Dublin unrest after stabbing

[Neish]

The issue is immigration policy. It is the root of the unrest and disillusionment. The organized protest and unrest is seen as a last resort by the impacted community after the rape/sexual assault of a 10 year old child by an immigrant. A last resort after years of disturbances and crime where their calls for police intervention and dialogue with local authorities were basically ignored. The unacceptable thuggery and violence that attached to the protest was sadly inevitable but it represented a very small percentage of the 2000-3000 people that were there. Yet it dominated the discourse and distracted from a very valid local and national issue. Immigration.

You cant say in good faith or in good intelligence that the issue is not immigration policy but is simply down to racism and targeted violence. You say that immigration is working because we have more doctors and nurses in healthcare. How can you say that with a straight face? Is the issue that one dimensional to you? In fact, Simon Harris - based on his comments over the weekend - would now seem to agree that the issue is immigration policy. He basically suggests the same as I posted earlier in the thread in terms of us taking too many in that we cannot sustain (he adds that there are also many, many bad faith applicants). A post he probably would have labelled as far right or racist not too long ago.

Last resort? Its the first resort for most. Have you a list all they other methods the organiser of these protest exhausted to voice the objections before your last resort of violence and intimadation?

I didn't say it isn't about immigration policy but down to racism, I asked why are they not targeting government building who set said policy instead of using collective punishment on hundreds if not thousands with the use of violent and non violent intimation protests outside IPA centres? "Chants & banners of get them out etc"

And I reiterate if you attending events and spreading social media posts organised by blatant bigoted racists then you are guilty by association . Are you telling me this self proclaimed "silent majority" can't get themselves together to organise their own events and excluded the far right from them? And if violence etc occurs(by small groups) they voice their objections to it with the same amount of vigor that they did to push their ideology

As for Pineapple stu , I'm ignoring you until you tell by how it is racist to allow people to move to other countries for better job and quality of life. We Irish a one of the biggest per capita migrating nationalities in the world the vast, vast majority of it economic and its deprived Ireland of skilled workers that were trained in Ireland. This is the way the worls has operated since the industrial revolution its not racist in any way

[SkStu]

Last resort? Its the first resort for most. Have you a list all they other methods the organiser of these protest exhausted to voice the objections before your last resort of violence and intimadation?

Absolute spoofery of the highest. Another example of where you just draw an unsupported conclusion so you can continue to support your position. Read the reams of quotes from local residents, community groups and local councillors who have all commented on the lack of engagement and dialogue, and the concerns that went unanswered. A lot of these articles include quotes from the IPAS residents themselves who raised issues and concerns about their conditions and experiences that were ignored.

I didn't say it isn't about immigration policy but down to racism, I asked why are they not targeting government building who set said policy instead of using collective punishment on hundreds if not thousands with the use of violent and non violent intimation protests outside IPA centres? "Chants & banners of get them out etc"

"The issue is not questioning immigration policy..." - your words.

And I reiterate if you attending events and spreading social media posts organised by blatant bigoted racists then you are guilty by association . Are you telling me this self proclaimed "silent majority" can't get themselves together to organise their own events and excluded the far right from them? And if violence etc occurs(by small groups) they voice their objections to it with the same amount of vigor that they did to push their ideology

What evidence do you have that the organizers are blatant bigoted racists? The public record shows that the protests were initially peaceful and that they were organized by local groups who were shocked at the rape / sexual assault of a 10 year old kid by someone in their community. These protests were subsequently hijacked by gurriers and racists. Where is the guilt by association coming into it? Drawing that out, I assume you refuse to attend football matches where there are hooligans because that will naturally make you a hooligan too? By your own rules, you are guilty by association for daring to show up at a game where there might be hooligans. Absolutely nothing you can do about it, of course, but there you are; a hooligan.

What are your thoughts on the recent comments from the politicians who seem to agree with the points I made over the last couple of pages? Racists?

[Neish]

Absolute spoofery of the highest. Another example of where you just draw an unsupported conclusion so you can continue to support your position. Read the reams of quotes from local residents, community groups and local councillors who have all commented on the lack of engagement and dialogue, and the concerns that went unanswered. A lot of these articles include quotes from the IPAS residents themselves who raised issues and concerns about their conditions and experiences that were ignored.

I'm well aware of this, but there are many other methods of action that can be taken if question are ignored. Petitions, mass organised letters/emails etc to both government and media, sit-ins, blocking roads just a few off the top of my head. Nothing justifies the use of collective punishment by use of aggressive intimation of hundreds/ thousands of people for crimes of a few

"The issue is not questioning immigration policy..." - your words.

You seem to have mis understood here , or perhaps I worded poorly. I'm saying questioning immigration policy is not the issue , the issue is targeting IPA centres not government where such policies are made with protest especially with violent and agressive intimidation racist chants of get them out etc

What evidence do you have that the organizers are blatant bigoted racists? The public record shows that the protests were initially peaceful and that they were organized by local groups who were shocked at the rape / sexual assault of a 10 year old kid by someone in their community. These protests were subsequently hijacked by gurriers and racists. Where is the guilt by association coming into it? Drawing that out, I assume you refuse to attend football matches where there are hooligans because that will naturally make you a hooligan too? By your own rules, you are guilty by association for daring to show up at a game where there might be hooligans. Absolutely nothing you can do about it, of course, but there you are; a hooligan.

What are your thoughts on the recent comments from the politicians who seem to agree with the points I made over the last couple of pages? Racists?

You're telling me the like of Nial McConnell, Derek Blighe, Philip Dwyer, Gavin Pepper etc are racist or at best pushing mantra that far right bigots have used for decades. Your hooligan analogy is poor too as Hooligans don't organise football matches and are in many cases banned from attending games by the clubs of governing bodies


https://www.donegaldaily.com/2025/11...ulting-girl-8/

Where is the concerned parents groups for this case?

Just about every week we see case of Irish men (and ocassionally women) in court for sexual assaults but yet no mass organised protests only in the IPA centres

[pineapple stu]

As for Pineapple stu , I'm ignoring you until you tell by how it is racist to allow people to move to other countries for better job and quality of life. We Irish a one of the biggest per capita migrating nationalities in the world the vast, vast majority of it economic and its deprived Ireland of skilled workers that were trained in Ireland. This is the way the worls has operated since the industrial revolution its not racist in any way

So again, we have the typical reaction of the liberal. Refusing - or simply unable - to engage in the debate and finding an excuse to opt out of it.

I've very clearly told you twice now how modern migration is racist. Thousands of people dying in every developing country because of a lack of doctors because the west takes the majority of them - and you don't see anything problematic in that? You actually haven't even once addressed that fact. You focus on how people are leaving for a better way of life - you ignore how complicit you are in generating a worse way of life in developing countries. One where, once again, thousands of people die annually for the want of basic healthcare. That's systemic racism.

Emigration caused huge damage to Ireland down the decades; we should be aware of our own history and learn from it.

And this is not the way the world has operated since the Industrial Revolution - targeting developing countries to take their labour (either specialist or cheap) is a very modern phenomenon. In Europe, it can probably be traced to the Windrush generation post World War 2, and as I say, it has only escalated this century. Your argument that "This is the way the world has operated since..." has echoes of slavers saying "This is the way the world has operated since..." - just because things have been going on like this for a while doesn't mean they're not racist.

And of course you haven't at all even acknowledged the carbon footprint of emigration as problematic either.

Overall though - you're just reiterating a viewpoint without any factual or contextual backup (whereas I've provided plenty) and have refused to engage in my counter-points, instead asking me to explain what I've already explained to you three times now. And then you say you're going to ignore me. That's pathetic Neish. I'd have expected better debate from you.

But as I say, all too typical of the mindless, thoughtless patter of some liberals.

[SkStu]

I'm well aware of this, but there are many other methods of action that can be taken if question are ignored. Petitions, mass organised letters/emails etc to both government and media, sit-ins, blocking roads just a few off the top of my head. Nothing justifies the use of collective punishment by use of aggressive intimation of hundreds/ thousands of people for crimes of a few




You seem to have mis understood here , or perhaps I worded poorly. I'm saying questioning immigration policy is not the issue , the issue is targeting IPA centres not government where such policies are made with protest especially with violent and agressive intimidation racist chants of get them out etc





You're telling me the like of Nial McConnell, Derek Blighe, Philip Dwyer, Gavin Pepper etc are racist or at best pushing mantra that far right bigots have used for decades. Your hooligan analogy is poor too as Hooligans don't organise football matches and are in many cases banned from attending games by the clubs of governing bodies


https://www.donegaldaily.com/2025/11...ulting-girl-8/

Where is the concerned parents groups for this case?

Just about every week we see case of Irish men (and ocassionally women) in court for sexual assaults but yet no mass organised protests only in the IPA centres

You’ve ignored my direct question about Harris and other politicians recent comments but I suppose you’ve already indirectly answered it by asserting that immigration is working beautifully.

My most basic point is that immigration is broken and what we are seeing - peaceful protest or violent - is a byproduct of this. I think it needs to be looked at from top to bottom and there needs to be some honest dialogue about what functioning, positive immigration looks like in Ireland. You don’t seem to agree with that and would rather just put it down solely to some inherent racism that lives within Irish people or Irish working class people. I think we’re better than that and I think our past record on immigration shows it. The issue and causes of the unrest are deeper than simply racism and I think you’re doing a disservice to reducing the argument to that. But we’re not likely to agree on much so I’ll just leave it there.

[Neish]

So again, we have the typical reaction of the liberal. Refusing - or simply unable - to engage in the debate and finding an excuse to opt out of it.

I've very clearly told you twice now how modern migration is racist. Thousands of people dying in every developing country because of a lack of doctors because the west takes the majority of them - and you don't see anything problematic in that? You actually haven't even once addressed that fact. You focus on how people are leaving for a better way of life - you ignore how complicit you are in generating a worse way of life in developing countries. One where, once again, thousands of people die annually for the want of basic healthcare. That's systemic racism.

Emigration caused huge damage to Ireland down the decades; we should be aware of our own history and learn from it.

And this is not the way the world has operated since the Industrial Revolution - targeting developing countries to take their labour (either specialist or cheap) is a very modern phenomenon. In Europe, it can probably be traced to the Windrush generation post World War 2, and as I say, it has only escalated this century. Your argument that "This is the way the world has operated since..." has echoes of slavers saying "This is the way the world has operated since..." - just because things have been going on like this for a while doesn't mean they're not racist.

And of course you haven't at all even acknowledged the carbon footprint of emigration as problematic either.

Overall though - you're just reiterating a viewpoint without any factual or contextual backup (whereas I've provided plenty) and have refused to engage in my counter-points, instead asking me to explain what I've already explained to you three times now. And then you say you're going to ignore me. That's pathetic Neish. I'd have expected better debate from you.

But as I say, all too typical of the mindless, thoughtless patter of some liberals.

No doctors are being taken from poorer countries they are moving of their free will to seek better quality of life. You may have told me that its racist but allowing people to chose their own walk in life is the exact opposite of a racist system You make it sound like they are being kidnapped and forced into work in richer countries. Is that what you're saying everybody should stay in their own country no matter how corrupt, tyrannical etc the governing bodies are there, regardless if there is destitute poverty, war etc?

You're not giving a factual viewpoint just continually repeating about how its typical of the liberal mindset well guess what just about all this happen under capitalist countries and capitalist policies

Yes this has been the way of the world since the industrial revolution, back then migration was mostly domestic but it been international since the late 19th and early 20th centuries. The amount of Irish(and just about every other nationality) in the USA, Canada, Australia , UK etc is evidence of this

Carbon footprint? Careful now you could be accused of a liberal mindset by bringing carbon footprint into a debate

[Neish]

You’ve ignored my direct question about Harris and other politicians recent comments but I suppose you’ve already indirectly answered it by asserting that immigration is working beautifully.

What was your question on Harris(who I'm no supporter of) i can't see it.

My most basic point is that immigration is broken and what we are seeing - peaceful protest or violent - is a byproduct of this. I think it needs to be looked at from top to bottom and there needs to be some honest dialogue about what functioning, positive immigration looks like in Ireland. You don’t seem to agree with that and would rather just put it down solely to some inherent racism that lives within Irish people or Irish working class people. I think we’re better than that and I think our past record on immigration shows it. The issue and causes of the unrest are deeper than simply racism and I think you’re doing a disservice to reducing the argument to that. But we’re not likely to agree on much so I’ll just leave it there.

I disagree that immigration is broken. The vast majority of people in the system I have met, read about etc are honest people either fleeing big probems in their homeland or simply trying to better their life. It may need a bit of tinkering and the policy need some major upheaval but IMO thats more to support those in the system to provide better standard of living for them.

Are you denying that there is racists groups and personalities promoting and attending these protests many been giving a platform at the event?

[SkStu]

Posts #39 and #42

You disagree that immigration is broken but in the same breath believe that the policy needs some major upheaval...I am pro immigration, I just think that we need to do it within a system that fairly balances the needs/wants of all impacted parties (citizens and immigrants), treats everyone with decency and dignity (citizens and immigrants). I believe we should only take in numbers that we can handle. I believe immigration is a privilege, not a right, and comes with responsibilities.

No, I am not denying it. Read my posts. What I am saying is that the presence of these thugs shouldn't negate the desperate need for debate or dialogue on the issues around immigration.

[Neish]

Posts #39 and #42

Harris is a little weasel that will change will several time depending what way the wind is currently blowing. So I give very little merit to what he says

You disagree that immigration is broken but in the same breath believe that the policy needs some major upheaval.

I said immigration is not broken, immigration POLICY need major upheaval. Immigration and immigration policy are not the same thing, policy is different in different countries

I believe the benefits of immigration vastly outweighs the negatives. Its current government polict that need major upheaval. The Irish have benefited much , much more from immigration the they have lost

I am pro immigration, I just think that we need to do it within a system that fairly balances the needs/wants of all impacted parties (citizens and immigrants), treats everyone with decency and dignity (citizens and immigrants). I believe we should only take in numbers that we can handle. I believe immigration is a privilege, not a right, and comes with responsibilities.

"Immigration is a privilege", tell that to those fleeing famine, poverty, wars etc. So many countries and regions there is no such thing as legal means of immigration people are forced to turn to criminal elements in desperation. I believe in treating people the way you like to be treated and judging people on their actions. Not collective punishment on hundreds just because a crime is committed by one or a few people that they just happen to live in the same building as.

This is a lot of fake new out there on just what those in the IPA system get from the state. I challenge anyone who thinks they get it easy to try and live months on end out of a hotel room with you family or worse people you don't know. Rooms that were deigned to accommodate a few people for a few night, now accommodating 3 or 4 time that for month on end

No, I am not denying it. Read my posts. What I am saying is that the presence of these thugs shouldn't negate the desperate need for debate or dialogue on the issues around immigration.

These "thugs" are continually showing up, at protests right across the country, countless arson attacks on IPA centers , continued violent & aggressive intimidation of both residents and security, continued racist chants and banners like "get them out", "send them home" . If this is all being done by a small band of thugs, why aren't they being named and shamed why aren't they being banned from attending and why aren't they being run off if they turn up. And who is supporting & financing this band of thugs as they seem very mobile

[SkStu]

Fair enough. Going round in circles so will leave it there.