i just cant accept that any manager of a professional team would accept responsibility for the equipment arrangements.Originally Posted by Fixer82
their skillset is management of the players and coaching not dealing with DHL.
Yeah, after they got stuffed in a game against Middlesboro he went on a rant and named several players he felt were underperforming, John O'Shea among them. It was a pre-record so never made it to air. I don't think he was let go on the spot, it took a few weeks, but his time as a United player was finished that day really.
Author of Never Felt Better (History, Film Reviews).
If memory serves Utd went on to have one of their most successful periods after that?
They won three leagues, a Champions League and two League cups in the next three and a half seasons. But for Barca becoming who they were at the time they might have had more in Europe. I wouldn't put Keane's departure as a huge part of that (I mean, Ronaldo came good for one thing!), but it was an element of a transition period when Ferguson was forming what would be his third great side. Keane was declining on the field, but by all accounts was as big a personality (you could say bully, but there's a fine line really) as ever on the training ground, and that was a problem I think. Keane has said Ferguson wasn't too torn up by his leaving, and there were plenty of options - Michael Carrick, Darren Fletcher, Anderson, etc - in line to fill that role, albeit none of them could ever claim to be as good as Keane at his peak.
Author of Never Felt Better (History, Film Reviews).
Keane's legs started to go around then. He was tried in centre half, not without success, but he certainly hastened his own departure by making trouble he was no longer worth. None of that bunch were as good as peak Keane (though people started to revise opinions of Carrick when they realised how hard he was to replace) but he wasn't that player any more either.
Last edited by John83; 11/05/2022 at 2:39 PM.
The current United squad could use someone like Keane in the dressing room calling them all out now.
They'd all just tell him to **** off I think.
If they don't listen to Ronaldo I don't think they'd listen to Keane. Ronaldo should be a hero to them and from what I can see they couldn't give a toss. That's a lost bunch.
Funny reading all the negative stuff about Keane though. I understand people might not forgive him for Saipan if they put the blame (wrongly!) at his door and I get why a Liverpool fan wouldn't like him but I don't know how anyone watching him play for Ireland, particularly in qualifying for that WC could hold such a negative view of him to be honest. You'd swear he wasn't one of the best midfielders and captains of his time as declared by some of the best players he played with and against. His character let him down here and there but it also raised him and those around him up.
It's a bit sad all around that his legacy was ruined for some by, in what is apparently not the average foot.ie opinion, a really badly managed situation on multiple fronts. I'd already had a pretty intense dislike of the FAI but after that WC I lost my interest in the national side altogether. It just didn't have the same attraction with Delaney taking headlines and the sour taste of Saipan left over. Gradually I've gotten back into it but it took almost 20 years!
For me it's not a black or white, for Ireland Keane was the epitome of a midfield general plus team leader yet at the same time I totally take issue with his issues in Saipan. Imo for some contrary reason he didn't want to be there right from the beginning of the trip, fine then take responsibility for that state of mind instead of railing against the world for being at fault. That game against Spain, still the feeling lingers that we were more than a match against them and left a great opportunity behind on the pitch.
I don't think anyone doubts Keane was a great player.
I'm not sure though if Saipan is as standalone an incident as you suggest. From the 92 row to that infamous handshake after the Dutch win, Saipan seems more like the spark that set things off rather than an isolated incident of Keane sticking up for his squad and their facilities.
That's definitely Keane's fault, even if you can for sure criticise other parties for their contributions (especially the FAI)
Keane also suggested bringing a fitness expert into the Irish squad to prepare for WC. Forget his name but he was the man who made United the fittest team around. McCarthy didn't agree he should be brought in.
Folding my way into the big money!!!
Mick Clegg was the guy Keane wanted to bring in
Question. Was Keane's attack on McCarthy rasist? ( or the like)
It went some like.
"You some how ended up managing my country you English c""t"
Mick Clegg probably, he's a name that crops up in a lot of players memories of that period. I read somewhere that he was credited with turning Ronaldo into, well, Ronaldo. I never knew Keane wanted him in Saipan/Japan. But how much could he have done in a few weeks?
Author of Never Felt Better (History, Film Reviews).
Yes and I wonder how the other English born players in the squad would have taken that comment from their so-called leader and captain. Presume at some level he had similar views about McAteer, Reid, Breen, Morrison Kilbane, Connolly and Kelly.
That only came out this year - https://www.independent.ie/sport/soc...-41473447.html
Unfortuantely, the article is behind a paywall
There was something in his first autobiography about that, something like "I thought the lads who weren't born in Ireland didn't try as hard". Alan McLoughlin was another one named in the book, but that was Dunphy putting his name in. Keane apologised to McLoughlin in person for that.
Would really like to see some evidence something along these lines was said. I don't believe it was.
A row and a handshake tho stu? If most players and managers went back over their career (particularly in their era) there would be similar events. Quinn's account of the Boston row doesn't paint McCarthy in the greatest light either (targeting the youngest player when half the team were on the ****) so I wouldn't be putting too much weight on it other than to say they didn't get on and it went back a fair way.
McCarthy should have been able to manage around that to get his best player going and he failed to do so. If anything he antagonized Keane.
Is Keane blameless? No. But I see why he was fuming about Saipan more than I see why McCarthy made the decisions he did to manage to situation. I still just don't understand calling that team meeting and slapping the newspaper on the table. What did he think was going to happen? David Brent would have done a better job.
But ultimately I still blame the FAI more than anyone.
Probably time to call it ~ ~ Sigh-Pain !
Yeah let's move on to Thierry Henry.
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