LOI In Europe 2025

[Nesta99]

Ive heard it said that there could be domestic sanctions if a UEFA nominated team fall foul in their applicaton (not failing the application but getting a licence and then not using it). Supposedly a clause added from when Waterford tried to enter competition knowing they werent ineligible but were going to get someone to manipulate the rules at UEFA. If true really harsh, I see the logic but not the same situation at all.

[2 Year Contract]

Well yes they do, however most countries have everything wrapped up a month before Denmark.
Having 5+ weeks vs 1 to engage with UEFA and make changes if necessary is a huge difference.

It's a lot easier to make an argument to Uefa (or CAS if necessary) if you've already divested shares/created a blind trust, like other clubs have done, even if it's post March deadline, than asking them if they'll just let you in or do you need to change the business structure.
At that stage it's a lot easier for Uefa to just say 'sorry, too late".

I don’t buy the whole having 1 week to engage with UEFA thing. Trivela bought Silkeborg in November, who at that point had played in Europe 2 of the last 3 seasons and won the Danish Cup in 2024. The fact that they went on to qualify for Europe for the 3rd time in 4 seasons shouldn’t have come as some big surprise to them. They knew what they were getting into when buying the club and Drogheda had already earned their European spot before they bought Silkeborg

[Nesta99]

A bit mad that the LOI as whole will be hurt by this through losing UEFA co-efficient, and maybe that Europa League spot. If Rovers are replacing Drogheda (ie. they are being replaced not just straight eliminated), I cant see how the ruling is LOI has 4 teams in the competitions, not 3.

I would feel a bit bitter about that. I am sure there is some rule somewhere that states it - but functionally, its stupid to me.

Also, does not reflect well on the competency of Chairperson and Sinn Fein TD Joanna Byrne, who, along with the rest of the board, missed this and seemed to be shocked by the news. Thats a big hole in their budget now. Poster above is right, Irish teams are some of the first to qualify for European, so plenty of time for this to have been flagged.

Must be some worries that those investors would just drop Drogheda now.

Also, weird for me that Drogheda are claiming to be the 'little guy', when they are part (and benefiting) of the very problem many people hate with modern football of multi-club ownership.

Doesnt reflect well on every other LOI Premier team too that didnt apply for UEFA licence when they should have been a bit clued in to the problems that Drogheda might have had.

Overall, this years embarrassing episode for the league.

Good point. I was also thinking it was pushing around a small club/league when EPL sized clubs had been sorted in the past but if part of a multiclub system then its the size of owners rather than the individual club that probably should be the marker.

I dont think Tirvela would write off what they have already invested based on this setback. Its disappointing but plans for development and 1st team football were budgeted for prior to winning the cup. They are ahead of expectations so the money would have been nice rather than a deal breaker. Maybe budgets were increased after the cup win but I dont think Drogheda went mad with signings to leave a huge hole in finances.

[Kiki Balboa]

Ive heard it said that there could be domestic sanctions if a UEFA nominated team fall foul in their applicaton (not failing the application but getting a licence and then not using it). Supposedly a clause added from when Waterford tried to enter competition knowing they werent eligible but were going to get someone to manipulate the rules at UEFA. If true really harsh, I see the logic but not the same situation at all.

Makes it worse then that UEFA is essentially punishing the league for no-one else applying.

That would be something worth taking to CAS for me.

[holidaysong]

Somebody on Bert's site quoted the following from the regulations regarding the coefficient still being divided by 4 rather than 3.

"If a club refused to enter a UEFA competition for which it qualified or was excluded from or not admitted to the competition and not replaced by another club from the same association, the association's coefficient is calculated by dividing the total number of points obtained by its clubs by the number of clubs the association was entitled to enter according to the access list."

[pineapple stu]

Makes it worse then that UEFA is essentially punishing the league for no-one else applying.

In a way, we absolutely deserve that punishment based on earlier posts on how other leagues operate.

[2 Year Contract]

Trivela have paid a 6 figure sum in legal fees fighting UEFA’s decision

https://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/league-of-ireland/drogheda-owners-spending-six-figure-sum-to-fund-legal-challenge-of-decision-to-kick-them-out-of-europe/a2003908567.html

[oriel]

Can see their point in contesting and paying for this, do nothing, lose €525 revenue + gate, spend 20-50k (no idea on costs) chance of getting 475k prize money + gate etc (if paying 50 in legals). They might as well. Then again if they lose its obv the 50k or so lost, plus the potential 525k revenue gone. I just don't think they have the pull to carry this out, I could be wrong.

Not sure what most think their chances are with CAS, deadline date seemed fairly clear, as was the shares thing, the small club thing won't do them any favours either, would imagine if a bigger club from a bigger league, maybe chance would be higher, but again who knows.

[Mr_Parker]

Larne's pitch wasn't up to UEFA standard either last season, but they still applied for, and gained, a European Licence, on the basis that they'd play their home games at Windsor.

Not quite correct. Larne used Solitude and then had to move to Windsor when they got to the League stage. This year they have nominated Ballymena for there qualifying games. Likewise Dungannon who are in Europe this year, will use Solitude.

It is common practice for clubs who do not have a ground that meets UEFA standards to nominate another suitable venue. Happens all over Europe.

[EatYerGreens]

Makes it worse then that UEFA is essentially punishing the league for no-one else applying.

That would be something worth taking to CAS for me.

That would NOT be UEFA punishing anyone though. You've got such a wrong-headed way of looking at things here.

If no other Irish clubs applied for a UEFA license, who's fault would that be ? Irish clubs themselves? The FAI (who should really be pushing for it to be a standard move) Or UEFA?

What happend to the old-fashioned notion of taking responsibility for one's own actions (or lack of), rather than always looking for someone else to blame instead?

[LTFC]

Can see their point in contesting and paying for this, do nothing, lose €525 revenue + gate, spend 20-50k (no idea on costs) chance of getting 475k prize money + gate etc (if paying 50 in legals). They might as well. Then again if they lose its obv the 50k or so lost, plus the potential 525k revenue gone. I just don't think they have the pull to carry this out, I could be wrong.

Not sure what most think their chances are with CAS, deadline date seemed fairly clear, as was the shares thing, the small club thing won't do them any favours either, would imagine if a bigger club from a bigger league, maybe chance would be higher, but again who knows.

On the surface of course they should take the legal action. But you would have to have a concern that this could also be storing up trouble for Drogs. We have seen entities leave clubs in a far worse place than they found them with locals scrambling around to keep the ship afloat afterwards. Can Drogs afford 6 figure legal bills? I very much doubt it.

[Nesta99]

CAS is arbitration so there is some room to manouver. While the rules are cut and dry there is precedence of bending of the rules. If Drogs can prove that they engaged in full to also bend the rules in the same way, that notification was very late and unreasonable, CAS can rule that dispensation should be offered. Its not binding though, but it does open the door for seeking compensation for loss of earnings as UEFA rules dont allow for executive decisions in unusual cases - lower bar to prove UEFA caused losses. We dont really know how long Drogs were trying to come with a solution and offered to do what others were allowed but refused or how late UEFA gave notice of an issue when Silkeborg qualified. General notice in the past may not cut it. CAS could just go rules are rules and must be enforced but again that opens the way for litigation due to the rules being fudged at other times. Will be interesting CAS rulings are generally very insightful and have angles ye wouldnt think of, along with exposing chancer behaviour of appelants. Hearing on Monday.

[Nesta99]

On the surface of course they should take the legal action. But you would have to have a concern that this could also be storing up trouble for Drogs. We have seen entities leave clubs in a far worse place than they found them with locals scrambling around to keep the ship afloat afterwards. Can Drogs afford 6 figure legal bills? I very much doubt it.

It wont happen. These owners also have to show to other clubs they own along with potential future purchases that they wont leave unless they themselves are in a financial bind. P6 were asked to leave Dundalk and they did, Shels owners didnt leave them in trouble though I will say, again, that they are on course for trouble, needing cutting back, if without European football 2026 and no money owner safety net. Waterford ownership is at risk while owners are being hit for law suit after law suit, not the company that now owns them but if their owner is in a bind financially they could be left high and dry. Arkaga ran out of money and legged it. Trivela are not going to the wall over Drogheda expenditure.

[2 Year Contract]

Could you imagine the absolute ****storm if Drogheda are successful in their case with CAS on Monday and then draw Silkeborg in the draw on Wednesday. Silkeborg are seeded and Drogs unseeded for round 2 so stranger things have happened, even if it would be a first in European football as far as I know. I half want it to happen now just for the pure entertainment value

[BigEars]

Could you imagine the absolute ****storm if Drogheda are successful in their case with CAS on Monday and then draw Silkeborg in the draw on Wednesday. Silkeborg are seeded and Drogs unseeded for round 2 so stranger things have happened, even if it would be a first in European football as far as I know. I half want it to happen now just for the pure entertainment value

RB Leipzig have played RB Salzburg in the Europa League before. There may be other instances of this, happening, although I'm not aware of them.

[oriel]

On the surface of course they should take the legal action. But you would have to have a concern that this could also be storing up trouble for Drogs. We have seen entities leave clubs in a far worse place than they found them with locals scrambling around to keep the ship afloat afterwards. Can Drogs afford 6 figure legal bills? I very much doubt it.

I think its their owners who are footing the legal bill, and its 5 figs, no idea what that is, would imagine has to be 50k or so, esp as legal team would only have been assembled since wed or thurs, and will have to prep over w/e - monday hearing.

[oriel]

It wont happen. These owners also have to show to other clubs they own along with potential future purchases that they wont leave unless they themselves are in a financial bind. P6 were asked to leave Dundalk and they did, Shels owners didnt leave them in trouble though I will say, again, that they are on course for trouble, needing cutting back, if without European football 2026 and no money owner safety net. Waterford ownership is at risk while owners are being hit for law suit after law suit, not the company that now owns them but if their owner is in a bind financially they could be left high and dry. Arkaga ran out of money and legged it. Trivela are not going to the wall over Drogheda expenditure.

Shels is an interesting one, they lost 1.5M last year, and if they don't make europe for 2026, that's a huge hole to fill.

Drogs will be down 0.5m if case not successful.

Even Rovers need a group stage almost every year or at least every 2 years to keep their high levels on track.

Its simply all about euro monies if any LOI club wants to be successful and have a healthy budget to compete.

[EatYerGreens]

CAS is arbitration so there is some room to manouver. While the rules are cut and dry there is precedence of bending of the rules. If Drogs can prove that they engaged in full to also bend the rules in the same way, that notification was very late and unreasonable, CAS can rule that dispensation should be offered. Its not binding though, but it does open the door for seeking compensation for loss of earnings as UEFA rules dont allow for executive decisions in unusual cases - lower bar to prove UEFA caused losses. We dont really know how long Drogs were trying to come with a solution and offered to do what others were allowed but refused or how late UEFA gave notice of an issue when Silkeborg qualified. General notice in the past may not cut it. CAS could just go rules are rules and must be enforced but again that opens the way for litigation due to the rules being fudged at other times. Will be interesting CAS rulings are generally very insightful and have angles ye wouldnt think of, along with exposing chancer behaviour of appelants. Hearing on Monday.

You don't seem to understand the UEFA process ?

The rules were not fudged previously. What happened was that the clubs concerned altered ownership structure/balance according to the rules to ensure they didnt fall foul of the rules. Drogheda's owners bave known for 7 months that they were in Europe this Summer. Yet they didn't do anything to mitigate the risk of falling foul of the multi-ownership rules until it was too late. Like seriously - how can a company that exists to pursue the ownership of multiple football clubs get itself into a posiiton whereby it needlessly falls foul of the rules on multi-ownership?! It's amateur hour stuff.

[placid casual]

Shels is an interesting one, they lost 1.5M last year, and if they don't make europe for 2026, that's a huge hole to fill.

Drogs will be down 0.5m if case not successful.

Even Rovers need a group stage almost every year or at least every 2 years to keep their high levels on track.

Its simply all about euro monies if any LOI club wants to be successful and have a healthy budget to compete.

Agree that it's a calculated gamble with LOI teams budgeting for European "success" to justify their outlay in player budget for the season.
Rovers getting past the group stages of conference league last season has kept a wolf from the door.
That's why the league winners and now FAI Cup winners is so sought after for LOI clubs with the parachute of at least 2 or more games in Europe.
Id always stress that , imo, LOI teams are now more than ever capable of holding their own in Europe especially the Conference league.
Uefa get plenty of flack for their general commercial *******isation of football but the Conference League is an absolute Christmas present for those of us who follow teams from the supposed weaker leagues.

[oriel]

For Conf League, this was meant to be to support the smaller leagues, makes a mockery of it, likes of Chelsea winning it.

IMO this is a euro competition that leagues ranked 1-10 should not be permitted to take part in, and especially ranked 1-4, it should be a competition that allows clubs from countries who have never ever had a finalist to have a real chance of making one, something like the English league trophy, or whatever it is, confinded for L1 and L2 clubs, Sunderland got there a few times in tier 3 and sold 50k tickets.

Its great of course smaller leagues at the start, win their league, then avoid defeat first euro game, you are almost certain of a group stage, just deflates the ambition when likes of Eng, Spanish clubs etc all parachute in.

Timing is another thing, if Conf League was around in late 10's, Dundalk would have made group stages in 15 + 17, poss 18 also, but that route wasn't available then. Still good for Irish clubs now to have that chance, but its just same old same old making last 16 / QF etc.