Ballymun United were saying a couple of years ago that they want to aim for LOI membership in-time - after their ambitious stadium plans happen : FacebookOriginally Posted by David BOHie
Yeah - Letterkenny has a decent population by LOI standards and is growinng fast. It might even have been the fasest-growinng large town between the 2016 and 2022 census?
Harps will presumably always have decent local support, but over time it would be hard to see beyond a well-organised Letterkennny-based club in terms of dominating the county re media, sponnsorship, support etc.
The people of Ballybofey need to up their procreaton game, you know what to do Nigel.
I remember before people giving out that attendences and facilities wouldn't be good enough. We need to start somewhere though. If it works in the North then it can work here
Except that in NI, the IFA didn't just plonk in a (made-up) third tier ("Premier Intermediate League") and leave it there.
There was a five year(?) process of re-arranging the whole league structure, with a promotion pathway from Junior to Intermediate to Senior etc combined with an off-field programme of requiring that facilities be of sufficient standard to gain the appropriate licences. All of which involved existing clubs and took a lot of time and planning.
And even since then there have been continuous modifications and upgrades as and when needed/desired - we're currently on the 2nd (3rd?) Five Year Plan:
https://www.irishfa.com/irish-fa-five-year-strategy
Granted a lot of that is the usual PR stuff of spin, hot air and management-speak; while management of the top three mens tiers and top womens tier has been devolved to the https://www.nifootballleague.com/. Nor do we have the summer/winter season problem to contend with.
Nonetheless it has overall been a very good thing for developing the game at all levels, in all parts of NI.
Last edited by EalingGreen; 01/10/2024 at 11:27 AM.
Where do LoI academies fit in to the Third Tier to First Division plans? Having an academy structure should be part of the First Division licencing. If the FAI bring in the 3 tier academy rating then, at least a tier 3 academy should be part of the First Division licencing.
What would be the basic criteria for any grounds used by teams that may be part of this new third tier expansion of the league system in 2025!
Obviously the ground would need to be suitably closed off with proper exit/entrance provided.
The pitch would also need to have a suitable perimeter fence.
Acceptable toilet facilities.
Suitable dressing rooms for both teams and officials.
Suitable viewing areas for fans.
Option to segregate away visiting fans.
What are the ground facilities like at any of the teams above!
Anyone able to offer details of current non-league clubs, Senior or Junior that have a ground & facilities better than any of the current First Division clubs?
As usual I suppose the FAI policy will be to allow teams in with open fields with plans to upgrade overtime!
A problem with expanding LOI is that Junior and Intermediate football is strongest around established LOI clubs / areas - due to both knowledge transfer and the archaic structure we have, which doesn't allow for the growth of regional teams.
For that reason, I think the FAI approach of developing a Kerry Fc or Mayo , is currently the right one, and the FAI shouldn't be against picking 'favourites' in unrepresented regions to develop.
Also, just some other names it would be great for me to see in LOI reborn in the 3rd tier (dispite last post, would also prefer Junior clubs with a bit of history, rather than new teams):
Ex LOI:
Kilkenny City
Kildare County
Sporting Fingal
Thurles Town
Ex A-Championship:
Castlebar Celtic
Carlow FC
Tullamore Town
Rumoured of Potentially Joining LOI:
Mullingar Athletic (in early 2000s)
St. Francis
Athboy Celtic (which is probably a Meath team)
Ballymun
Currently strong non-LOI club:
Maynooth University Town
Malahide United
Lucan United
St. Kevin's Boys (carrys massive underage weight... would not be surprised if they tried to enter)
Newmarket Celtic
Agreed 100%. District Junior leagues should feed into Intermediate Regional leagues. There should be an elite playing level to aspire to.
League of Ireland licencing and professionalism should have some degree of separation. The intention of all LoI clubs should be to attain a professional setup. A saturation of clubs as in Galway years ago won't help a vibrant professional setup.
A dual pathway is possibly a better approach in Ireland. The professional pathway within League of Ireland and licencing. The amateur pathway pathway from District to Regional.
Exactly, because of how unbalanced soccer has developed in the country, you probably need to do both if you want a thoroughly functional pyramid.
Before joining them to LOI, Start rearranging Junior and Intermediate leagues (which also seems impossible because of the disputes over the calendar and the GAA) to allow for regional teams to naturally grow (where better run clubs overtake worse), while also parachuting in 'County' teams into the LOI to help give a type of 'center of excellence' to a region, which will help develop players and coaches in the area.
Just for example to show how LOI trickles down... There were some amount of ex Drogheda and Dundalk lads, both coaching and ex professional/underage players, that won the FAI Intermediate Cup with Glebe North this year.
My suggestion might be a bit on the detailed side but let me know if this is more technical than people were expecting...
- min 2,000 capacity (of which 200 is at least covered seats and 800 is at least covered standing)
- pitch length a minimum of 95m
- pitch width a minimum of 60m
- min of 1 male, 1 female and 1 disabled toilet with separate toilets for home and away supporters
- separate dressing rooms for home & away teams, a min of 15sqm
- separate dressing room for referees, a min of 9sqm
- a minimum of 4 access turnstiles
- min of 5 reserved wheelchair spaces
- 500 LUX avg horizontal illumination floodlights
Thoughts?
Everything in the criteria listed would probably cost upwards of a million euro, or more.But it's a good list. Hopefully if a new club decides to do this, they can access future sports capital grants.
Thanks Steve, appreciate the feedback. And while a million sounds a lot, you make a good point about accessing grants to help pay for it
I guess the point I'm making is that the requirements are a lot less than a UEFA Category 1 stadium (which is the minimum for a First Division side) and if that's a struggle for our teams to meet than should we be having a discussion about changing the licensing standards?
To use Galway as an example, I think United would easily meet this reqs but how far off would Mervue and Salthill be? I'd say they'd be able to meet them if the turnstiles, floodlights and seating were relaxed.
By way of comparison, here are the IFA's Ground Regulations for the different levels of Football in NI, dated Nov.2019 (I think since updated, but can't find more recent):
https://www.irishfa.com/media/41546/...a-nov-2019.pdf
I believe that the IFA can be quite strict in applying such matters, with none of the usual "Sure, it'll do" attitude which often prevails. For example, a while back there was a club in a town of just under 10k people, about 10 miles from Belfast, who were very progressive, including facilities at the ground, which they own. They spent a lot of money developing a new social centre (bar, function rooms etc), which was a good income generator and was combined with their other footballing requirements, incl dressing rooms.
But when they applied for the new Intermediate Licence, this was refused, because instead of the dressing rooms being within the maximum permitted 55m from the pitch, they were something like 70m away in the Social centre:
https://www.irishfa.com/media/24660/...d-criteria.pdf
They eventually got their Licence, through some sort of individual derogation I assume, but this caused a lot of consternation, since overall their facilities were absolutely top class for a club of that size and standard.
* - Although our Third tier is called the "Premier Intermediate League", afaik clubs at that level need to comply with Second tier regulations, or commit to do so within a season of getting promoted to that level.
Last edited by EalingGreen; 08/10/2024 at 11:04 AM.
I love the first line of that document: "The field of play must be rectangular.."! Like there was some renegade groundsmen with a preference for square pitches
FAI should just copy and paste those regulations. The problem though is they're so desperate for clubs to join that the requirements won't be enforced.
Taken, I believe, directly from FIFA's own regulations:
"The field of play must be rectangular and marked with continuous lines."
https://publications.fifa.com/de/foo...ounding-areas/
So that's dotted lines out, then!
Remove the penalty spots lads!
https://kesslereffect.bandcamp.com/album/kepler - New music. It's not that bad.
You may have a point.
No, wait...
" In geometry, a point has no size, but has a position. This means it has no volume, area or length. We usually draw a point as a small cross 'X' or a small dot (a small, round shape)."
This is all getting very pointless (if it wasn't already)...
I have to come clean EalingGreen - my suggestions were based on the 2024/25 licensing criteria for... drum roll please... the NIFL Premiership!
I always thought it was mad that LOI's stadium criteria for the first division is UEFA Category 1, with Premier Division being UEFA Category 2. Especially when none of the Premier Division teams, bar Shamrock Rovers and, at a push, Shelbourne, Derry and Galway United, would play in venues that meet such high standards.
I take Buckett's point that LOI are so desperate for teams to join that they give out derogations yearly. But surely that means it makes more sense to lower our standards to a more attainable level? I thought Shels removing seats behind the goal in Tolka Park (to make it standing) improved the atmosphere of the place despite this moving them further away from Cat 2 standards.
If your interested, here's the link to the licensing criteria (Page 50, Annex A): https://www.irishfa.com/media/50261/...nce-manual.pdf
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