Swiss v Israel....score

**Colbert Report** · 03/09/2005, 5:37 PM

"if Ireland wins its two remaining home games"

you seriously expect that to happen? Right now I would settle for two draws against Switzerland and France. I'd give my right arm for four points. Six points is a pipe dream.

**Stuttgart88** · 03/09/2005, 5:40 PM

Phew. Didn't see it. None of the so-called Irish pubs in Nth West London showed it. I tried about 6 of them. Long bloody walk I can tell you! When I got home I was checking teletext every 5 mins for an update. Very pleased with the outcome. Can someone give me a synopsis?

Vega007, I can't believe you're only asking these questions now!

This result means that a defeat by France is not the end of the world. 6 further points will put us ahead of Israel and also Switzerland as long as the Swiss don't beat France. A draw with France means we can still win the group outright on 20pts though a French win in Switzerland would probably see them win on GD.

An unconvincing French win tonight & some injuries / suspensions is best we can hope for I reckon.

There's still a chance of a 4 way tie. We draw with France & Switz, Switz draws with France.

**OwlsFan** · 03/09/2005, 5:43 PM

Think we're guaranteed 2nd place if we beat Swiss and Cypriots because we'd have same amount of points as Swiss but would have had better results against them.

**Gerrit** · 03/09/2005, 5:45 PM

Ireland and Israel have it in their own hands, just like I was hoping for

It'd be even greater if the Faroes would shock Paris tonight. Wishful thinking, but you never know...

**Stuttgart88** · 03/09/2005, 5:49 PM

Interesting point by Gerritt. If we win our 2 home games we're first place regardless of Cyprus result. I don't have the group table near me. But it sounds right though.

Israel has played the other 3 top teams twice & has drawn the 6 games. If we beat France & Switzerland they can't get more points than us & we'll go through on head-to-head even if we lose in Cyprus.

5 points may even be enough for second, or an outright group win if we run up a very big score in Cyprus.

Fascinating group.

**Volcán Masaya** · 03/09/2005, 5:51 PM

Originally Posted by Gerrit

Ireland and Israel have it in their own hands, just like I was hoping for

Actually Isreal do not have their fate in their hands anymore, they needed to win today to gaurantee and top 2 finish. Even if they beat the Faeroes twice they can still finish in 4th if the the remaining games betrween Ireland, France and Switzerland are split with each team winning one and losing one.

**Stuttgart88** · 03/09/2005, 5:52 PM

Originally Posted by Gerrit

Israel have it in their own hands

I don't think so. If any 2 of France, Switzerland and Ireland get 4 points from the remaining "mini-league" of those 3 teams I think Israel will be out (assuming nobody slips against the minnows).

**Gerrit** · 03/09/2005, 5:52 PM

I think the 4 teams will be batteling for the top-2 spots till the very last day. It's amazing how close they are, can't remember a group this exciting for quite a while. Cyprus and the Faroes can play, ehm, what's the English word for someone who has no chance of winning himself but who can decide about who else wins?

**geysir** · 03/09/2005, 5:53 PM

Originally Posted by vega007

I don't know why you guys think that a draw is good for us. If it is a draw then Israel will have 13 points with two matches against the Faroes left, so more than likely they'll have 19 points to finish the group. That means that we'll have to beat Cyprus, and collect four points against France and Switzerland. Highly unlikely...

calculations ??

Israel pl.8 w.2 d.6 points 12
max points they can get is 18
Ireland with 13 points are in an ok position

**Poor Student** · 03/09/2005, 5:53 PM

Originally Posted by Stuttgart88

Fascinating group.

Feck that. Give me a boring group anyday. I'll have used up all my excitement, tension etc. on this group before the WC even comes.

**Stuttgart88** · 03/09/2005, 5:53 PM

Ha Ha, there's a few of us thinking the same things at the same time, but who can type the quickest!

**onenilgameover** · 03/09/2005, 6:01 PM

Originally Posted by Stuttgart88

Fascinating group.

Glad its keeping your interest up then Stuttgart88...

Fair play to the Israeli's

**Colbert Report** · 03/09/2005, 6:05 PM

the English word is "spoiler"

**elroy** · 03/09/2005, 6:34 PM

Nowhere out here in the Canaries showed it, not even the Irish bars, draw is def the best result, a win would have given the team a clear advantage over us. especially if it was Israel as they have only the faroes left to play.
I really think the key game for us is against the Swiss, We MUST beat them, a draw will be ok on wed but we must beat the swiss, we´re due a good win over them anyway.

**Levantine** · 03/09/2005, 6:52 PM

Originally Posted by totalfootball

The rules on the FIFA website make no mention of away goals, so yes.

Actually, if there is no consideration of away goals, then the whole consideration of head to head goal difference is irrelevant. According to FIFA's regulations , the next consideration in line is "greater number of goals scored in the group matches between the teams concerned", where Israel is currently in lead with 7 goals.
Which interestingly gives the power to the rest of the squads to push each other ahead by getting multi-goals draws.

Anyway... this group refuses to be resolved. It was a bit sad to see Israel letting go on offence at the last 15 minutes. It could have been a win - the Swiss really sucked...

**Stuttgart88** · 03/09/2005, 7:16 PM

It's irrelevant now & has been since each "top" team drew with each other once. But say team A beat team B 2-0 & then B beat A 3-0, B would go through if they were tied on points.

It is still very possible for total group goal difference to decide the final order.

**Levantine** · 03/09/2005, 7:26 PM

I don't think such a scenario is possible, since all top teams have already drawn at least once with the rest. I agree that it's very likely that not all 4 will be tied at the end, but in that case I suspect that simple point would be enough to decide the top 2, and goal difference would be an academic issue.

In the mean time, the faroes fail to surprise... 0-2 down in France.

**Volcán Masaya** · 03/09/2005, 9:19 PM

Check this out...... http://www.worldcup.somee.com/default.aspx

**OwlsFan** · 03/09/2005, 11:03 PM

I repeat what I said earlier. if we beat the Swiss and Cyprus we're guaranteed a play off position becuase we will have more points than Israel and at worst the same as the Swiss and since in such circumstances we will have taken more points off them, we finish ahead of them. This is clear from Article 7.7 (no doubt). Same applies if we beat France and Cyprus.