have played for us.
Should they have though?
No.
Why?
Because they're not Irish.
I agree with one poster who describes it as cheating. Had those player declared and we won something, it would be because we cheated.
My grandmother could be from Cameroon but it wouldn't make ME a.... a Camer..... a cameroo............a Camerooniranian !!!
Kevin Nolan grew up on the streets of England kicking ball with his English mates being watched with pride by his English parents. Just because he cant make the English team does not mean for one minute that he should declare for Ireland. The danger with this policy is that any half arsed English player with no hope of playing international football can just say to himself, oh well, i suppose i'd better check my roots and see what my options are.
I would grant players with serious cause for eligability, such as having Irish parents considering our history of emigration, but bargain basement hunting for England cast-offs is, in my opinion, not an option, no matter how tempting.

**NeilMcD** · 24/07/2006, 5:54 PM

I think its one of those that is hard to talk about as you cant have a hard and fast rule about it. As there are 2nd or 3rd generation people who are every bit as Irish as the a person born in the country. BUt I do agree there are guys like Nolan and others who have used it as a means to play international football. Some of these have gone on to be heroes in this country. The idea of nationality is so complex and very hard to come up with a form of words that would cater for the situation so its up to each individual association to decide if they want people who may not feel 100% German or Irish or whatever. Don't think its cheating though.

**Dodge** · 24/07/2006, 6:17 PM

Originally Posted by NeilMcD

How is unreadable rubbish a classic. Vinny Jones never played for Ireland, Not sure what Saipan 88 is

Because people like you reply like this.

**Stuttgart88** · 25/07/2006, 7:26 AM

Originally Posted by Dodge

Because people like you reply like this.

I hate this type of response, and especially from a moderator.

Back to Nolan: I fully understand and generally agree with the arguments against selecting him but equally, I'll be wondering in Stuttgart whether we should be more ruthless in utilising the rules when we'll be facing three Polish players who qualify for Germany, as far as I know, only by residence.

Anyway, we've been through this all before. I only started the thread on the basis of an article I saw saying that Staunton was still pursuing Nolan which I thought was newsworthy. I should have known better.

**shakermaker1982** · 25/07/2006, 9:43 AM

well whatever the rights or wrongs he better hurry up and make a decision!!!

**gspain** · 25/07/2006, 9:46 AM

Some people here appear to have very negative feelings towards Kevin Nolan.

A few ponts

1) He doesn't qualify today but an appeal to FIFA would probably mean he could qualify as he did qualify for the amnesty.

2) He is a quality player. One of the best uncapped players in England.

3) Vinny Jones tried to play for us but was turned down. he ended up watching one world cup in an Irish jersey in Cork and then became welsh through and through.

4) Cascarino was always eligible to play for us.

**Dodge** · 25/07/2006, 10:10 AM

The main point gspian is that he obviously doesn't WANT to be Irish, and obviously doesn't consider himself Irish. IMO after that the rest doesn't matter

**NeilMcD** · 25/07/2006, 10:37 AM

Originally Posted by Dodge

Because people like you reply like this.

People like me what is that supposed to mean. As Stuttgart says not a very good response especially someone who is a moderator. I still do not know what Saipan 88 is and Vinny Jones never played for Ireland so not sure how or why the post from WWS is a classic. It does not makes sense on any level. Also Dodge you dont know me so less of the personal stuff please.

**Dodge** · 25/07/2006, 10:53 AM

Sorry, should have said "posters like you".

It is a VERY VERY OBVIOUS **** take on the whole "lets sign him up" brigade. Anybody who knows wws' posts from his classic period would be familiar with his work and not reply. In fact I can't believe anybody would bother replying to it as it was THAT obvious. You didn't get the joke, therefore you were "one of those people". I admit I should've used "posters"

**TerryPhelan** · 25/07/2006, 12:24 PM

This is all getting a bit silly. Can we please stick with the issue (or what's left of it after having been picked apart yet again)?

We've been getting similar headlines and 'stories' about Nolan every once and a while for the last year, on and off. My initial reaction on reading about 'Nolan maybe in a green jersey someday possibly maybe' on elevenaside was one of annoyance at it being a total non-entity in terms of news; so, whatever about the role that Nolan's place of birth might play in your low opinion of the move to have him declare for us, try to set aside whatever (probably considerable) irritation you might feel towards the whole idea created by this over-reporting of a non-story. That was quite a convoluted sentence, but I hope I'm being clear. What I'm trying to say is that it is the press who keep running to Nolan asking about Ireland, not the other way around. So I think these calls for him basically to '**** off' or the like are overblown and irrational. There is no need to be so aggressive towards him!

Personally, I think from an entirely cold and pragmatic point of view, the Irish team is crying out for a player like Nolan, and a central midfield of Nolan and Stevie Reid would be very strong indeed, I think everyone can agree. Therefore, from that perspective, any move by Nolan in our direction is to be welcomed.

I realise the fundamental difficulty that people have with a player, who to all intents and purposes is English, playing for us on account of an Irish heritage he feels little or no connection to. Well and good. But I think it is an absolutely ridiculous thing to say (as has been alluded to earlier in this thread and in others) that it is somehow better for us all that an Irish team made up of only 'thoroughbred Irish' - players who have been wholly committed to Ireland/Irish culture/playing for Ireland their whole lives - finishes last and loses all their games; than for an Ireland team with a number (which is never going to be more than 1 or 2, for what it's worth) of English-born players who elected to declare for Ireland finishes first. This is a bizarre statement to make, in my view. While I understand the sentiment, I also feel you have to look around at other countries a little (I think it was Stuttgart88 who mentioned the Germans having 3 Polish lads in their team), as well as at our own post-Hand history, to realise that with immersion in a good set-up (hopefully Stan's counts here), a few good results and the patience of the fans, even 'foreign' (in attitude as well as by birth) players can become fully committed to the Irish cause.

I don't want to go on too long here, but I'll say this: if Stan's pursuit of Nolan is successful and he helps us qualify for Euro 2008 and World Cup 2010, I don't see why any right-thinking Irish football fan should feel disgruntled.