Ukraine V Republic of Ireland - Tuesday, 14th June 2022 - 2022/23 UEFA Nations League

[ontheotherhand]

What more could kelleher have done? No errors which even when bazunu has played well he has fumbled an effort or mistimed something or raced out of goal at the wrong time . It would take alot more than 10 million to buy kelleher this summer.

Do you think 10m is what City value Bazunu at if they just offered him 45k a week to stay and are demanding a buy back clause if he gets the move he has requested?

[liamoo11]

Harsh. He actually put in a faultless performance. What do you expect him to do, score?

How is it harsh? He did solid. Made an expected save, and distribution pretty good. Dealt with everything put his way, but had nothing to do in the second half. So yes he did ok, what superlative are you expecting?

He remains 3rd choice for me, again how is this harsh? This isn’t an established keeper with 300 plus senior club appearances. He has minimal club experience and my strong preference is with keepers with more club experience in Bazunu and Travers, until we actually see Kelleher play senior football consistently. He showed a really poor error of judgement in last game and has looked unconvincing dealing with crosses in prior games…something no amount of training can prepare you for, you need to rough and tumble of senior football to gain those nuances.[/QUOTE]

What was the error of judgement against Scotland? That goal against Ukraine last week wasn't his fault it was the woeful defensive set up and a wonderful ball in

[tommy_c12000]

Ok, but he's a defender blaming defenders too.

He's shown where the defenders didn't do the job (including two of them falling over each other). He's shown Duffy reacting not to Kelleher, but to Hendrick. I think it's a very detailed and solid analysis.

Anyway, it's going off topic here, so I'll let it be

the goalie debate will rage on in September no doubt, when Bazunu comes back, and Travers starts promisingly on the premier league with Bournemouth (fingers crossed). It’s a great position for us to be in, arguing on which of our 3 talented keepers needs to start. If only we had something similar going on in our LWB position!

[liamoo11]

Do you think 10m is what City value Bazunu at if they just offered him 45k a week to stay and are demanding a buy back clause if he gets the move he has requested?

I think it's what tge market is willing to pay so like any commodity it's not what the seller values it at its what the market is prepared to pay so why aren't there 3 or 4 good level English and European clubs battling it out and pushing that fee higher?

[tommy_c12000]

To Liamoo: Sorry yes, Ukraine goal - 4 games in quick succession has overwhelmed my recall here, apologies! Not sure what’s going on with quote feature…

[tommy_c12000]

Why were the Ukrainians "tired".. like why emphasise that in your first line?

Apparently we played their "B" team last week.. and half those players were also rested on Saturday

Like, were they more tired than Josh Cullen? Or Nathan Collins?

Or was this our "B" team, seeing as we were missing Bazunu, Coleman, Egan, Duffy, Doherty, Obafemi.. all likely starters if available?

Why not give the team credit, for those who were there and did play?

Getting a draw away to Ukraine was probably the height of our expectations two weeks ago, and they delivered

Different mentality I guess. Depends on what you want to settle for.

In the coming months, we are on the cusp of having our best team in several years at our disposal. My critique is keeping the bigger picture in mind in the quest to qualify for the Euros playing football that we can be proud of. These games remain after all friendlies played in the off season, wrapped up with a bow by UEFA and sold as competitive games.

Sorry if I wasn’t blown away with the result or performance, but it was certainly a reasonable result and an improved performance for the past 2 games….as I stated. Ukraine looked pretty tired to me, and right after a devastating playoff loss…perfect time to play them.

[CSAD]

Do you think 10m is what City value Bazunu at if they just offered him 45k a week to stay and are demanding a buy back clause if he gets the move he has requested?

To be fair they are essentially paying 25M to get him back, if they sold him to Southampton without the clause and he did as well as we all hope and expect they might have needed to pay 50+ million for him considering his age and potential. If he turns out to be great I’m sure Man City can live with losing 25 million for him and if he ends up being average well they got a decent buck for him, either way it’s a deal that probably suits City down to the ground.

[ontheotherhand]

I think it's what tge market is willing to pay so like any commodity it's not what the seller values it at its what the market is prepared to pay so why aren't there 3 or 4 good level English and European clubs battling it out and pushing that fee higher?

A buy back clause makes the upfront fee smaller in any deal and in this case Bazunu seems to want to go where he will be first choice, City seem happy that if they are going to lose him they will have an easy route to getting him back and Southampton are getting a keeper for $10m who might net them $30m in a few years. There's been other clubs rumoured to be interested so I suppose someone might come in but this looks like good business for all parties

To be honest it's a bit odd that you brought up Bazunu when the comment you responded to didn't but if transfer value is how we should be picking keepers, how many offers have come in for Kelleher since he finally put himself in the shop window?

[tetsujin1979]

Bit of a random stat about McClean tonight

[Bielsa´s irish]

Can Collins play midfield? He scored a Lawrenson toda y!!!!

[Eirambler]

Definitely more good than bad overall and a point is a good outcome given how many players we were missing and how weak a team we had on the field by the end.

Kelleher was really solid again. Did enough for there to be a conversation to be had about who starts in goal in September. For me it's still Bazunu as things stand but by then we'll have seen how (and where) the three of them start the new season and go from there.

Collins was obviously exceptional, I think he'd be wasted at Burnley next season, hopefully he gets a move.

The other two centre backs were really solid also, Lenihan is a great backup option to have and O'Shea did well considering he has been struggling for form since his injury. A good pre season should have him back on track. With Egan and Omobamidele to come back as well there's definitely a question mark as to whether Duffy should continue to be a starter.

Wing backs weren't so great, Browne was obviously out of position and filling a hole. I wonder is that it now for Christie - if Kenny fancies a midfielder over him he'd be as well not to pick him again going forward and try someone like McNamara instead?

McClean was poor defensively again. He got done a few times against Scotland and wasn't punished but it happened again tonight and teams are going to target that area more and more. There's so few other options though, Stevens looked way off the pace and I'm not convinced by Manning - and it doesn't look like management are either. If someone like Adaramola got a run in the Palace first team he could find himself thrown in there very quickly, but realistically we'll have to make the best of it with McClean for another year at least.

Cullen was his usual 8 out of 10, rarely if ever has a bad game. It will be interesting to see where he plays his club football next season.

Molumby has taken Hendrick's spot now I think, he backed up the Scotland performance well tonight.

Knight remains one of our most important players, I have no idea how or why he was dropped against Armenia, it's that kind of decision that still gives me the fear about Kenny.

Parrott was good again and looks like a player that will win a lot of caps for us. His workrate and physical strength has come on massively this season.

Hogan did what you'd expect but looks well below Obafemi in terms of standard. Hopefully Obafemi and Idah are both available for September.

I don't think any of the subs added much and the teamsheet looked really weak by the end. But they did enough to keep it at 1-1 and we finished it out strongly enough, so I can't be too critical.


Probably the big concern now (other than that Kenny might repeat most of his mistakes yet again in September) is the left wing back spot. We really need another option there but I have no idea who in the short term. Longer term it's fingers crossed for Bagan and Adaramola I think, or for someone else unexpected to break through.

[Olé Olé]

Great post. Agree with all of your points.

I think Adaramola will be the man for left back, based on what I have seen of him and Bagan. I'm very unsure on Bagan. Strikes me as a player who would only ever be comfortable at wing back because he needs more space which is not a good indicator of quality for me. Adaramola is a tad young though.

The point about not starting Knight is absolutely spot on - such a silly decision give how well he had been going for us and Derby and what he offers us. Those are the kind if decisions that frustrate me. Similarly, if we had a full squad in September, it wouldn't surprise me to see Obafemi left out or Hendrick ahead of Molumby. Or he could even get the guilts about leaving Ogbene out and revert back to the 3. Hogan almost scored v Scotland, admittedly, but he reverted to his mean tonight which was in line with many peoples' expectations but obviously not Kenny's.

[geysir]

Bit of a random stat about McClean tonight

The important stat is he was poor tonight. But he carries himself well, handled the captaincy with aplomb, he would be ideal if he just had more football quality.

[geysir]

I think Molumby is up there in our most improved player category.

[nigel-harps1954]

Browne exposed at RWB, I would love to see Festy on in his place, less risk IMO given how badly Browne was caught out with simple ball over the top with no pace.

Festy was supposed to be there. Alan Browne still on unfortunately

Browne is disastrous

Hopefully Browne at RWB and McClean as a stop gap measure will cease to be during the September window as the talent continues to come through.

Festy should have replaced Browne at half time

Any opinions on Browne though?

[Insidetherock]

Different mentality I guess. Depends on what you want to settle for.

In the coming months, we are on the cusp of having our best team in several years at our disposal. My critique is keeping the bigger picture in mind in the quest to qualify for the Euros playing football that we can be proud of. These games remain after all friendlies played in the off season, wrapped up with a bow by UEFA and sold as competitive games.

Sorry if I wasn’t blown away with the result or performance, but it was certainly a reasonable result and an improved performance for the past 2 games….as I stated. Ukraine looked pretty tired to me, and right after a devastating playoff loss…perfect time to play them.

These games, are not friendlies. They're competitive games, with a hell of a lot at stake, and a lot of people haven't copped that since the NL started.

1. Had we won this group, we'd have been second seeds for Euro qualifying

2. If we finish bottom of the group, as one of the two worst teams, we end up as fourth seeds in Euro qualifying (so imperative we get at least 3 more points in September)

3. If we'd won the group, we'd be promoted to the A league in 24, and be guarenteed a 2nd seed in WC qualifying, with a chance of being a 1st if we finished in the top ten teams in the A path

4. The A path would guarantee we'd get 2-3 of Europes "big beasts" which would fill the Aviva and generate lots of publicity for Irish football (and sell lots of season tickets)

5. Finishing 2nd in the group, wouls practically guarantee at the very least a play off spot for the Euros if we don't directly qualify

So the games are very far from "friendlies"

[nigel-harps1954]

Still a good chance of finishing second, which would be a good enough return after a poor start. An outside chance of topping the group, with a mad set of results for Ukraine in the Autumn games. Stranger things have happened.

There'll be a lot of what-ifs about this group, but a positive couple of days to end the window at least. A comprehensive victory over Scotland and a competent draw away to a side ranked 20 places above us in the world rankings, with effectively our B side playing, is a big positive to take from it.

[Nesta99]

Is parrot going to turn into one of those really frustrating players

As frustrating as Robbie Keane I hope, for all his goals just wrecked the head at times. I still thin we are on an upward curve. Yes it was a bit LoI in Europe where so much good stuff is undone by one moment of implosion. Maybe its the difference between a top 20 ranked team and where we are in that there isnt the bated breath expectation of some sort of madness at any moment. We are going in the right direction, peaks and troughs for sure, but not the disrupt, nick a goal and hang on of previous management. We've seen Irish football decimated by incompetent governorship, lack of investment, the expensive quick fix and the cheap quick fix. Only thing not done is long term development and so far, starting from scratch its not the worst. Unless we happen to uncover the once in a generation world class player, we can only build an effective team unit.

Not saying people are calling for an end to SK's tenure tonight, but out of interest, if the FAI were to pull the plug, who do people see as another managerial option?

[Nesta99]

Collins was obviously exceptional, I think he'd be wasted at Burnley next season, hopefully he gets a move.

Cullen was his usual 8 out of 10, rarely if ever has a bad game. It will be interesting to see where he plays his club football next season.
.

With Vincent Company leaving Anderlecht for Burnley today it will be interesting to see what either player does especially Cullen. If Company rates him he could be on the move to the championship. Not that sure if it would be a move ye'd want as he is coming along nicely where he is.

[SkStu]

Is Robinson actually carrying a few extra pounds ?

definitely the thought crossed my mind as i was watching him lumbering around. Way off the pace and touch was also brutal at times.