Greece V Republic of Ireland - Friday, 16th June 2023 - Euro 2024 Qualifier

[Bielsa´s irish]

Ronan and Manning are not even in squad.... but you knew that!

I Said everyone Is avail, o dowda on the left too Good option AND mcgrath Is Good 4 the Eire

[texidub]

Ogbene being out for these games is a real sickener. And June internationals can be weird coming after the club season end. A win in Greece would be fantastic... I think a draw is most likely though, given our historical results (pre-Kenny included) in away games.

Hoping Johnston gets a run out against Gib at least, but wouldn't mind him getting 20-30 mins against Greece either. I'm usually optimistic/naive but am nervous going into these games.. it's make or break time for Kenny. Group could be over for us by this time next week (and Kenny likely pushed out) especially if we lose to Greece, or we could be in dreamland with the obvious team progress shown against France being maintained (wins against Greece and Gib). That's a lot to hang on two matches, but they are pivotal for the near term future of this team.

[tetsujin1979]

did some checking on away wins in European Championship qualifiers - the link for the goals below is worth watching if only for Niall Quinn's superb link up play

[Diggs246]

I know that stat is for the euros
But to be fair to MON he got us wins we could only dream of. I assume Austria were higher then us in the rank ing? Not to mention beating Italy in france

[tetsujin1979]

I know that stat is for the euros
But to be fair to MON he got us wins we could only dream of. I assume Austria were higher then us in the rank ing? Not to mention beating Italy in france

Yes, they were 30th, we were 33rd, it was our first away win against higher ranked opposition since beating Lithuania in September 1997, and Wales were 13th when we beat them in Cardiff, we were 34th
We have 12 competitive wins against higher ranked opposition ever, O'Neill has five of them (Germany, Bosnia, Italy, Austria, and Wales) and is the only manager to win more than one away from home.

[JR89]

I know that stat is for the euros
But to be fair to MON he got us wins we could only dream of. I assume Austria were higher then us in the rank ing? Not to mention beating Italy in france

Austria were and think it was our first big win away from home in qualifiers in 30 years. Same campaign we went away and beat Wales. We should have topped the group that campaign and think we were top at the mid way point but **** the bed at home losing to Serbia and drawing with Austria and Wales.

[tetsujin1979]

Austria were and think it was our first big win away from home in qualifiers in 30 years. Same campaign we went away and beat Wales. We should have topped the group that campaign and think we were top at the mid way point but **** the bed at home losing to Serbia and drawing with Austria and Wales.

i've edited my post above. The myth is that that Austria game was the first away win against decent opposition since beating Scotland in 1987, but it was Lithuania, who were 42nd, when we beat them in 1997, when we were ranked 55th.
Coleman's injury at home against Wales derailed that campaign. I'm convinced we would have topped that group with him in the side.

[pineapple stu]

We have 12 competitive wins against higher ranked opposition ever, O'Neill has five of them (Germany, Bosnia, Italy, Austria, and Wales) and is the only manager to win more than one away from home.

That's mad. I presume Jack has another chunk? Though we were very high-ranked for much of his time so hard to know. Scotland away in 87 of course. (But I guess not Bulgaria at home in the same campaign? They were higher seeds than us, but maybe not higher ranked when we met) England in Euro 88. Spain in Italia 90 qualifying surely? Italy in USA 94. (Hungary in Italia 90 qualifying would probably count for any other manager)

[sadloserkid]

That's mad. I presume Jack has another chunk? Though we were very high-ranked for much of his time so hard to know. Scotland away in 87 of course. (But I guess not Bulgaria at home in the same campaign? They were higher seeds than us, but maybe not higher ranked when we met) England in Euro 88. Spain in Italia 90 qualifying surely? Italy in USA 94. (Hungary in Italia 90 qualifying would probably count for any other manager)

From memory only I'm not sure how many Jack Charlton would have

We drew away to Hungary and Northern Ireland and lost in Spain in Italia 90 qualifying.

Drew with England and Poland for Euro 92.

Think we drew with Denmark and Spain in US 94 qualifiers.

Euro 96 we lost 3-0 in Portugal and was it 3-1 in Austria?

Edit: Just seen it wasn't just away games... or qualifiers. Ignore me.

[tetsujin1979]

That's mad. I presume Jack has another chunk? Though we were very high-ranked for much of his time so hard to know. Scotland away in 87 of course. (But I guess not Bulgaria at home in the same campaign? They were higher seeds than us, but maybe not higher ranked when we met) England in Euro 88. Spain in Italia 90 qualifying surely? Italy in USA 94. (Hungary in Italia 90 qualifying would probably count for any other manager)

Rankings weren't introduced by FIFA until 1993, so technically none of those count! Italy were the first higher ranked side beaten in a competitive international. Mick beat Lithuania, Croatia, Yugoslavia, and the Netherlands. Staunton beat Slovakia, the five games under O'Neill I mentioned above, and Kenny's win against Scotland last June makes the 12.

[pineapple stu]

Rankings weren't introduced by FIFA until 1993, so technically none of those count!

Ah! That would certainly explain it. Eloratings.net has retrospective rankings for all matches which would add the ones I thought, including Bulgaria in 1987 but not Hungary in 1989.

[Kingdom]

mcDonnell had a good piece on Kenny over the past 24 hours. Gives some insight into the Turkish camp. Seems no expense has been spared.
Suggests they've focussed on the best way to utilise Ev Ferguson, referring to the high line the Brighton wingers play which allows Ev to drop deeper when he feels like it. In that regard, with Ogbene's omission, I reckon Idah will start up front as he has shown that he's capable of holding up play, but also working the channels well to create space.

Mentions they've been playing a few high-intesity bursts of games vs the preferred Greek formation, and sort of suggests there might be a slight change to the formation to get the best vs the 433.

Notable mention for Smallbone and his immediate link-in tactically with Doherty.
It's inconceivable that Ferguson won't start - and he should - unlike the FR game where he couldn't not start, but probably shouldn't have.
Assuming Cullen & Molumby both will start....

----------- Bazunu
Doc -- Collins Egan OShea -- COD
-------- Molumby Cullen --------
--- Smallbone ------- Idah ------
------------ Ferguson ----------

[elatedscum]

mcDonnell had a good piece on Kenny over the past 24 hours.

was it online or in print? couldn't find it easily online

edit... nevermind: think i have it

[Kingdom]

https://m.independent.ie/sport/socce...554945057.html

[mark12345]

Ogbene being out for these games is a real sickener. And June internationals can be weird coming after the club season end. A win in Greece would be fantastic... I think a draw is most likely though, given our historical results (pre-Kenny included) in away games.

Hoping Johnston gets a run out against Gib at least, but wouldn't mind him getting 20-30 mins against Greece either. I'm usually optimistic/naive but am nervous going into these games.. it's make or break time for Kenny. Group could be over for us by this time next week (and Kenny likely pushed out) especially if we lose to Greece, or we could be in dreamland with the obvious team progress shown against France being maintained (wins against Greece and Gib). That's a lot to hang on two matches, but they are pivotal for the near term future of this team.

Johnson getting 20 - 30 minutes against Greece? Seriously? Johnson needs to start in Athens. He is a real threat to opponents. Johnson, Ogbene. Ferguson first names on the team sheet and work backwards from there.

[mark12345]

Johnson getting 20 - 30 minutes against Greece? Seriously? Johnson needs to start in Athens. He is a real threat to opponents. Johnson, Ogbene. Ferguson first names on the team sheet and work backwards from there.

Make that Obafemi, not Ogbene

[elatedscum]

Make that Obafemi, not Ogbene

I'd be very surprised if he starts both Johnstone and Obafemi along with Ferguson - probably a case of either or...

Bazunu/Travers/Kelleher

Doherty
O'Shea
Egan
Collins
O'Dowda/McClean

Cullen
Molumby
Smallbone/Knight

Ferguson
Obafemi/Idah/Johnstone/Parrott

[ontheotherhand]

mcDonnell had a good piece on Kenny over the past 24 hours. Gives some insight into the Turkish camp. Seems no expense has been spared.
Suggests they've focussed on the best way to utilise Ev Ferguson, referring to the high line the Brighton wingers play which allows Ev to drop deeper when he feels like it. In that regard, with Ogbene's omission, I reckon Idah will start up front as he has shown that he's capable of holding up play, but also working the channels well to create space.

Mentions they've been playing a few high-intesity bursts of games vs the preferred Greek formation, and sort of suggests there might be a slight change to the formation to get the best vs the 433.

Notable mention for Smallbone and his immediate link-in tactically with Doherty.
It's inconceivable that Ferguson won't start - and he should - unlike the FR game where he couldn't not start, but probably shouldn't have.
Assuming Cullen & Molumby both will start....

----------- Bazunu
Doc -- Collins Egan OShea -- COD
-------- Molumby Cullen --------
--- Smallbone ------- Idah ------
------------ Ferguson ----------

That's what I'd go with as well. It's going to be very hard for Doherty to last for 90, particularly if we are asking him to link up with Smallbone down that side but he's still the best option. I could see Kenny picking Knight over Smallbone to help win the midfield a bit more but I hope he's brave and puts out an 11 that can get the most out of Ferguson. I think Smallbone edges it in that respect.

Johnston will be useful off the bench v Greece and I'd start him against Gibraltar.

Hard to know what to expect in June games but it's the same for Greece. Maybe it helps that a few of our starters haven't played that much this season? Less match fit but less banged up? I think a draw would be a decent result for this team if not for qualification but I'm hopeful for a win.

[JR89]

Make that Obafemi, not Ogbene

So a two man midfield with three forwards away from home which has cost us results in the past?

Think it could be something like:

.............................Bazunu
Doherty -'Collins - Egan - O'Shea - McClean
....Knight - Molumby - Cullen - Johnston
............................Ferguson

Think Johnston will replace Ogbene from Marchs line up against France. Obviously won't be 5-4-1 like against France just easier to write it down that way. The midfield four would be a box formation with Johnston and Knight playing behind Ferguson.

Other than that Kenny will likely pair Obafemi and Ferguson up top with Molumby, Cullen, and Knight in midfield. Not sure how fit Idah will be having missed some training illness this camp.

[Razors left peg]

The team Kingers picked is the same as I had picked earlier in the week., but JR is right Idah has missed time this week and that might affect selection.

I think its gone under the radar a little that Johnston had been in pretty good form for his club towards the end of the season, he was starting every week and got in the Portugal League Team of the week on one occasion, so it is very possible that he starts against Greece.

It is very possible that we see the same type of formation as the France game with Johnston stepping into the Ogbene role.