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Thread: To super league or to not super league ...

  1. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by pineapple stu View Post
    You wonder what their angle is. It almost certainly isn't this -



    - even though that's what they're saying.
    Was thinking this myself, but apparently Al-Khelaifa and Ceferin are very good mates and it could be as simple as that. Either way it's nothing to do with sporting integrity, family or community.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sonny View Post
    I think it's fascinating that this appears to be the straw that broke the camels back for so many. You've got Sky (in typically sensationalized ratings friendly fashion) taking up the position of defenders of the soul of football against evil corporate greed! Sky and the Premier League, who have gutted fan culture, priced out vast numbers of working class fans and turned football into a televised game of monopoly, are now rowing in behind "Football is for the Fans" campaigns and claiming to be outraged because the proposals say the quiet part out loud by referring to non-TV fans as 'heritage fans'. An Arsenal season ticket costs over 2k sterling a year. You can get a Bayern Munich season ticket for as little as €150. Where is the all the "football is for the fans" outrage about that?

    Ultimately this is a ****ing contest between massive greedy corporations all trying to protect and pursue their own financial interests. Listening to Sky Sports lecturing about the need to preserve the soul and integrity of the sport is stomach churning.
    There is absolutely no way the Super League announcement would have been made without a major broadcaster on-board. Ad we're not talking Sky, Fox Sport etc - we're talking a global subscription player like Netflix or Amazon, or a heavily financed new entry who wants to use this content to drive their platform. There is a slight possibility the latter could be a bespoke platform just to sell the SuperLeague and run by it, but I suspect that would be seen as less beneficial than just hawking the rights to an existing or aspiring global platform. Sky's entire success was built on football. It's what drove adoption of its services throughout the 1990s (with the old adage of it being sold to blokes, who then justified it to their wife on the basis of the movies package for the both of them and Disney for the kids). Football remains Sky's crown jewels - even in a more competitive rights environment these days. If they lose the rights to the apex of club football in Europe - which they would, because they don't have a presence in every market - then the whole rationale for having it starts to crumble a bit. It's already very expensive as it is (€30-40 for a fairly basic package)

    So there is zero principle involved here for Sky. This is them fighting for their very survival.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sonny View Post
    Was thinking this myself, but apparently Al-Khelaifa and Ceferin are very good mates and it could be as simple as that. Either way it's nothing to do with sporting integrity, family or community.
    Al-Khelaifi is also chairman of BeIN Sports. Don't they have broadcasting deals with UEFA in some parts of the world?

  4. #84
    Seasoned Pro NeverFeltBetter's Avatar
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    What do people think of the potential of a player-based response? Some stories going round of a few big names - Henderson at Liverpool, Maguire at Man Utd, etc - expressing negative opinions and trying to rally support. Would enough players be willing to take a stand, and have the balls to back it up by walking? I suppose I'm basically asking if there would be any possibility of a players strike occurring. Is that wishful thinking?
    Author of Never Felt Better (History, Film Reviews).

  5. #85
    Biased against YOUR club pineapple stu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by redarmyfaction View Post
    The English clubs involved are no longer interested in terroir and will leave the UK if the Tories try and stop them and I don't think they will
    Yeah, the Tories have always been interested in letting business make lots of cash and pretty much nothing else.

    Another question on this is - what makes Liverpool FC Liverpool FC? Is Anfield necessary? Is it a bunch of players in red kits and a liver bird crest? (Did the Harlem Globetrotters have a home venue?)

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    Quote Originally Posted by pineapple stu View Post
    Yeah, the Tories have always been interested in letting business make lots of cash and pretty much nothing else.

    Another question on this is - what makes Liverpool FC Liverpool FC? Is Anfield necessary? Is it a bunch of players in red kits and a liver bird crest? (Did the Harlem Globetrotters have a home venue?)
    I don't think the Harlem Globetrotters are a reasonable comparison. They were always more of a circus act than anything resembling competition. They typically aren't even playing local opposition, they bring their own opponents (the Washington Generals with them). Their games are more like WWE or the likes where the results are basically scripted/choreographed.

    Not to say that something like that isn't an eventual possibility down the road but its not what is being proposed here.

    But theres nothing to say these teams couldn't become permanent traveling teams playing a series of games in different parts of the world. Though several of them have spent a lot of money on their facilities in recent years so I can't see that being their plan in the short to medium term.

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    Biased against YOUR club pineapple stu's Avatar
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    Yeah, take out the fake nature of it alright (which admittedly is a lot of what they are). Maybe a better way of putting it is whether Liverpool could relocate to Beijing (say)?

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    Quote Originally Posted by pineapple stu View Post
    Yeah, take out the fake nature of it alright (which admittedly is a lot of what they are). Maybe a better way of putting it is whether Liverpool could relocate to Beijing (say)?
    I'd be surprised if something like that didn't happen eventually, once the league is established. I don't know if it would be Liverppol, but even a European league of about 20 teams with 3 in London?Or 3 in Liverpool/Manchester? the NFL is far more widespread with a max of two teams per city.

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    Quote Originally Posted by pineapple stu View Post
    Yeah, the Tories have always been interested in letting business make lots of cash and pretty much nothing else.

    Another question on this is - what makes Liverpool FC Liverpool FC? Is Anfield necessary? Is it a bunch of players in red kits and a liver bird crest? (Did the Harlem Globetrotters have a home venue?)
    Liverpool and Man Utd are brands just like Doc Martens, the football brands don't need a home stadium just like Doc Marten doesn't have and in fact never had a factory, they are made in S.E Asia now and despite the shoes being garbage they are are going public with a $5 bio dollah American offering.

    N.B Legacy DM fans can buy shoes sold under the Solovair brand made by NPS who used to make DMs when they were manufactured in the UK, a much, much better shoe than DM have made since the 80s.

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    Biased against YOUR club pineapple stu's Avatar
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    I don't think that's a fair analogy though as club's home grounds have a certain resonance. Big nights at Anfield/Old Trafford/Camp Nou, etc. It's a locus for the team. There's merchandise money to be made off it too I'd say.

    US sports have shown that relocation can work, although it ****es a lot of people off (although increasingly those people - the "legacy" fans, to use the earlier quote, are irrelevant), and it comes at the cost of a name change which I don't think would work here.

    It may happen at some stage in the future - hence wondering if a Dublin Dons could be Ireland's football team at a lower level - but (and this is answering my own question I guess) I'm not sure if football's ready for it yet.

    (I think this is still all a giant game of chicken btw, but the topic is going to keep coming up, so may as well chat away about it in the meantime!)

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    Quote Originally Posted by pineapple stu View Post

    (I think this is still all a giant game of chicken btw, but the topic is going to keep coming up, so may as well chat away about it in the meantime!)
    Yeah I really think there is too much money at stake for there not to be a resolution of some sort. It might involve the associations and even UEFA capitulating, but the national leagues involved absolutely can not expel the teams involved. The EPL is a non-runner without those six teams.

    I'd also be surprised if one of these clubs were ever relocated. I think long term you'll probably get a few home games touring around like the NFL, but the 'brands' are all to tied to specific place for them to actually permanently move.

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    It would be great if UEFA actually managed to clip these guys wings rather than do a deal which means that by guaranteeing access based on history (as currently floated but for only two teams) they effectively just create a ESL with the only difference being its run by UEFA instead.

    Only way that happens is if Governments step up,
    Chance for Boris to nail down the Working class vote in the UK maybe??

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    On one hand, the big boys are not happy with the money. On the other hand, UEFA is/was a deeply corrupt organisation. In theory, I support any kind of rebelion against UEFA as long as it's properly done. But the current idea of the Super League is not OK.

    If the big boys go on with it, we'll have UEFA retaliate. And I do have two tickets for the EURO, will not be happy to see Portugal without CR. But let's say this happens. We will surely have a lot of legal actions for years between clubs, UEFA, FIFA, players and so on. A total mess.

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    The Times is reporting that one of the six English teams is having emergency discussions at executive level about backing out after the fan backlash. Clickbait or signs of hope?

    You'd imagine it's probably Liverpool.
    Author of Never Felt Better (History, Film Reviews).

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    Youth Team Kiki Balboa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NeverFeltBetter View Post
    The Times is reporting that one of the six English teams is having emergency discussions at executive level about backing out after the fan backlash. Clickbait or signs of hope?

    You'd imagine it's probably Liverpool.
    Liverpool and United are the biggest pushers for it.

    Chelsea and City are now rumored to be pulling out.

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    Seasoned Pro NeverFeltBetter's Avatar
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    BBC reporting that Chelsea are pulling out. This idea might be sunk.

    Edit - Confirmed that City are gone too.

    Edit #2 - All happening fast, reports that all 12 clubs are considering disbanding the whole idea. Some turn around from this morning!
    Last edited by NeverFeltBetter; 20/04/2021 at 6:26 PM.
    Author of Never Felt Better (History, Film Reviews).

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    UEFA should now ram it up their arses by throwing out changes to cl

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  20. #98
    Youth Team Kiki Balboa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiki Balboa View Post

    Early feeling is that the clubs have 'shot their load' too early. Everyone in the game between politicans to broadcasters to fans to football associations are against it. They have no public backing. Seems a very strategic mistake, there is just a wave of negetivity. By the time it starts (which we assume now is next september), the clubs will be in massive legl fights, Government possibly passing legislation against it , and months of propaganda from Sky and BT sports (who dont have the rights) against it.

    just dont see the massive expansion for Super league clubs from the market. The only option is compete for a 'slice of the pie' of the English, Italian and Spanish leagues.I just dont see any inovation. Everyone has no option but to fight tooth and nail against it.

    (Obv, preaching to the choir here.... it also just seems boring..)
    i was right about something

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    Seasoned Pro NeverFeltBetter's Avatar
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    Ed Woodward resigns. Was apparently going to leave at the end of the season anyway, but I assume this means Man Utd are also abandoning the project.
    Author of Never Felt Better (History, Film Reviews).

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    After all the drama this is going to end up as a victory for the barstoolers as they will continue to think they are indispensable to the English sides.

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