Possibly posted in jest but this type of comment is unhelpful. Even though it is erroneous it undermines the credibility of the team & its image and is subverting in nature. Especially with the ongoing efforts to prevent Gibson from representing his country.Originally Posted by EalingGreen
You may well have made assumptions about Cian's family, but you will know the old saying about assume: When we "assume" we make an "ass" out of "u" and "me".
[Originally Posted by EalingGreen
"Whatever his heritage and his father's accomplishments, Cian was born in the England i.e. the footballing jurisdiction of the FA. Therefore, if he wishes to represent the ROI, this must surely be considered to be a "transfer" of nationality"]
Taking your last paragraph first, it was RiffRaff who opened this thread and he was under the impression that Chris H may have qualified for ROI on the basis of a grandparent. A couple of other early posters were similarly unsure.Possibly posted in jest but this type of comment is unhelpful. Even though it is erroneous it undermines the credibility of the team & its image and is subverting in nature. Especially with the ongoing efforts to prevent Gibson from representing his country.
You may well have made assumptions about Cian's family, but you will know the old saying about assume: When we "assume" we make an "ass" out of "u" and "me".
I did not make the error of taking RiffRaff's supposition at face value, rather, for the sake of argument, I merely posted that if it were so, then Cian almost certainly would not be eligible for ROI (so no "ass" about it, though your reading of my post could clearly be termed "asinine")
As for your first paragraph, that is pure horlicks. I am confident that my post was not erroneous (I can post the relevant FIFA statutes if you like), there was no attempt to "undermine" or "subvert" anything, and neither did I bring the (irrelevant) Gibson affair into the debate - quite the contrary in fact.
Were you really so incensed that someone like me might dare to ponder Cian's situation, that you failed to read my final paragraph of my post? To refresh, it was:
"P.S. I have absolutely nothing against Cian's right to represent the ROI should he want, since it doesn't in any way affect NI. It seems strange that someone can't represent the country his father did. Indeed, as a Spurs fan from Chris's playing days, I'd be more than happy to see Cian follow in his father's footsteps for both club and country."
Sadly, you appear to be another in the minority of posters on this Board who can't see the wood (football) for the trees (politics). Would it help your understanding of the issue had Cian H e.g. been born and brought up in France, and I were e.g. Swedish?
P.S. Did anyone else have a fleeting vision of David Brent dispensing one of his pearls of wisdom when they read PG's repetition of the tired old "When we assume etc"?
No, it was Joe Barry.
You are wrong because your assumption is wrong.
I have no interest in the politics. I come here to read about football, however recently I have increasingly been coming across your posts which do bring a general hostility to the Irish team to the table.Sadly, you appear to be another in the minority of posters on this Board who can't see the wood (football) for the trees (politics).
As I have said before you do have a habit of throwing in a subversive comment and then excusing yourself with some mitigating comment. In this instance that you "have absolutely nothing against Cian's right to represent the ROI should he want". No doubt he is grateful, but nonethess puzzled at your ill informed challenge to his legitimate right.
BTW as far as I am concerned you are very welcome here - you often make me smile. Not incensed at all.
That would be the same David Brent who has too much time on his hands and who endlessly philosophises on topics irrelevant to his colleagues. Funny that cos I think my first post concerning you was wondering how you had the time to contribute ad nauseam to the forum of a team you don't support.P.S. Did anyone else have a fleeting vision of David Brent dispensing one of his pearls of wisdom when they read PG's repetition of the tired old "When we assume etc"?
As for dispensing pearls of wisdom... I have heard Ealing is the best place for pompous, long-winded preaching.
I'm in a similar situation; I was born in the UK to an Irish father and moved to Ireland when I was 4. I've just had a kid in Spain and was told by the Embassy that although he is not automatically elegible due to me being born in the perfidious Albion, applying for citizenship shouldn't be a problem. The paperwork is a pain but I was thinking of trying to convince Stan that my young fella has the potential to be one of the hot prospects he seems so fond of and maybe get the application fast-trackedLimerick born mother. Ghanaian father. Met them both a few years ago. I know Chris well myself, and there's no doubting his Irishness.You've been ill advised. Neither myself nor Conchita were born in Ireland but our kids (three Irish born grandparents) are Irish citizens. Actually, your birth status means that you could not have picked up citizenship in any country because of your father's diplomatic work. I had to fork out about £35 each for a FBC, which takes around six months to processas it goes back to Dublin. Well worth it though, and unless there is a break in the generation, Irish citizenship is passed on indefinitely providing a FBC is purchased. This info is sadly not something in the public domain. It came as a shock for my first born, and only a contact at the Irish Embassy in London sorted this out within a day (so much for the six months etc.)
He's only a month old but he has the look of a midfield dynamo about him...
Greece 1 - 0 Germany
Socrates (89)
Post them!
This is the cooooooooooooolest footy forum I've ever seen!
No response yet.
This is the cooooooooooooolest footy forum I've ever seen!
http://www.fifa.com/documents/static...ransfer_EN.pdfNo response yet.
A player who, under the terms of Art. 15 of the Regulations Governing
the Application of the FIFA Statutes, is eligible to represent more
than one Association on account of his nationality, may play in an
international match for one of these Associations only if, in addition to
having the relevant nationality, he fulfils at least one of the following
conditions:
a) he was born on the territory of the relevant Association;
b ) his biological mother or biological father was born on the territory
of the relevant Association;
c) his grandmother or grandfather was born on the territory of the
relevant Association;
d) he has lived on the territory of the relevant Association for at least
two years without interruption.
Who's talking balls, now?
as usual, you are.
I
Cian played the first half at right back for Ireland against Holland last night. He was replaced by Derek Foran of St pats. Chris Hughton was in attendance and asked about his son, he said he was very proud to see him represent his country. Case closed...
54,321 sold - wws will never die - ***
---
New blog if anyone's interested - http://loihistory.wordpress.com/
LOI section on balls.ie - http://balls.ie/league-of-ireland/
Good coach that Chris Hughton.
SIGNATURESCOPE
Very highly thought of in british circles. read an interview with Aaron Lennon who said Hihton was the biggest influence on his career.
54,321 sold - wws will never die - ***
---
New blog if anyone's interested - http://loihistory.wordpress.com/
LOI section on balls.ie - http://balls.ie/league-of-ireland/
Probably our best qualified by some distance.
Kevin McDonald, Alan Kelly and Pat Devlin are good too though...
SIGNATURESCOPE
dreadful game
the dutch looked to a man physically stronger and bigger than their irish counterparts
its only a friendly though
Foran looks the real deal, plenty of foreign scouts sniffing around him
Haverty as well looks like the next John Giles
cant be long before these lads are starring on sky sports
I object to the continuous stereotyping of David Brent.The man was a prophet and a great dancer.
Once again, you are.
I presume you are quoting from Annex 2, article 1. This is a section on 'players representing more than one association that they are eligible for.' Here you are making a presumption about the status of a player's nationality. If someone has never had the nationality of another country then this law is irrelevent to a player who hasn't purposely picked up citizenship of the country he was born. Article 15/1 of FIFA regs that you previously posted on ourweeminds states: 'Any person holding the nationality of a country is eligible to play for the representative teams of the Association of his country. The executive committee shall decide on the conditions of eligibility for any Player who assumes a new nationality...'
Since 1981 Britain no longer slam dunks British nationality on you if you happen to be dropped at the transfer lounge of Heathrow. But the principle of automatic nationality was undermined as far ago as 1946 in the High Treason case of Crown Vs. William Joyce. Joyce, the infamous Lord Haw Haw, obtained himself a British passport despite being born in New York, and it was this choice that condemmned him to the gallows.
This is the cooooooooooooolest footy forum I've ever seen!
In your first para, you appear to be assuming that the extra criteria don't apply to Cian H since he "hasn't purposely picked up citizenship of the country [in] which he was born". Which is fair enough, except that those Brazilian-born players who wanted to play for Qatar had never themselves picked up citizenship from their own birthplace. So why were they excluded by FIFA from representing Qatar? Their citizenship and passport, obtained by naturalisation, were every bit as valid in international law as Cian H obtaining an Irish passport/citizenship.Once again, you are.
I presume you are quoting from Annex 2, article 1. This is a section on 'players representing more than one association that they are eligible for.' Here you are making a presumption about the status of a player's nationality. If someone has never had the nationality of another country then this law is irrelevent to a player who hasn't purposely picked up citizenship of the country he was born. Article 15/1 of FIFA regs that you previously posted on ourweeminds states: 'Any person holding the nationality of a country is eligible to play for the representative teams of the Association of his country. The executive committee shall decide on the conditions of eligibility for any Player who assumes a new nationality...'
Since 1981 Britain no longer slam dunks British nationality on you if you happen to be dropped at the transfer lounge of Heathrow. But the principle of automatic nationality was undermined as far ago as 1946 in the High Treason case of Crown Vs. William Joyce. Joyce, the infamous Lord Haw Haw, obtained himself a British passport despite being born in New York, and it was this choice that condemmned him to the gallows.
Unless, of course, they were considered by FIFA to have Brazilian nationality by birth and were "assuming a new nationality" when opting to represent Qatar, in which case the extra criteria clearly apply.
Whichever it is, Cian H's situation is not the same as e.g. Gibson/Kane/O'Connor, since they are relying on their having been born in "Ireland" as the basis for their eligibility for the FAI.
As for your second para, I don't know who you're trying to impress with your knowledge, but for the purposes of this thread/FIFA, it's irrelevant horlicks.
You need a new signature:
EALING GREEN SAYS NO - to anything associated with the Republic of Ireland.
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