Euro Draw - Friday 27th

Originally Posted by Roo69

Best for qualifying would be.....

Greece
Poland
Bulgaria
Republic of Ireland
Iceland
Cyprus
San Marino

Analysis-Forecasts:

Greece: 2 heavy defeats to current holders
Poland: 2 more defeats to WC finalists
Bulgaria: At best, 1 point at home
Iceland: 2 draws
Cyprus: 2 wins, but sick of playing them
San Marino: Two 2-0 wins, but we never play them anyway.

It boggles me that people make Greece to be whipping boys from Pot 1. They may have failed to qualify for the WC out of a very hard group, but they are reigning European Champions, and deserve respect. They also have players playing regular first-team football in top European leagues. We alternatively, have players struggling to get into poor, exclusively English teams, and together with a coach who knows as much about coaching as the fans do, we would be no match for any half-decent side.

Staunton will be out after our Euro campaign ends in June '07, when we're about 60th in the world, having left a trail of destruction behind him, that someone else brave/foolish enough is going to have to try and clear up.

Remind me what happened the last time we played the reigning European champions in a qualifying group? Remind me when the last time Greece hammered anyone was? Don't think anyone is saying Greece are whipping boys, but they are unarguably the weakest top seed in the draw, given that they should be in the third pool strengthwise.

I posed this question on the Bert Kassies forum - a few interesting replies from people around Europe... Ireland well up on the list of teams people don't want to face, though probably more because there are easier fourth-pool draws.

Originally Posted by pineapple stu

Remind me what happened the last time we played the reigning European champions in a qualifying group? Remind me when the last time Greece hammered anyone was? Don't think anyone is saying Greece are whipping boys, but they are unarguably the weakest top seed in the draw, given that they should be in the third pool strengthwise.

I posed this question on the Bert Kassies forum - a few interesting replies from people around Europe... Ireland well up on the list of teams people don't want to face, though probably more because there are easier fourth-pool draws.

I believe Sweden to be the weakest of the top seeds, and are manageable. A weak Irish team with a highly inexperienced coach facing a rough, hostile trip to the Olympic Stadium in Athens to face the current European Champions is a different prospect altogether, and one to be preferably avoided.

I don't really mind who we draw,every group is gonna be a tough one, plus being realistic,I don't expect us to qualify and would be happy if we were too be still in with a shout going into the last few rounds of matches,as long as we aren't out of the running after the first couple of rounds,and still have some sort of interest in the competition.I imagine a third place finish would be good work considering the pool of players that we have.Maybe then can we feel we can push for a world cup spot in Africa 2010.

Sweden the weakest of the top seeds?! Greece lost to Albania in qualifying and managed just one win from their six games against Ukraine, Turkey and Denmark, while the Swedes are usually exceptionally consistent (eight wins from ten last time, with the best goals-per-game in the entire of Europe). Greece are quite clearly the weakest of the top seeds. That doesn't make them a better team - they'd be favourites to beat us, especially in Greece - but they are the team we should be hoping for from the draw.

Sure why let facts get in the way of a good argument though ha ha

Facts shmacts. Sure mypost can use shmacts to prove anything - 75% of posters know that!

Originally Posted by pineapple stu

Sweden the weakest of the top seeds?! Greece are quite clearly the weakest of the top seeds. they are the team we should be hoping for from the draw.

Athens remains a place of fear for both club and International teams to visit. Greece are European Champions, so that suggests that they're not very weak. What have Sweden ever won?? The Scandinavian Championship??

Hope we get Ingerland id love to see us get a result over there.

Originally Posted by mypost

Athens remains a place of fear for both club and International teams to visit. Greece are European Champions, so that suggests that they're not very weak. What have Sweden ever won?? The Scandinavian Championship??

Tehran was a fairly intimidating atmosphere as well, but Iran were one of the worst teams I've seen in a long while. If Greece are so good, how did Albania beat them? How did they only get one win out of six games against Turkey, Ukraine and Denmark?

Sweden have been in a World Cup quarter and semi, a Euro Championships quarter and a Euro semi in the past 15 years while Greece have only reached one other finals tournament in the same period - when they recorded one of the worst World Cup records ever. Sweden are consistently among the best teams in qualifying. But if you're going to be more worried about a few noisy fans than the 11 players actually playing the game, then fair enough.

I would like:

Greece
Germany
Bulgaria
Ireland
Hungary
Moldova
Liechtenstein

Originally Posted by pineapple stu

Tehran was a fairly intimidating atmosphere as well, but Iran were one of the worst teams I've seen in a long while.

Yes and we lost 1-0

True...though I have never been less nervous during a match ever. Don't forget, the winner was in injury-time, by which time, we'd all but won the tie anyway.

Anyway, the point about Greece being a better draw than Sweden still stands, which I can see you agree with! The point is not that Greece would be easy opposition.

Originally Posted by pineapple stu

If Greece are so good, how did Albania beat them? How did they only get one win out of six games against Turkey, Ukraine and Denmark?

Ireland had 3 home games against our rivals to qualify for the World Cup. Did we win any one of those games? No. Greece lost local derby matches against Albania, and Turkey in a much tougher group, but they actually won one game against their rivals, and also beat us on their only visit to Dublin. Bad side eh??

Sweden have been in a World Cup quarter and semi, a Euro Championships quarter and a Euro semi in the past 15 years while Greece have only reached one other finals tournament in the same period.

So? What would you prefer? Win tournaments, or be continously the bridesmaid? What have Sweden ever won?? Answer - as much as we have. Going to Sweden is more manageable than facing a long, hostile trek to Athens to face the European Champions, and be soundly walloped into the bargain.

Originally Posted by pineapple stu

True...though I have never been less nervous during a match ever. Don't forget, the winner was in injury-time, by which time, we'd all but won the tie anyway.

Anyway, the point about Greece being a better draw than Sweden still stands, which I can see you agree with! The point is not that Greece would be easy opposition.

Yeah I would have to say Greece would be the easiest team in the 1st seeds. However, that doesn't mean that we would beat them
I guess you could compare their era under Rehhagel with our era under Charlton. A well organised team that is difficult to score against and has a style of play that takes a lot of effort to play against, except of course Rehhagel has been more successful. Just like with us under Charlton it appears that after a few years Greece are not a surprise element anymore and other international teams have become accustomed to their style of play. So now the opposition is better prepared to play against that style, which has resulted in a disimprovement in their recent results.
However, they are still dangerous if you are not properly prepared. That would be down to Stan and Bobby.

Originally Posted by mypost

Ireland had 3 home games against our rivals to qualify for the World Cup. Did we win any one of those games?

Irrelevant. This is about Greece, not Ireland.

Originally Posted by mypost

also beat us on their only visit to Dublin.

So? That was a friendly. By that logic, we shouldn't fear Portugal, the Czechs, Brazil or Romania, but God help us if we face NI.

Originally Posted by mypost

Bad side eh??

Show me where I said that? I said - and I'll repeat it again for the slow - Greece are the weakest of the top seeds, which does not make them a bad side, just the one we want to draw.

Originally Posted by mypost

So? What would you prefer? Win tournaments, or be continously the bridesmaid? What have Sweden ever won?? Answer - as much as we have. Going to Sweden is more manageable than facing a long, hostile trek to Athens to face the European Champions, and be soundly walloped into the bargain.

The point is Greece's win was a once-off, while Sweden have been a consistenly good team for the past 15 years. Therefore I know which I want to avoid. And I repeat I have no fear of a team just because they're European Champions - so were Denmark in 1992, and we knocked them out of the World Cup. Greece also rarely "soundly wallop" anyone, as evidenced by 15 goals in 12 World Cup qualifiers. Compare that to Sweden's 30 goals in ten games. I know which country sounds more likely to "soundly wallop" us.

Originally Posted by pineapple stu

Irrelevant. This is about Greece, not Ireland.

True, but only if we don't get them in the draw. Then the comparison is relevant.

Greece's win was a once-off, while Sweden have been a consistenly good team for the past 15 years. Therefore I know which I want to avoid.

...which imo, would be Greece. Going on your logic, I take it you regard France's WC win in '98 as a one-off too. Sweden however, are nothing special, and while they should be respected, they're also nothing to be afraid of.

Greece also rarely "soundly wallop" anyone, as evidenced by 15 goals in 12 World Cup qualifiers.

Well, some people regard a comprehensive 3 or 4 goal beating as a sound walloping. Maybe you don't.

Originally Posted by mypost

Well, some people regard a comprehensive 3 or 4 goal beating as a sound walloping. Maybe you don't.

Greece haven't won by more than 2 goals in 6 years.

Having seen the new Wembley coming together on the snooker last nite, I actually wouldn't mind Ingerland now either. Would be some away trip

I see the new Wembley quite often as I live in NW London. Very impressive looking.