Faroe Islands and other minnows

[Gerrit]

Without that romance football cannot survive. Even the most fanatic fan of technically brilliant games gets tired of seeing the same old clubs over and over again. If Real Madrid and Juventus play each other yet again, I have a too big deja-vu feeling to even bother to watch the game, I much rather see Alania Vladikavkaz play Afon Lido then.

You can complain all you want about the Faroe Islands-like teams of this world, but when such a minor beats a giant (even if it only happens once a season) the whole world (except for the opponent's fans) love it. It's those things that make football exciting.
Remember the qualifiers for Euro 1996... Luxembourg got 10 points, never happened before to them. They even beat Czech 1-0, the same Czech Republic that would later become vice-champions of Europe ! That goal that gave Luxembourg that historic win was shown on TV all around the world, everyone had the greatest respect for what tiny Luxembourg had realised.

Everyone feels somehow attracted to underdogs, unless it's against the own club. If Shels would lose tomorrow to Wicklow Rovers, the lads in Cork would have the laugh of a lifetime, and vice-versa. Luckily we still have these tiny ones that can cause sensation now and then.

And the European glory of Denmark (1992) and Greece (2004) were probably the biggest thrills many football fans experienced in a whole decade. No one gave Greece a chance to survive the first round, they never won a game on a tournament before. And suddenly, out of nothing, David beats all Goliaths of Europe and out of nothing wins its first trophy and the hearts of many neutral soccer fans.

The big ones need the little ones just as well.

[Islander]

It's happening in Europe at club level

I'd disagree with this in principel, but seing the Faroes take off their main striker when 2-0 down and their goalkeeper wasteing time when 2-0 down and settling for that result, if that's the height of their ambitions they'res something wrong imo. But at the same time, they have the right to compete and it's not fair putting them in a pre qualifyer.

That is nonsense, mate!
Andrew av Fløtum was substuted for Christian Høgni Jacobsen, who is a faster striker and a bit more of a targetplayer.
Fródi Benjaminsen was subsistuted for Jákup á Borg, who is very fast and offensive.
Claus Bech Jørgensen was taken out because he isn't fullfit yet, as he's just recovering from injury, and has been on Coventry's bench lately. And again, Tór Ingar Akselsen is a offensive midfielder.
That our goalie, Jákup Mikkelsen had a bad day, that's another story, but if he was wasting time, it had nothing to do with overall tactics, because the team fought what ever they were capable of.

[geysir]

That is nonsense, mate!
Andrew av Fløtum was substuted for Christian Høgni Jacobsen, who is a faster striker and a bit more of a targetplayer.
Fródi Benjaminsen was subsistuted for Jákup á Borg, who is very fast and offensive.
Claus Bech Jørgensen was taken out because he isn't fullfit yet, as he's just recovering from injury, and has been on Coventry's bench lately. And again, Tór Ingar Akselsen is a offensive midfielder.
That our goalie, Jákup Mikkelsen had a bad day, that's another story, but if he was wasting time, it had nothing to do with overall tactics, because the team fought what ever they were capable of.

You are quite right, but I did not see that your goalie had a bad day. Definitly the striker was going nowhere when your goalie rashly made some small contact with him. He guessed right for the penalty and got a goodish hand to the ball, for those two actions alone it immediatly puts him 2 points ahead of Shay Given in penalty shot goalkeeping ability.
He had no chance with the deflected 2nd goal.
So on a good day, would he have stopped the penalty shot and anticipated the deflection? :-)

You could also add that you had Duff wrapped up for 90 mins. without even having 2 men on him.

[Islander]

So on a good day, would he have stopped the penalty shot and anticipated the deflection? :-).

No, you are absoloutely right. But besides the above mentioned, and obviously many other good actions through the match, he was gulity of the penalty itself, he had several poor deliveries, and gave several returns (too many, even the conditions taken in consideration) I say this, because on a normal day he is way up there, with good international class.

You could also add that you had Duff wrapped up for 90 mins. without even having 2 men on him.

Yes, all in all, the team had a good spell, with an unforgetable first half.

[Slash/ED]

That is nonsense, mate!
Andrew av Fløtum was substuted for Christian Høgni Jacobsen, who is a faster striker and a bit more of a targetplayer.
Fródi Benjaminsen was subsistuted for Jákup á Borg, who is very fast and offensive.
Claus Bech Jørgensen was taken out because he isn't fullfit yet, as he's just recovering from injury, and has been on Coventry's bench lately. And again, Tór Ingar Akselsen is a offensive midfielder.
That our goalie, Jákup Mikkelsen had a bad day, that's another story, but if he was wasting time, it had nothing to do with overall tactics, because the team fought what ever they were capable of.

Well I know very little about your team that's just how it looked to me, I could well be wrong, I hope I am.

[mypost]

Is there any real point in footballing minnows such as the Faroe Islands, Liechtenstein, San Marino, Andorra, Scotland, Kazakhstan, Malta and Luxembourg competing with the stronger nations in the qualifiers? Their only function is to serve as cannon fodder for the better teams. FIFA themselves even recognise this in their rules about goal difference - when ranking teams on equal points, the goal difference built up in the matches agains the weakest teams in the group is discounted. All the small teams can hope for is to take a few scalps off the bigger teams, such as Liechtenstein's nil-all victory against us a few years ago, or the Faroes' draw against the Scots, or else to take points off smaller teams. As a result, when they play the bigger teams, they invariably put about 10 men behind the ball - nothing wrong with that, their managers are free to choose whatever tactics they please, negative or positive, but it just shows that they go into matches without much hope of winning in the first place.

What I propose is that FIFA set up a two-tier qualifying competition, where the countries that habitually end up as whipping-boys play each other. Then allow the top two teams out of this section qualify for the main qualifiers with all the other teams. At least it would give the small teams a better chance of building up a string of good results, with the incentive being that they would get to play against the top teams in Europe. It must be demoralising for both the players and fans of these teams at the moment to know that they never have a chance of qualifying for the major tournaments - in this system at least they wouldn't have to got week in week out getting trounced.

This is the FIFA World Cup. The whole world is invited. Rightly, all of the UEFA members can compete in it, even if some of them are hopeless. The players play for the pride and honour of playing for their country, and they put themselves in the shop window for a transfer to a foreign club. There shouldn't be pre-qualifiers before the tournament, -there isn't the time to play them in any case. Goal difference against the bottom teams in groups, only does not count in European Championship qualifiers. It does count in the World Cup, that's why we were in the play-off last time.

Maybe the poster who began the thread is concerned that Ireland don't score enough goals against those teams. That, I will agree with.

[Plastic Paddy]

I would hate to see a two-tier competition in either the Euro or the World Cup qualifiers. Matches against the likes of the Faroes, San Marino and Andorra are an important part of the complexion of competitive international football and should continue as such. Others in this thread have made the case strongly enough for their retention, so I won't repeat them here.

PP

[Colie]

no way!!!!!!! look at the faroes...ya man was a plumber by day and a footballer by night. he must know himself hes no world beater so to find himself fixing a sink at 10am and lining out representing his country against damien duff that evening must be amazing...disheartening me ars* :P i'd love it

Agreed.

[hamish]

Speaking of underdogs - don't forget Finland qualifying for the womens' Euro 2005 semi-finals yesterday. First time a Finnish footie side has qualified for footbal finals.
I believe Finland is having something like an Italia 90 at the moment - great excitement up there.

[Levantine]

A two-tier system could actually be a good idea. Those "minnows" won't miss out on the sense of competition (aiming to finish 5th, rather than 6th, in the group, has very little to do with what competetive sport is all about), and would still have a chance against the big ones, ince they qualify for the next stage of the competition.

As to equality in competitions such as the Champions' League, it simply won't happen. The clubs from the European top divisions, such as those in England, in Spain, and in Italy, won't be keen at all to participate in a competition which produces few attractive matches. An unattractive match means few fans watching, which means little money in revenues.
Watch Liverpool's qualifying matches next year and you'll see what I mean. (Actually, their fans just might still crowd the stadium.. but the rule stands)

[Slash/ED]

(Actually, their fans just might still crowd the stadium.. but the rule stands)

I doubt they will, they couldn't crowd out their stadium for their group stage matches last year.

[Gerrit]

I would hate to see a two-tier competition in either the Euro or the World Cup qualifiers. Matches against the likes of the Faroes, San Marino and Andorra are an important part of the complexion of competitive international football and should continue as such. Others in this thread have made the case strongly enough for their retention, so I won't repeat them here.

PP

Vatican City FA is busy with affiliaton to the UEFA and FIFA (yes, they have an own national team and their own five-a-league with several sides competing !). Now that is a small country to join, 1000 inhabitants - it even makes Luxembourg look huge. Still, they're a country so they have the right to join, I'd even say it will be an interesting team to look forward to and quite a unique trip (even though due to spectator numbers games against somewhat good teams will probably be played in Rome's Olympic Stadium)

It's the world cup: everyone is invited. Club football has become a somewhat elitist thing, let's not do the same with countrywise football please.

[Levantine]

Is it just me or does there seem to be a lot more Liverpool fans out and about these past few weeks?

It's not just you. They seem to be crawling out of their holes. Many have been spotted as far from Liverpool as here!

[holidaysong]

I fully agree. Romance is everything.

That's exactly it! The Liechtensteins of this world all the way!

[holidaysong]

Ever read that book about Liechtenstein's WC qualifying campaign by a lad called Connolly? Worth a read, though the name escapes me. Has a triangular stamp on the cover.
I've often thought that a tournament for all the so-called lesser lights would make a good TV event.
Certainly better than watching the women's tournaments.

Sounds good will look out for it.
Was watching Sweden vs. England Women's match last nite... Just not the same...

[Plastic Paddy]

Certainly better than watching the women's tournaments

Was watching Sweden vs. England Women's match last nite... Just not the same...

Lads?!? You are lads, yes?

It's better than any Eircom League match you'll see AND the players are better looking by several orders of magnitude... so the problem is what, exactly?

PP

[hamish]

[QUOTE=holidaysong]Sounds good will look out for it.
Was watching Sweden vs. England Women's match last nite... Just not the same..

That's because there's women playing

I like watching the womens' game because there's much less in the way of gamespersonship (very PC ). feigning injuries, arguing with referees etc although it's starting to creep in a little.

Some bloke on Radio 5 last night said that we should watch womens footie the same way we watch womens tennis - it's different but can be just as enjoyable.

I thought the England v Sweden game was quite absorbing - the excitement of watching England desperately trying to get that all important goal made compelling viewing. I actually felt sorry for them at the end. Some of the tackles were tough - no namby pamby stuff there.

Come on guys, give the womens game a chance.

You'd never see Emma Byrne behaving like that Israeli keeper.

[pineapple stu]

Have to have these teams in.

a) As someone pointed out, who are we to kick small teams out when not that long ago, we were down there ourselves?
b) The likes of Asia and Africa have regionalised phases (partly) because there are so many countries, and also to reduce travel costs. Those two factors don't apply in Europe.
c) The Faroes as a country must have made a quarter of a million from tourism from that match. For a small economy, that's vital. I for one will be going straight back if we ever get drawn against them again, and maybe even if we don't. Had we not played them, who knows if I'd ever have gone?
d) Again, as mentioned, the likes of Cyprus 3-2 Spain, Andorra 1-0 Macedonia, etc. is the kind of result which crops up often enough and is a huge boost for the relevant counties. Why take away their chance?

Incidentally, it's worth noting that all Faroe Island league games are played on Astro pitches. For them to play internationals on grass is a huge change and a huge advantage for opposing teams. Imagine what they could achieve if they had grass pitches, or even FIFA-approved astro-pitches?

[Levantine]

It should ultimately be up to the Liechtensteiners of the world to decide which system they prefer. As romantic as the current system may seem to an outsider (with the occasional surprise result), I do believe most of their football fans would rather have a few really competetive matches in a preliminary round, than just one in an entire campaign.
Wouldn't everyone?

Have to have these teams in.
b) The likes of Asia and Africa have regionalised phases (partly) because there are so many countries, and also to reduce travel costs. Those two factors don't apply in Europe.

Actually, Africa has the same number (give or take one) of participants as Europe, while Asia has fewer than both. See here.
Who would have thought?

[eirebhoy]

a) As someone pointed out, who are we to kick small teams out when not that long ago, we were down there ourselves?

With my suggestion they certainly wouldn't be kicked out.