Rubbish

[Razors left peg]

Not sure about that, out and out wife threatening would score a lot more poorly in the Irish media than racial stereotyping. There's almost nothing worse that Lennon could have done in terms of his Irish job hopes, there would have been certain people marching on Abbotstown if they'd hired him. I wouldn't foresee anything like the same level of kickback if Sagnol was brought in.

So you're saying racism is acceptable in Ireland?

[Eirambler]

So you're saying racism is acceptable in Ireland?

Thousands took to the streets today in Ireland over the outcome of a court case involving a woman, and more power to them. But would they have have been out protesting if the victim had been a black man?

I don't see people taking to the streets about Sagnol, put it that way.

[Razors left peg]

Thousands took to the streets today in Ireland over the outcome of a court case involving a woman, and more power to them. But would they have have been out protesting if the victim had been a black man?

I don't see people taking to the streets about Sagnol, put it that way.

Thousands took to the streets today because of a disgusting judgment after a woman got the sh1t beaten out of her. That's not even on the same level as a football manager ffs.

[Eirambler]

I'm well aware of that. My question was whether they'd still have come out if the victim was a black male? And if the answer is no (hint: it is!) then that shows why Sagnol's appointment would most likely be viewed differently to Lennon's.

[pineapple stu]

Lots of people protested when George Nkencho was shot dead (in self-defence because he attacked a Garda with a large knife), but nobody at all protested when Mark Hennessy was shot dead (for fear he was about to kill his hostage, not knowing she was already dead of course)

That actually points to a different form of racism I guess, but it certainly answers your question in a different way to the way you think.

Seriously, what a silly comment

[Eirambler]

I'm not going to claim expertise on those cases but, from a quick Google, it appears that the crux of your argument is that nobody took to the streets in respect of the killing of an abductor and murderer! I don't think there's much point even responding further to that...

[osarusan]

Lots of people protested when George Nkencho was shot dead (in self-defence because he attacked a Garda with a large knife), but nobody at all protested when Mark Hennessy was shot dead (for fear he was about to kill his hostage, not knowing she was already dead of course)

That actually points to a different form of racism I guess, but it certainly answers your question in a different way to the way you think.

Seriously, what a silly comment

Hennessy was already widely known/suspected to be the abductor of Valdez when he was shot, which was after a heavily publicised standoff.

I don't think you can infer anything from the lack of protest.

[The Fly]

I'm well aware of that. My question was whether they'd still have come out if the victim was a black male? And if the answer is no (hint: it is!) then that shows why Sagnol's appointment would most likely be viewed differently to Lennon's.

They wouldn't have come out if the victim was male (and heterosexual) either so it's not exactly a gotcha moment.

In any case Sagnol's comments would be viewed differently to Lennon's...because they are different. The former's were suggestive, whilst the latter's were actually threatening.

[Razors left peg]

I'm well aware of that. My question was whether they'd still have come out if the victim was a black male? And if the answer is no (hint: it is!) then that shows why Sagnol's appointment would most likely be viewed differently to Lennon's.

If there was a similar outrageous judgment yes I do think there would be protests.

But do u know what, I'm done. I'm not going around in circles arguing with idiots who are comfortable with casual racism. This forum is just fcukin draining

[pineapple stu]

Hennessy was already widely known/suspected to be the abductor of Valdez when he was shot, which was after a heavily publicised standoff.

I don't think you can infer anything from the lack of protest.

Oh I'm not defending Hennessy at all. I agree with you there.

But Nkencho was also widely known to have threatened people with a large knife, assaulted a shop worker putting him in hospital, and then (the key point of course) lunged at a Garda with the knife while ignoring arrest. Yet there was protests defending him, and very different media coverage of the guy too.

I think it's reasonable to use that to argue against Eirambler's suggestion there'd have been no protests in the soldier case if the victim was a black male. There's no basis for his suggestion at all imo

[Jolly Red Giant]

I'm well aware of that. My question was whether they'd still have come out if the victim was a black male? And if the answer is no (hint: it is!) then that shows why Sagnol's appointment would most likely be viewed differently to Lennon's.

Here is the problem with your argument - if the perpetrator had been a black man, instead of a local white Irish soldier, he would have been given minimum of five years in jail. if a black man had been given a suspended sentence like Crotty then the far-right and the racists would have gone into overdrive and it is possible Limerick could have ended up with similar events like the Dublin riot a few months ago - but because it was a local white man it took action from socialist feminist activists to organise protests around the country.

[Jolly Red Giant]

I really do not want to rehash the George Nkencho case here - but it is important to correct some issues.

1. George Nkencho was suffering from mental health issues - and the cops were told this and were aware of it.
2. Nkencho did punch a shop worker in the face after a confrontation in a shop - it was after this that he produced a knife.
3. While walking from the shop to his home the cops had ample opportunity to contain Nkencho - they made no effort to do so.
4. When he arrived at his home, Nkencho was surrounded by six heavily armed police. His sister told the cops he was suffering a mental health crisis and pleaded with them to back away and give him some space - instead one cop forcefully shoved her back into the house. One of the cops then fired six shots at Nkencho hitting him five times. Importantly, the first shot hit Nkencho in the back (probably the fatal shot) and spun him around. He didn't lunge at the cops - it was the momentum from being hit by the shot that caused the motion - but the cop kept firing.
5. The shooting was indiscriminate - the cops claimed that they were worried he would get into the house and create a hostage situation - but three of the shots fired by the cop went into the hallway of the house where his sister and two other family members were standing screaming at the cops not to shoot him - narrowly missing the family members.
6. All of this occurred during the pandemic lockdown - there were few people in public while this incident unfolded.
7. It is highly likely that if George Nkencho was white the cops would not have opened fire on him. There are numerous examples before and after this shooting where white men armed with knives in more dangerous situations were contained and disarmed without any shots being fired and without any loss of life.

[Diggs246]

I think the part you state about the colour of his skin isnt correct. They shot anf killed a white guy down the country who also has well known mental health issues. It's wrong to assume a whitey wouldn't have been shot

[Jolly Red Giant]

I think the part you state about the colour of his skin isnt correct. They shot anf killed a white guy down the country who also has well known mental health issues. It's wrong to assume a whitey wouldn't have been shot

Completely different situation - in 2000 John Carthy was shot dead after he approached armed cops with a loaded shotgun that he pointed at the cops (after 35 hours of negotiations, and after he left the house and began walking towards the local town centre). Now it still wasn't necessary for the cops to kill Carthy but there are no similarities in the case (George Nkencho was killed 20 minutes after the first incident in the shop and was not threatening anyone at the time he was shot).

As I pointed out - there were several similar incidents before and after (some more serious) where the cops resolved the situation without anyone getting hurt.