They did - and for Rovers to be so outplayed home and away by a part-time team is appalling. What's not to get?Originally Posted by geysir
Its would be hard to sack him on the basis of going out tonight after a harsh sending off.
Maybe if they were way off the pace in the league as well he would be gone on the basis the new guy could start the rebuild between now and end of season.
Cant see him going before seasons end but equally cant see him being there for the new season if they dont beat Shels to the title.
Won’t someone think about the coefficient. Is that 1.000 so far?
It is. Derry almost certainly weren't going to get anything off Copenhagen so in that regard the win is all that matters.
There's one tie going to a shoot-out now and the table will be updated then.
Higgins has underachieved to-date despite a cup win and a good euro run. However, he is still in the cup and a very good chance they could win. He will be going nowhere yet.
I would be of the same view PS.
Early days but we are up to 32nd in the Country Rankings.
The win and a draw lift us up to 32nd, ahead of Kosovo. Nosebleed territory in fairness; very rare we'd be that high up. I think 29th was our record since UEFA went to 50+ countries.
But the next round will be very tough; not expecting a big haul at all. Four countries below us still have all their teams left in. Two have outscored us so far this season - but really with the first round draw we got, you'd have expected a better return. There's plenty of second round games where lower countries can do well - the Icelandic clubs have opposition from Kosovo, Scotland, Estonia and Albania for example. It'd almost be surprising if they didn't pass us out after that.
As always, the Champions League representative will impact things a lot with more games and the best chance of getting to the groups and getting double points
We finished 5th last season, beat same club 3-1 on agg, this was an absolutely shocking result by Derry with probably twice the budget.
Said it far too many times on here, Higgins is a coach**not a manager.
**SOD and Perth also fall into same bracket, S.Keegan too, I'd also add Bohs manager Reynolds, and previous one Devine too to this list. Its a big list................
Last edited by oriel; 18/07/2024 at 10:17 PM.
#DundalkFC - First Irish club to win an away game in Europe (1963), only Irish club to win a game / points in Europa League Group Stage (2016).
They really lucked out with some of those draws in the league path.
I think it's both a terrible result and a commendable effort given the red card tbh
Copenhagen are going to win the next round about 17-0
Is there some irony in P6 Dundalk name checking BATE as the model they wante to follow?
Derry result is arguably the worst for LoI in Europe but less for performance but due to the relative resources between the 2 clubs and past bad ones. There have been worse footballing performances, Sligo home to Vlaznia, an overspending Shels and Hibs Malta?
It could be that blessing in disguise for Derry as they either will take control of the title run in and a possible cup run with no more distractions, do or die or it leaves Higgins with absolutely no credit in the bank to keep the job.
Last year their domestic form was sketchy but went in to Europe and looked decent v KuPS and especially 2nd leg v Tobol they were expansive and unexpectedly dominated possession for good spells, attacked on the front foot when they were expect to play on the break and unlucky, losing on penalties. Looked like they had found a level of perormance that they could take in to the league again but nope. This year they are off 4 league wins on the spin, putting pressure on Shels and had the very winnable draw, but nope. People pass comments on sides having squads that would almost coach themselves and walk a league with all the quality and experience, not any more if ever really. Heart doesnt cut it alone and Higgins has missed something in the 1st leg whatever about being undone by a red card tonight.
Last edited by Nesta99; 18/07/2024 at 11:54 PM.
Higgins is very much in bother.... The fans are now really starting to get annoyed with his lack of tactical knowledge and his defensive mindset. He ruined the game in Extra time last night by changing the formation and giving up the midfield completely. His changes seemed very much a hit and hope effort.
We could be out of the cup come Sunday and then out of the league next week if we lose to Shels. Surely that would be the end of RH unless Phillip O'Doherty lets him see out the season then doesn't renew his contract.
This is a massive week in the life of Derry City once again and the start we have got off to is horrendous.
The details for Monday's draw are confirmed now. If Rovers beat Sparta Prague, they'll face the winners of one of the following ties in the third round -
PAOK v Borac Banja Luka
FCSB v Maccabi Tel Aviv
Ferencvaros v TNS
Lincoln Red Imps v Qarabag
Celje v Slovan Bratislava
Bodo/Glimt v RFS Riga
Actually Sparta Prague seem stronger than most of those. Though if we're honest it seems far more likely Rovers will be in the Europa League instead, where they'll face the losers of one of the following ties in the third round -
APOEL v Petrocub (Moldova)
PAOK v Borac Banja Luka
Celje v Slovan Bratislava
Ludogorets Razgrad v Dinamo Minsk
Panevezys v Jagellonia Bialystok
Santa Coloma v Midtjylland
That then has the mix of teams they should beat (Santa Coloma), they'd have a decent chance against (Panevezys, Petrocub) and really awkward ties you just want to keep away from (Borac Banja Luka, Dinamo Minsk, even Celje)
The third qualifying round Conference League draw is also on Monday but no pools available yet. Almost certain Shels won't need to worry about it, but wouldn't rule out Pat's getting past Vaduz, even if they probably won't be favourites.
No - part-time - they were established as a pub team (in Bruno's Bar) for £500 ten years ago.
Now - they have run up big debts in the past five years paying journeymen part-time Spanish players in their mid- to late-30s to fill out their squad in the hope of doing what they did to Derry. I gave a break down a couple of pages back.
But there is no way that any team from Gibraltar should be anything other than canon fodder for a LOI team in Europe (and Derry are currently the second best team in the LOI)
Tbf having watched the 2nd leg, they were cannon fodder, and Derry just found a way to lose it. Without the red I think they'd have won 5-0. Bruno's were absolutely shook when 2-0 down to 10 men, and Derry just ran out of steam I think. Very tough to press a team so hard for so long a man down. Add it to the litany of one's that got away in Europe sob stories.
Next week, I reckon at best Rovers draw the home leg and go out after a heavy away loss. I checked and Prague's top 4 goalscorers were at the Euro's so none of them have been playing in pre season. Their fitness will be questionable. A chance to catch them on the hop and keep the tie tight. Their season is just starting and they will also have a league game next weekend while Rovers will have the weekend free. Rovers are heavy underdogs, but any results they can pick up will help the coefficient. They'll lose in the end, and then it's all down to the luck of the draw in q3 of the Europa League.
I think Pat's will do Vaduz, but it will be very tight, Pat's having a few weeks free could help or hurt them, I hear they've won 2/3 friendlies while everyone else has been playing league/europe, and made some decent signings, hopefully the little break has given Kenny a chance to get a hold of the squad and make sense of what they're doing. Vaduz are wealthy and dangerous, but they're playing 2nd tier football and just coming out of pre season, will also have a mid week match next week while Pat's have it free. Lost last season's top scorer to a league rival. They're wildly inconsistent in Europe, some times good, sometimes awful, like our clubs I guess.
Shels are playing a good top tier Swiss side, so it'll be interesting to see the gulf between Zurich and Vaduz, if they get any sort of draw it'll all be gravy, but I doubt they have much of a chance. Did their job getting this far. In all honesty they'll probably be happy enough to take the cash and get a quick exit to concentrate on the league this time around. Might be a bit of a disaster next year if they do it, and are unseeded in the Champions league mind!
Best case scenario we have 2 clubs in the 3rd round, but Rovers should pick up a few results and drag us close to the top 33 spot by the end of qualifying you'd hope, I'm probably being overly optimistic on Pat's but time will tell.
Getting way ahead of myself but with things domestically being very interesting, if Waterford and Galway did find themselves in Europe and Shels won it, we could have 3/4 clubs unseeded in the first round next season, and could be a bit of a disasterOr would the leagues co efficient itself be high enough for Galway/Waterford to be seeded in ECL?
Last edited by Acornvilla; 19/07/2024 at 10:13 AM.
Shocking result for Derry. Surely the only way to salvage some sort of dignity from this is to sack Higgins.
Very odd that there were four-sendings off (all from LOI sides) in six ties. I think there were only two sendings-off in the entire recent Euros.
I think the fitness part can be over-done a bit - they're professional footballers and they won't have turned to blobs because they've had two weeks of a sun holiday. (I think it's different with a part-time club like Bruno's Magpies - pre-season can make a bigger difference there)
The bigger issue for Sparta is they'll still be gelling in new players and a new manager (though they've appointed their assistant, which should help with continuity). But they got to the last 16 of the Europa League last year - they were knocked out of the CL on penalties by Copenhagen, beat Dinamo Zagreb in the Europa playoffs, came out of a group with Rangers, Betis and Aris Limassol, beat Galatasaray in the first knock-out round and finally lost 11-2 to Liverpool. There's some serious results there, and it wasn't a one-off run. Rovers have a habit of being exposed by this sort of team. A home draw would be a great result. I don't see it happening though.
Pat's - Kenny is a good LoI manager and has European pedigree too, but I think this tie is maybe a year too soon. Their league form is still poor - two wins in nine since Kenny took over - and though Kenny is starting to change the squad around, that won't really help much with the game next week.
I think with the way the second round draw has gone, we'll be doing very well indeed to maintain our current position by the season's end.
Good point on Waterford/Galway - I think without any European history, they're going to be unseeded next year if they get there. But that doesn't matter as much as you'd think - Shels were unseeded this year, but could have faced Breidablik, Dudelange, Tre Penne, Crues or Joey's. Get a regular European qualifier from a poor league and that's as good as being seeded.
Last edited by pineapple stu; 19/07/2024 at 10:29 AM.
As far as I’m aware there is very little expectation on our tie next week. The league form says it all and the opposition will be far from mugs. Hopefully we are competitive that’s all that can be expected.
Bohs sacked Kenny around 2004 after going out in Europe to a better side Levadia Tallin.
#DundalkFC - First Irish club to win an away game in Europe (1963), only Irish club to win a game / points in Europa League Group Stage (2016).
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