QuoteThat's a bit dismissive. At that time it was only champions that played in Europe, so winning a couple of rounds was a decent achievement for LOI clubsOriginally Posted by A N Mouse
I know uefa are toying with inviting cubs that may not have otherwise qualified in a given year to take part in their competitions, but I'm not sure that extends to parachuting teams, that managed to win through a round of two near half a century or more ago, into the last 16.
That's a bit dismissive. At that time it was only champions that played in Europe, so winning a couple of rounds was a decent achievement for LOI clubs
The draw was also unseeded, so you could get - I don't know - the champions of the North and then the champions of Malta to reach the last 16.
That said, Rovers did get comprehensively knocked out twice en route to their last 16, and also had about an easy a draw as it's possible to imagine - so maybe it is fair to compare the two.
Linfield managed to make the European Cup quarter-finals in '67 for that very reason - beat the Luxembourg champions in round one, followed by the Norwegian champions in round two, at a time when those two leagues were on a par in terms of quality. Mind you, they only narrowly lost to CSKA Sofia in the last eight.
Its not a discussion on whether it is comparable, it is simply a fact that is in the record books. Do you think Real Madrid or Liverpool et al should stop including European Cup wins after the Champions league format started?
Do we exclude Derrys past achievements prior to being a new entity - I would say that it is a stronger argument to dismiss Derrys roll of hoour.
If Rovers are seeded for all qualifying rounds this summer, gives them a good chance of navigating through all qualifying rounds that as always are fraught with danger.
I think Shels will be at a seeding disadvantage. Getting through one CL qualifying round can make a big difference with the safety nets.
SK knows about setting teams up for Europe.
Strong chance this summer of at least two LoI clubs qualifying for the group stage.
https://foot.ie/forums/117-Kerry-FC
A Championship: 4 years - 8 first teams - 0 financially ruined. First Division '14: 7 first teams.
Opportunity lost for new clubs/regions to join the LoI family.
I was referring to the present/future, not the past. (Possible misuse of the word ‘ever’)
Since they've gotten rid of the preliminary round it has actually diluted the quality in the first round draw more than you'd think given it's only 4 teams. It means there's some really average sides who get bumped up to the seeded side of the draw by virtue of wining their league most season.
Shels fans would obviously prefer to be seeded but looking at the pots in last years competition they were relatively even except for the top and bottom few on each side.
Rovers will be seeded but I think they will still be up against it. They will likely need to win 2 ties against sides on Molde's general level. Doable but unlikely.
As always already looking forward to these first round draws and rounds of European fixtures.
Last edited by yurt; 22/02/2025 at 11:21 AM.
I wouldn't share your optimism about LOI teams getting into group stages. Shels, obviously, have the best chance,but that depends on getting past the 1st game.
Hard to know with pats and drogs chance s,but speaking as a Rovers fan I wouldn't be confident of Rovers negotiating the multiple rounds.
It certainly improves the profile of the league when there is a team in groups stages and I'd love to see all 4 in the groups - drogs in the groups would be great to see!
I'm not comparing anything. Whether deliberately or not you have misunderstood the original post, as SH has clarified.
If I were to ask - will you ever cop on?
Would you answer - 'I did once manage to cop on, but that was a long time ago' ?
I may well do! Maybe you need to be clearer as I was not the only one to percieve, delibrately or not a dismissiveness. Derrys roll of honour is still mostly ancient history and defunct bar 2 FAI Cups. Just another newco factual stat.
Correct, in 1979 Dundalk (in the European Cup - top competition obv as next was Uefa Cup, then ECWC), got to the last 16. Maybe 'only' Linfield in the Pre Lim, then Hibs of Malta, but Celtic (2-3 on agg) was def a last 16 game, as Celtic played Real Madrid after xmas in 1980 in the QF.
Read since that Linfield made latter rounds in Europe, but I still think the 1979/80 Dundalk side is the furthest a LOI has gone, last 16 and played in 3 rounds.
Rovers really unlucky last Thurs, esp winning the hardest leg, pens can go any way, so its tough pill to swallow, but they done brilliant to be fair in this extended campaign.
#DundalkFC - First Irish club to win an away game in Europe (1963), only Irish club to win a game / points in Europa League Group Stage (2016).
Are you really claiming Dundalk and Linfield as the only Irish teams to have played in the last sixteen of European competition?
And all because of the suggestion that this season's draw could possibly have been the kindest path to the preantepenultimate round for an Irish team for a while.
We know Irish teams played in the last sixteen before. We know it was 'easier' to get there, in the majority of cases they only had to progress one round to do so.
They are, aren't they?
Given there were only thirty something associations providing mostly one team to main competitions you only had to win through one round to be in last sixteen.
Fairly sure shams, bohs, drums, Waterford and Derry all progressed a round possibly before Dundalk managed it. Chances are they played in the last sixteen unless they were in the preliminary round.
Last edited by A N Mouse; 23/02/2025 at 9:31 AM. Reason: Fix autocorrect
I don't think they did tbh.
But they either did or they didn't. It should be easy enough to show another example if you have it. Otherwise you've no basis for saying "Are you really claiming Dundalk and Linfield as the only Irish teams to have played in the last sixteen of European competition?"
Edit - looking into it, Rovers reached the last 16 of the 66/67 Cup Winners' Cup after beating Spora Luxembourg. They then lost 4-3 to eventual winners Bayern in the lats 16. Waterford reached the last 16 of the 70/71 European Cup, beating Glentoran before losing 10-2 to Celtic. Cork Hibs reached the last 16 of the 72/73 Cup Winners' Cup beating Pezoporikos Larnaca before losing 3-0 to Schalke. Cork Celtic reached the last 16 of the 74/75 European Cup with a walkover against Omonia Nicosia before losing 7-1 to Ararat Yerevan. Bohs reached the last 16 of the 76/77 Cup Winners' Cup beating Esbjerg before losing 4-0 to Slask Wroclaw. Bohs reached the last 16 of the 78/79 European Cup, beating Omonia Nicosia before losing 6-0 to Dynamo Dresden - and the same year Rovers reached the last 16 of the Cup Winners' Cup beating APOEL before losing 6-1 to Banik Ostrava.
Dundalk were the first to reach the last 16 of a European competition by winning two ties (Linfield and Hibs of Malta) before losing to Celtic - technically the point oriel was making. Then Waterford reached the last 16 of the 80/81 Cup Winners' Cup, beating Omonia (again!) before losing 5-0 to eventual winners Dinamo Tbilisi. Dundalk reached the last 16 of the 81/82 Cup Winners' Cup, beating Fram Reykjavik before losing 2-1 to Spurs.
And that's it as far as I can see.
Though I think it's worth adding I don't think anyone claimed Dundalk/Linfield were the only teams to manage it? Just that Rovers' achievement this year wouldn't have been unique as Dundalk/Linfield had already managed it, which is true.
Last edited by pineapple stu; 23/02/2025 at 9:46 AM.
Thanks for the edit. You're missing, at least, drumcondra in 62/63? fairs cup. And Derry in 65/66 European cup, beat fk lynn, then lost (9-0) away to Anderlecht before withdrawing because, in a bit of foreshadowing, the ifa refused to allow them to play the home leg at the brandywell.
I mean the original statement from straighthistory was about the future and the likelyhood of getting to the last sixteen, with the again remaining unsaid. Someone chose to take exception to that, because in the past a team had made the last sixteen.
I'm paraphrasing here but apparently it was dismissive of that achievement or some such. And here in lies the problem. How do you compare eras?
If Dundalk getting through two rounds to get to the last sixteen is a pinnacle. And merely suggesting that a team might, in the modern era, once again get to the last sixteen is somehow dismissive. Then that's fecking hypocritical. The format changed before 1980 and the format has changed massively since.
I did miss Drums alright. And I was only looking at LoI sides.
But your original post was "I'm not sure that extends to parachuting teams, that managed to win through a round of two near half a century or more ago, into the last 16." I think they did get to the last 16.
You also said "Are you really claiming Dundalk and Linfield as the only Irish teams to have played in the last sixteen of European competition?" - but that was never claimed. And I don't know what you mean by "And merely suggesting that a team might, in the modern era, once again get to the last sixteen is somehow dismissive"?
I'm not sure why you're quite so aggressive about this. Rovers certainly played more European games this season than any other LoI side, and beat more teams. But they did have the distinct advantage of being able to be knocked out twice and still keep going. I don't think anyone is downplaying Rovers' achievement this season by noting that Lineifled reached the last 8 of the European Cup, or that others have reached the last 16 of Europe.
AN Mouse is talking out pf both sides of his mouth. I think most can see how 'conversation' panned out. Facts are established so done and dusted.
Jesus does every thread have to descend into this endless back and forth.
Well done to all our clubs in Europe, in a year when many new records were set. On to LOI in Europe 2025.
The End.
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