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Thread: LOI in Europe 2022

  1. #561
    Seasoned Pro legendz's Avatar
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    The SPFL has revenue of over £30m a year. While the FAI can be a partner on administration side, should the league be self sustainable?
    https://foot.ie/forums/117-Kerry-FC
    A Championship: 4 years - 8 first teams - 0 financially ruined. First Division '14: 7 first teams.
    Opportunity lost for new clubs/regions to join the LoI family.

  2. #562
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    Dinamo Zagreb/Shkupi for Rovers if they get by Ludogorets

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    Quote Originally Posted by legendz View Post
    The SPFL has revenue of over £30m a year. While the FAI can be a partner on administration side, should the league be self sustainable?
    Not exactly a fair comparison, however, when much of that is generated by the Old Firm, probably better to look at the Nordic and Baltic divisions.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Asterix View Post
    Dinamo Zagreb/Shkupi for Rovers if they get by Ludogorets
    Same draw for the europa league.

  5. #565
    Biased against YOUR club pineapple stu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Asterix View Post
    Same draw for the europa league.
    So what - the winners play the winners and the losers play the losers?

    That's a bit of a coincidence. Also a great draw as Shkupi scraped past a Gibraltar team (won 3-0 at home and lost 2-0 away), so a great chance of straight into the Conference League at worst.

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    Seasoned Pro EalingGreen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EatYerGreens View Post
    I'd disagree. Those sorts of prices make sense if you take the British game as your cue. But not if you look elsewhere in Europe. German football in particular is very reasonably priced, despite being the richest country in Europe and one of its best leagues. The absence of greedy international owners there plays no small part in that fact.
    As you will know, the "absence of greedy international owners", or even greedy German ones, is down to the Bundesliga's requirement that fans should hold at least 50% of shares in each club (though RB Leipzig and one or two others have got round this somehow). Which is precisely why admission prices are so low.

    But the downside to this is that with the exception of Bayern Munich aka "FC Hollywood", lack of outside investment in, and commercialisation of, German clubs has meant they are increasingly unable to compete at a European level, esp with English* football, while becoming a one-club league.


    * - Today's Top Trivia: Stoke City FC, whose locally-born owners are billionaires, have not increased admission prices for 14 seasons!

    Quote Originally Posted by EatYerGreens View Post
    We won't build a football industry in Ireland by shaking down the small existing number of fans for more money. Only by expanding that fanbase, and the FAI putting more prize money into the game, will it grow. And increaisng prices would make it harder to achieve supporter growth.
    Obviously if you deter fans by pitching admission prices beyond the level they will pay, then it becomes counter-productive.

    As against that, with LOI clubs being so dependant upon gate receipts as a percentage of their overall revenues, then the need to maximise income from that source is ever more important. And while football's roots lie in the working classes, and there is a cost of living crisis just now, nonetheless ROI is a pretty wealthy country overall, meaning clubs should not sell themselves short when seeking their share of that wealth.

    Its a delicate balance.

    Quote Originally Posted by EatYerGreens View Post
    I think the future for the LOI is actually in being the antithesis of the English/British game. Community-owned and rooted clubs charging reasonable prices for tickets and shirts, vs the bloated global greed machines of English football. We'll never be like them no matter how hard we try, so better off taking a completely different direction in order to fashion our own strong identity.
    Too right, for as someone once pointed out, David didn't defeat Goliath by challenging him to a wrestling match, he had to find a different way.

    Meaning that LOI football has to emphasise its own partuicular attractions, including localism and community etc Same for the NIFL.

  7. #567
    International Prospect sbgawa's Avatar
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    You.d have to imagine the 2 nil loss away was a function of over confidence after a 3 nil home win (which Rovers didnt fall victim too).
    Still any team capable of losing 2 nil in Gibraltar is a team we have a shout against.

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    Seasoned Pro EalingGreen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by culloty82 View Post
    Not exactly a fair comparison, however, when much of that is generated by the Old Firm, probably better to look at the Nordic and Baltic divisions.
    Obviously you can't underestimate the huge influence of the OF, but even if you took them right out of the equation, with clubs like Aberdeen, Hibs, Hearts and the two Dundees etc, Scottish football is still "bigger" than ROI football.

    Whereas by contrast, in the absence of Cardiff, Swansea, Wrexham and Newport, Welsh domestic football is clearly much "smaller" than in the ROI, even NI.

  9. #569
    Biased against YOUR club pineapple stu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sbgawa View Post
    Still any team capable of losing 2 nil in Gibraltar is a team we have a shout against.
    Certainly given ye could have been drawn against the losers of Qarabag/FC Zurich, or Ferencvaros/Slovan Bratislava, or Maccabi Haifa/Olympiakos, it's a great tie. Easily the one you'd have hand-picked. Plus North Macedonia is actually a really nice spot if anyone's making the trip. Cheap as chips too. Get a pint in the Irish Bar in the centre of Skopje for less than €2

  10. #570
    International Prospect Nesta99's Avatar
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    Its not impossible that Rovers could beat Ludogorets, and if they do the next round is not impossible either. Depends on how Bradley sets things up and really its a free hit for all with being able to parachute to the next tiers of competition, so go all out rather than play to contain!

  11. #571
    Biased against YOUR club pineapple stu's Avatar
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    Sparta Prague or Viking for Sligo.

    CSKA Sofia or Makedonija Skopje for Pat's.

    Obviously if either of them get through. Away first both times.

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    Quote Originally Posted by pineapple stu View Post
    Sparta Prague or Viking for Sligo.

    CSKA Sofia or Makedonija Skopje for Pat's.

    Obviously if either of them get through. Away first both times.
    UEFA just couldn’t pull out Royal Antwerp could they. On the off chance we get to the next round that draw is a nightmare at short notice for the club. The fans would have little chance getting there either.

  13. #573
    Biased against YOUR club pineapple stu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nesta99 View Post
    Its not impossible that Rovers could beat Ludogorets, and if they do the next round is not impossible either.
    Rovers are not going to beat Dinamo Zagreb...

    Quote Originally Posted by D24Saint View Post
    UEFA just couldn’t pull out Royal Antwerp could they. On the off chance we get to the next round that draw is a nightmare at short notice for the club. The fans would have little chance getting there either.
    I was in North Macedonia last year; one of my flights was cancelled at a week's notice (covid meant some flights weren't full enough for airlines to be bothered with), but I managed to arrange an alternative ok in the end, at effectively a week's notice.

    They're both capital cities so either should be ok with one connection
    Last edited by pineapple stu; 18/07/2022 at 1:28 PM.

  14. #574
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    an interesting bunch watch out for the banners...
    jokes aside. Skopje and Macedonia is lovely if you can take in a day or two at Lake Ohrid.
    They love the irish in the Balkans, as everywhere (all sides of the ethnic divide see similarities with Ireland's struggle), so enjoy!
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KF_Shkupi

  15. #575
    Seasoned Pro PartySaint's Avatar
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    Pats managed to get a potential game against teams that weren't even named in our Pot yesterday. The most Pats/UEFA thig ever.
    Here on a technicality.

  16. #576
    International Prospect sadloserkid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nesta99 View Post
    Its not impossible that Rovers could beat Ludogorets, and if they do the next round is not impossible either. Depends on how Bradley sets things up and really its a free hit for all with being able to parachute to the next tiers of competition, so go all out rather than play to contain!
    I feel you are planting seeds here Nesta, planning to throw your harvest at Stephen Bradley's head now if Rovers lose to Ludogorets (as they should). 🙂

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    Quote Originally Posted by EalingGreen View Post
    Obviously you can't underestimate the huge influence of the OF, but even if you took them right out of the equation, with clubs like Aberdeen, Hibs, Hearts and the two Dundees etc, Scottish football is still "bigger" than ROI football.

    Whereas by contrast, in the absence of Cardiff, Swansea, Wrexham and Newport, Welsh domestic football is clearly much "smaller" than in the ROI, even NI.
    I suspect if you took the 5 best-supported clubs and the 4 main population centres out of the Scottish game, as happens re Welsh football, then the rump of clubs that was left would see crowds plummet. An SPL without Celtic, Rangers, Hearts, Hibs and Aberdeen wouldn't be much of a spectacle. And you'd also remove the Dundee clubs if it's fourth-largest population centre was culled.
    Last edited by EatYerGreens; 18/07/2022 at 7:13 PM.

  18. #578
    Seasoned Pro EalingGreen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EatYerGreens View Post
    I suspect if you took the 5 best-supported clubs and the 4 main population centres out of the Scottish game, as happens re Welsh football, then the rump of clubs that was left would see crowds plummet. An SPL without Celtic, Rangers, Hearts, Hibs and Aberdeen wouldn't be much of a spectacle. And you'd also remove the Dundee clubs if it's fourth-largest population centre was culled.
    Those Welsh clubs were never in the Welsh national league (there wasn't one), so couldn't benefit by association (no pun intended).

    And re Scotland, I was only responding to a suggestion that if the two OF clubs ceased to exist, the other remaining clubs would still be "bigger" than anything in the LOI (or NIFL).

    Remember that the SPL had to do without Rangers for 3 seasons, while the other clubs are "big" precisely because of their traditional status, deriving from when the OF weren't so dominant as they are today.

  19. #579
    Biased against YOUR club pineapple stu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EalingGreen View Post
    Remember that the SPL had to do without Rangers for 3 seasons.
    4 seasons - because hilariously they took two goes to get out of the second tier

  20. #580
    Seasoned Pro EalingGreen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pineapple stu View Post
    4 seasons - because hilariously they took two goes to get out of the second tier
    Indeed!

    But my overall point is that Scotland has long had a widespread footballing tradition, with many solid clubs throughout the country, with a history and tradition which long predates the present OF dominance.

    And that's before you count the plethora of Junior clubs (i.e. outwith the League set-up), many of whom received incredibly big crowds, or used to at any rate.

    And at least some of those have allowed for the expansion of the Scottish pyramid to its present extent.

    EDIT: Just done a bit of googling for Scottish Junior football:

    The term "junior" does not relate to the age of players. Football for young players is generally known as "Youth" (up to Under-19) or "Juvenile" (which is to Under-21 level) football....

    ... Despite the lesser media coverage the juniors get, many of the club sides are fairly popular, and some of the bigger games (such as the local derbies between Arthurlie and Pollok, and Cumnock Juniors vs. Auchinleck Talbot) can attract attendances in the thousands. Crowds were far bigger in the past (76,000 for the Junior Cup Final in 1951, with nearly 90,000 watching the semi finals including a replay) compared to the level of support attracted now.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scotti...ll_Association
    Last edited by EalingGreen; 18/07/2022 at 10:16 PM.

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