Attendances 2022

[EalingGreen]

OK - I'll bite

So which Belfast clubs do you think are anywhere near well supported, given the size of the city (and the fact that football is by-far the number one sport there) ?

OK, for the sake of argument, I'll accept your claim that Belfast's 4 senior clubs "aren't anywhere near well supported"

What does that say for Dublin's 5 clubs i.e. four times the population (wealthier as well) and none of the sectarian/political problems, but only twice as many fans?

Btw, none of the above is an attempt to have a pop at LOI clubs - imo recent attendances have been very impressive.

[EatYerGreens]

OK, for the sake of argument, I'll accept your claim that Belfast's 4 senior clubs "aren't anywhere near well supported"

What does that say for Dublin's 5 clubs i.e. four times the population (wealthier as well) and none of the sectarian/political problems, but only twice as many fans?

Btw, none of the above is an attempt to have a pop at LOI clubs - imo recent attendances have been very impressive.

I note that you aren't actually accepting that Belfast clubs have poor support. You're still labelling it as a "claim" and dismissing it here by dragging the discussion onto Dublin instead. So iis it just my claim ? Which Belfast clubs do you think have good support ?

Dublin has one fairly well-supported club (Rovers). The rest are averagely so, and UCD have shockingly poor support. Anyone with eyes can see this. I can't believe I'm having to spell it out. And well done for yet again doing the whole "But Dublin" nordy whatabouttery thing

We can get into football not being anywhere near as dominant in Dublin as it is in Belfast now if you want ?

[EalingGreen]

I note that you aren't actually accepting that Belfast clubs have poor support. You're still labelling it as a "claim" and dismissing it here by dragging the discussion onto Dublin instead. So iis it just my claim ? Which Belfast clubs do you think have good support ?

Dublin has one fairly well-supported club (Rovers). The rest are averagely so, and UCD have shockingly poor support. Anyone with eyes can see this. I can't believe I'm having to spell it out. And well done for yet again doing the whole "But Dublin" nordy whatabouttery thing

You were the one having a pop at IL crowds in Belfast. But by any metric, if Belfasr xrowds are poor, then Duiblin crowds are at least as poor, if not more so. (i.e. 4 x times the population, but only 2 x times the crowds)

Yet I don't hear you deriding those crowds similarly.

Anyhow, I think that all things considered, IL crowds aren't that bad, at least since they've been improving recently.

We can get into football not being anywhere near as dominant in Dublin as it is in Belfast now if you want ?

People are quite capable of following more than one sport. And do.

And in any case, "support" amounts to more than just attending your local pro- or semi-pro team once or twice a fortnight.

For example, a little place like NI being able to (ahem)... support 24 teams at Senior level, with over 100 Intermediate clubs below in tiers 3 -7, and 100's more Junior clubs beneath that, must count for something when you add up the number of players, coaches, officials, referees, administrators. and volunteers etc needed to sustain that.

Which is not to have a pop at football in ROI which lacks such a system - every country does things its own way - but it should count for somethung.

Even if it is getting miles away from the subject.

Sorry everyone else.

[2 Year Contract]

Not sure what the safe capacity of Dalymount is these days but it must’ve been close to if not sold out tonight. Away end was sold out and not many empty seats in the Jodi (until half of them decided to leave en masse after the third goal that is )

[Shinkicker]

Not being funny but i find it hard to equate getting great support from groups in the community and supporters clubs with people not coming to matches.
Rovers get great support from groups in the community and supporters clubs as well but by definition this is made up of a small % of the match going fans.
Its hard enough to get lads who go to matches to do anything for the club let alone those people who dont

Do any of the community groups or supporters clubs contribute to Rovers players WAGES? I won't name names but a player for one club in NI had his wages paid by the local supporters. The football club simply couldn't afford them they only paid his goal and win bonuses. At the time they were successful and he was a scoring machine and they complained about the money they were forking out. The supporters clubs have their own premises and have bars and are very successful. Most clubs now have sugar daddies but I do believe the supporters clubs still contribute. I can be corrrected if I'm wrong.

[sbgawa]

Do any of the community groups or supporters clubs contribute to Rovers players WAGES? I won't name names but a player for one club in NI had his wages paid by the local supporters. The football club simply couldn't afford them they only paid his goal and win bonuses. At the time they were successful and he was a scoring machine and they complained about the money they were forking out. The supporters clubs have their own premises and have bars and are very successful. Most clubs now have sugar daddies but I do believe the supporters clubs still contribute. I can be corrrected if I'm wrong.

The members (roughly 600 total) who are all season ticket holders pay 600 per year to the club on top of (in a lot of cases ) buying a season ticket so they have bee paying the wages for years particularly when times were tough.
A lot of the sponsors (particularly the smaller ones) are local businesses that have been with Rovers for years and their support isnt really based on any particular business logic as such so yes to your question.
I'm always amazed when talking down the years (more so to people outside the LOI community) at peoples impressions of LOI clubs, people generally believe that the clubs are reasonably sized businesses with loads of full time employees when the truth is if you took the players and coaches out i don't think most clubs would have an average of 2 or 3 full time employees
All pur clubs are micro businesses that need support from volunteers/supporters to operate

[EalingGreen]

Do any of the community groups or supporters clubs contribute to Rovers players WAGES? I won't name names but a player for one club in NI had his wages paid by the local supporters. The football club simply couldn't afford them they only paid his goal and win bonuses. At the time they were successful and he was a scoring machine and they complained about the money they were forking out. The supporters clubs have their own premises and have bars and are very successful. Most clubs now have sugar daddies but I do believe the supporters clubs still contribute. I can be corrrected if I'm wrong.

You doubtless know more about this than I do (out-of-touch on a lot of this stuff). But I do know that eg Harland & Wolff Welders have a very successful Social Club, which I assume has contributed towards their terrific new stadium.
(See posts #17 and #19 in the "Grounds in Belfast" thread: https://foot.ie/threads/206329-grounds-in-belfast

And I think I am right in saying that many more IL clubs own their own grounds than LOI clubs. Meaning that many of these have a social club/bar on the premises, which brings in revenue (hardly unknown for supporters to spend the second half in the bar, rather than return to the terraces!).

I do know that even smaller clubs like Dungannon Swifts and Ballinamallard are very well set up in this respect.

[brendy_éire]

You doubtless know more about this than I do (out-of-touch on a lot of this stuff). But I do know that eg Harland & Wolff Welders have a very successful Social Club, which I assume has contributed towards their terrific new stadium.
(See posts #17 and #19 in the "Grounds in Belfast" thread: https://foot.ie/threads/206329-grounds-in-belfast

And I think I am right in saying that many more IL clubs own their own grounds than LOI clubs. Meaning that many of these have a social club/bar on the premises, which brings in revenue (hardly unknown for supporters to spend the second half in the bar, rather than return to the terraces!).

I do know that even smaller clubs like Dungannon Swifts and Ballinamallard are very well set up in this respect.

Would be higher proportion of IL clubs who own their ground, yes. Though thinking of it, none of 'main' clubs in Derry own their ground, for whatever reason.
Mentioning successful social clubs, Donegal Celtic are more successful as a social club than a football club, TBH. It's a huge set-up they have, and there'll be more people in the club than than in the ground during matches.

[Calcio Jack]

For last nights match Pats were provided with an away allocation of over 800 tickets by Bohs

For our match earlier this season we received an allocation of 850 tickets ( all taken) .

For this Friday’s match Bohs offered 358 tickets to us. Despite a FAI intervention only a small increase was offered by Bohs.

I’m trying to be fair open/ minded but this smacks of pathetic behavior by Bohs with the added irony of the clear distasteful discrimination whereby Rovers fans are being clearly being targeted (we get offered less than half the allocation given to other clubs).

In addition I’m surprised they can turn down approx €6k in gate receipts , so can any Bohs fan explain ( in a rational manner ) why ?

[EalingGreen]

Would be higher proportion of IL clubs who own their ground, yes. Though thinking of it, none of 'main' clubs in Derry own their ground, for whatever reason.

Re Derry, Institute are only homeless due to exceptional circumstances, though they are hopeful of building something on the Waterside to replace the Riverside:
https://www.derryjournal.com/sport/f...r-club-3726550

Assuming this comes off, it will need the assistance of the local Council and tbf, they do seem to be very supportive, in the same way as they have supported DCFC. This is a bit like Ballymena U, where the local Council owns the Showgrounds and keep it in pretty good nick.

I guess it proves that it need not be such a problem being a tenant, so long as there is a benevolent owner (Shams and Tallaght?).

[Shinkicker]

You doubtless know more about this than I do (out-of-touch on a lot of this stuff). But I do know that eg Harland & Wolff Welders have a very successful Social Club, which I assume has contributed towards their terrific new stadium.
(See posts #17 and #19 in the "Grounds in Belfast" thread: https://foot.ie/threads/206329-grounds-in-belfast

And I think I am right in saying that many more IL clubs own their own grounds than LOI clubs. Meaning that many of these have a social club/bar on the premises, which brings in revenue (hardly unknown for supporters to spend the second half in the bar, rather than return to the terraces!).

I do know that even smaller clubs like Dungannon Swifts and Ballinamallard are very well set up in this respect.

Believe it or not the welders didn't contribute or if they did it was a tiny amount. Belfast City Council transformed and up graded the old Blanchflower stadium. The welders leased their current ground from a developer and to be honest the pitch is not great and over the years has sunk in places and the changing rooms are very dated. As far as I know the developer wanted the land back to build on Or the lease was up Or a combination of both. However the welders are getting the new pitch and stadium provided mainly by the council. Although the welders have a hugely supported social club they don't get very many at their games. I can't say 2 men and a dog because the wordy police pulled me earlier today on this forum. But in the background they are supported very well financially. The bar at the pitch is tiny only holds about 50 people. After games there is just about room for the 2 teams to get a drink and watch the scores on an awkwardly placed TV. The social is on up the road. Ballyclare comrades also had a massive social club who supported the club but a few years back they seperated and now the football end is struggling. They may have resolved the issue now. I would assume most clubs own their grounds and therefore have social clubs. To play in the Northern Amateur League Premier, 1A, 1B and 1C you must have access to a private ground therefore most have social clubs too. It's the same with Mid Ulster League Intermediate A & B. Look up Crewe United on the Web they play in the mid ulster league and Crumlin United in the Amatuer league. Both have social clubs. Both are village teams about 10 miles from Belfast and have great a set up each. The social at Crumlin has 6 X 60 inch TV's and a 100 inch screen for watching football and has great craic. However both of these clubs compete heavily against the garlic clubs for players. The mallards and the Swifts would have started like Crumlin and Crewe a long time ago and progressed to where they are now. I'm not sure where their finances would come from. Crewe United and Crumlin United have 2 of the best playing surfaces in NI. A lot of NIPL teams like to play Crumlin in Preseason because its probably the biggest pitch in the Province.

[Shinkicker]

Re Derry, Institute are only homeless due to exceptional circumstances, though they are hopeful of building something on the Waterside to replace the Riverside:
https://www.derryjournal.com/sport/f...r-club-3726550

Assuming this comes off, it will need the assistance of the local Council and tbf, they do seem to be very supportive, in the same way as they have supported DCFC. This is a bit like Ballymena U, where the local Council owns the Showgrounds and keep it in pretty good nick.

I guess it proves that it need not be such a problem being a tenant, so long as there is a benevolent owner (Shams and Tallaght?).

The Ballymena showgrounds is a brilliant set up, edge of the town, fresh clean facilities, good pitch and ample parking.

[EatYerGreens]

For last nights match Pats were provided with an away allocation of over 800 tickets by Bohs

For our match earlier this season we received an allocation of 850 tickets ( all taken) .

For this Friday’s match Bohs offered 358 tickets to us. Despite a FAI intervention only a small increase was offered by Bohs.

I’m trying to be fair open/ minded but this smacks of pathetic behavior by Bohs with the added irony of the clear distasteful discrimination whereby Rovers fans are being clearly being targeted (we get offered less than half the allocation given to other clubs).

In addition I’m surprised they can turn down approx €6k in gate receipts , so can any Bohs fan explain ( in a rational manner ) why ?

Presumably they'll sell the same number of tickets whether they give more to Rovers supporters or to their own fans, so there wouldn't (or at least shouldn't) be any income foregone from this ? It might even make them a few bob more, as presumably the larger the Rovers' support then the greater the requirements re segregation etc (?)

[Shinkicker]

Would be higher proportion of IL clubs who own their ground, yes. Though thinking of it, none of 'main' clubs in Derry own their ground, for whatever reason.
Mentioning successful social clubs, Donegal Celtic are more successful as a social club than a football club, TBH. It's a huge set-up they have, and there'll be more people in the club than than in the ground during matches.

I played for Donegal Celtic when the social club supported the football club and they were both successful. There was a dispute of some sort and the social stopped the financial support and within 18 months DC were playing in the Ballymena and Provincial League.

[EatYerGreens]

Believe it or not the welders didn't contribute or if they did it was a tiny amount. Belfast City Council transformed and up graded the old Blanchflower stadium. The welders leased their current ground from a developer and to be honest the pitch is not great and over the years has sunk in places and the changing rooms are very dated. As far as I know the developer wanted the land back to build on Or the lease was up Or a combination of both. However the welders are getting the new pitch and stadium provided mainly by the council. Although the welders have a hugely supported social club they don't get very many at their games. I can't say 2 men and a dog because the wordy police pulled me earlier today on this forum. But in the background they are supported very well financially. The bar at the pitch is tiny only holds about 50 people. After games there is just about room for the 2 teams to get a drink and watch the scores on an awkwardly placed TV. The social is on up the road. Ballyclare comrades also had a massive social club who supported the club but a few years back they seperated and now the football end is struggling. They may have resolved the issue now. I would assume most clubs own their grounds and therefore have social clubs. To play in the Northern Amateur League Premier, 1A, 1B and 1C you must have access to a private ground therefore most have social clubs too. It's the same with Mid Ulster League Intermediate A & B. Look up Crewe United on the Web they play in the mid ulster league and Crumlin United in the Amatuer league. Both have social clubs. Both are village teams about 10 miles from Belfast and have great a set up each. The social at Crumlin has 6 X 60 inch TV's and a 100 inch screen for watching football and has great craic. However both of these clubs compete heavily against the garlic clubs for players. The mallards and the Swifts would have started like Crumlin and Crewe a long time ago and progressed to where they are now. I'm not sure where their finances would come from. Crewe United and Crumlin United have 2 of the best playing surfaces in NI. A lot of NIPL teams like to play Crumlin in Preseason because its probably the biggest pitch in the Province.

Someone is trying too hard now to show what they know about football up north

Welders do indeed get the proverbial 'two men and a dog' attendance (unlike Newry, which you still seem to struggle to accept).

I'm not sure if it's the wording of your post again, but you seem a bit confused about the Welders though ? Blanchflower Stadium isn't the same place as Tillysburn Park, where they played before (though both are very close). Their new stadium has only been open for 10mths, so I'm not sure how you can say that "over the years" the pitch has sunk and the changing rooms have become very dated ? It's all literally brand new.

[EatYerGreens]

The Ballymena showgrounds is a brilliant set up, edge of the town, fresh clean facilities, good pitch and ample parking.

The banger track around the edge of the pitch is a downside though, as it pushes supporters away from the pitch. The pitch used to also get knarled up in places by the stock cars, but that seems to have stopped in recent years (maybe the cars have stopped?). It is definitely a good stadium overall.

[Calcio Jack]

Presumably they'll sell the same number of tickets whether they give more to Rovers supporters or to their own fans, so there wouldn't (or at least shouldn't) be any income foregone from this ? It might even make them a few bob more, as presumably the larger the Rovers' support then the greater the requirements re segregation etc (?)

As we gave Bohs 1,000 tickets for last match in Tallaght and Bohs gave us 850 for previous match in Dayler…. The convention is to reciprocate but Bohs have decided not to do that….plus the FAI asked them to increase the allocation; so smacks of pettiness unless someone has a rational explanation?

[Shinkicker]

But Dublin !!



Yet Linfield will get 5-8,000 at a Boxing Day derby match against Glentoran when both teams are being competitive. Which again proves the point about the insular mindset in some quarters in the north. Being kings of a very small castle or top dog in Belfast is of greater public interest than making a genuine mark on the European stage. Our wee minds in Our Wee Country.

The Boxing day games are all set up where possible as Derby games, Linfield v Glen's, c/vill v cruces, ballymena v Coleraine, Portadown v glenavon and Carrick v larne. This is to avoid travelling and get people out to watch. 2 other big games that are well supported by neutrals are the STEELE and SONS final on Christmas day and the Border Regiment usually on the 27th.

[EatYerGreens]

As we gave Bohs 1,000 tickets for last match in Tallaght and Bohs gave us 850 for previous match in Dayler…. The convention is to reciprocate but Bohs have decided not to do that….plus the FAI asked them to increase the allocation; so smacks of pettiness unless someone has a rational explanation?

I absolutely get all of that, and it is petty by Bohs unless there is a genuine reason. I'm just refuting the claim that it would cost them money.

[Shinkicker]

Someone is trying too hard now to show what they know about football up north

Welders do indeed get the proverbial 'two men and a dog' attendance (unlike Newry, which you still seem to struggle to accept).

I'm not sure if it's the wording of your post again, but you seem a bit confused about the Welders though ? Blanchflower Stadium isn't the same place as Tillysburn Park, where they played before (though both are very close). Their new stadium has only been open for 10mths, so I'm not sure how you can say that "over the years" the pitch has sunk and the changing rooms have become very dated ? It's all literally brand new.

Sorry constable!! , I moved to Spain 15 months ago and didn't know the welders had moved in to the new stadium. Re: the sinking pitch and dated facilities I was refering to their previous home ground and facilities.