WUFC have difficulty paying players

[gael353]

Was told recently that waterfords weekly wage bill is 9K. and as SLK said above Paddy Purcell, Colm Heffernan are indeed welcome home as would be Steve Yelverton to his rightfull place.

[pineapple stu]

Think he'd lent money to the club so was getting it back.

If the club's in trouble (certainly if it goes into administration), then that's possibly illegal - all creditors have to be treated equally, so you can't realise your club's in trouble, pay back everything you're owed and then you lose nothing a couple of months later when you're paying creditors 20p in the £.

Was told recently that Waterford's weekly wage bill is 9K.

Wouldn't be surprised. I think E500 is a fairly average weekly wage, from what I've heard. Crowds of 1,300 or so can't sustain that.

This hardly came on overnight though. Even if the debt wasn't there at the start of the season, budgets, etc. would have to have been in place. Another fudge in the licencing process?

To be honest, I'm delighted they're in trouble. Nothing against Waterford, but clubs can't trade recklessly like this and hope to gain an advantage over those who trade sensibly.

[De Town]

To be honest, I'm delighted they're in trouble. Nothing against Waterford, but clubs can't trade recklessly like this and hope to gain an advantage over those who trade sensibly.

Im delighted for them aswell, because of 1 thing:

Alan Reynolds

[Poor Student]

This hardly came on overnight though. Even if the debt wasn't there at the start of the season, budgets, etc. would have to have been in place. Another fudge in the licencing process?

I was about to say this myself. It seems the loan papered over the cracks but now with their declining form crowds are dropping, they're out of the FAI Cup and there's little chance of Setanta or European qualification next season. Hard to see where the money will come from.

[Schumi]

If the club's in trouble (certainly if it goes into administration), then that's possibly illegal - all creditors have to be treated equally, so you can't realise your club's in trouble, pay back everything you're owed and then you lose nothing a couple of months later when you're paying creditors 20p in the £.

The impression I had (and I'm very open to correction on this) is that either he was the only creditor or their other creditors were also paid off.

[Poor Student]

The impression I had (and I'm very open to correction on this) is that either he was the only creditor or their other creditors were also paid off.

If either were the case they'd hardly be in such trouble would they?

[trevy]

http://www.munster-express.ie/news5.html
Go onto this webpage and Joh O'Connors article will answer most of the questions on the current situation at the club.

[Poor Student]

Very interesting and informative article. Sounds dodgy for Waterford. To save people going through the link:

--------------------------------------------------------------
Anxious days for Waterford United

Report by John O’Connor

The future of national league soccer in Waterford is at a crossroads this week as Waterford United, the current flag-bearer of one of the country’s proudest football traditions, struggles to survive.

The battle is raging both on and off the field of play but the most imminent danger, the one that could scupper United within weeks, is one of finance. To be more specific, the lack of hard cash.

Ironically, even though the club is in a very precarious state, its debt situation is all but under control and is not under threat from creditors.

But, even though the Blues are operating on a shoe-string budget compared to most other clubs in the premier division, there is simply not enough income being generated at the turnstiles or through sponsorship and donations.

The beleaguered club has only been kept afloat by the timely transfer of striker Daryl Murphy to Sunderland. But United cannot keep on losing and borrowing money at the rate it is going, especially as there is no other player on the books likely to provide the same financial return as Murphy.

If the current situation is not addressed in the immediate or very near future, there is a strong likelihood that United will finish the season trying to avoid relegation with an amateur squad, a forced scenario that proved unsuccessful in the past.

Financial constraints

At the moment, the club has no chairman as the acting chairman, Greg Pheasey, stepped down on Monday due to business commitments. Due to financial constraints, the club has reluctantly had to dispense with the services of commercial manager and playing legend, Johnny Matthews.

The two remaining directors, Jim Nolan and Martin Colbert, never expected to be so involved in the day to day running of the club but, as things stand, they are shouldering all the time-consuming responsibility.

Martin Colbert resigned as a director earlier in the year due to business pressures but returned last week in the club’s hour of need. Jim Nolan stays on but only for the time being. He has indicated that he needs to go but has agreed to remain on the board for a short period to facilitate the smooth transfer of the reins of power to a new management team, if indeed such a team can be assembled in the current difficult circumstances.

Acknowledged as an important writer and stage director on both sides of the Atlantic, Jim Nolan has heavy artistic commitments. He has recently completed a new play for the Abbey Theatre and is currently in the process of editing the script. He is also contracted to direct a play for the Abbey due to open in October.

Biggest shareholders

An annual general meeting is expected to take place as soon as possible but, because of the legal and business procedures to be followed, it is not likely to occur before the end of July.

The three biggest shareholders in Waterford United at present are Michael Finnegan, Ger O’Brien and Cathal Ryan. While the make-up of the company may have changed in the interim, the situation, as of April 2000, was that 417,028 Ordinary Shares of £1 each were issued and paid for as were 3,300 non equity Redeemable Preference Shares of £1 each. The preference shareholders are not entitled to attend or vote at general meetings of the company.

Shoe-string budget

Most premier league clubs operate on budgets ranging from about €18,000 to €25,000 per week. By paring everything to the bone, Waterford United is just about getting by on €10,000 a week. Its wage-bill is probably the lowest in the division with players getting from €100 to a maximum of €450 per week compared to players at other clubs, many of whom are earning in excess of €1000 per week plus extras.

Unfortunately, the average gate at United’s matches these days yields no more than €6,000 and that has to tide the club over for at least two weeks. In other words, it is running at a loss of €6,000 to €7,000 per week.

The total take from United’s last three games, all of which were at home and included an FAI Cup tie against St. Patrick’s Athletic, was in the region of €16,000. Compare that to the €17,000 realised from just one home-tie against Shelbourne shortly after Waterford were promoted to the premier division.

The next transfer window in the national league opens on July 1st. and, unless there is a dramatic change in the fortunes of the RSC based club, the squad could be seriously depleted. The player-manager, Alan Reynolds, has been asked to draw up a cost cutting plan as far as the players are concerned and rival clubs will also be waiting and watching in the hope of signing certain players.

Sunderland money

There has been much talk about the money received from Sunderland for the transfer of striker Daryl Murphy but most of it is uninformed. The Munster Express understands that the sum in question is £100,000 sterling. The player himself is entitled to a percentage as are a number of other interests. The common perception in local sports circles is that the majority of the money will go to the former club chairman, Ger O’Brien, but this is not correct.

Ger O’Brien is the club’s biggest creditor (much of it due in unpaid salary during his time as general manager) and this newspaper understands that the exact extent of that debt will be publicly revealed in the next set of accounts. We also understand that, following recent negotiations with Jim Nolan and Greg Pheasey, Mr.O’Brien agreed to write off the bulk of that debt. A portion of the agreed settlement is to be paid out of the Murphy transfer money with the rest to follow in due course.

Aventageous

It is understood that both Mr. Nolan and Mr. Pheasey were happy at the outcome of the discussions and believed the settlement was advantageous to Waterford United. The rest of the ‘Murphy money’ will be spent paying off the majority of the club’s other creditors.

Waterford United does have a separate debt, believed to be in the region of €150,000, that is under control as it is being serviced by funds from the Membership Scheme.

So, where now for Waterford United? The club needs the fans to rally around but it also needs an injection of cash from altruistic minded people with an interest in soccer and a desire to see Waterford back at the top of Irish football. If such support doesn’t materialise, the lower division, or worse, is a distinct possibility.

Without doubt, Waterford United is experiencing a very real crisis and, like the proverbial cat, it does not have nine live.

[Schumi]

If either were the case they'd hardly be in such trouble would they?

They're not getting enough money in to pay their wages, and they mightn't be able to secure a loan from a bank maybe? I don't know really but that was the impression I had.

Edit: similar-ish to what the article above said.

[Poor Student]

They're not getting enough money in to pay their wages, and they mightn't be able to secure a loan from a bank maybe? I don't know really but that was the impression I had.

Having read that article you're right actually. It seems creditors aren't really the problem. Their overheads just exceed their income. Simple as that.

[pete]

Seems very strange that a club of Waterfords size would have a paid General Manager at the same time as a paid Commercial Manager.

I'm surprised any former Director is seeing a cent as would be his own fault for running up the debts anyway?

Seems Waterford don't have huge long term debts but just cut cutting so break even on weekly basis. ! assume no fulltime players so seems crazy that any part time player would get 2k a month.

[pineapple stu]

It seems creditors aren't really the problem. Their overheads just exceed their income. Simple as that.

So that would imply that they've now got a big bank overdraft though? If that's the case, I think the payment to the director is still dubious at best.

What's the name of the company under which the club is trading? Found a couple of variants of "Waterford United Limited" on www.cro.ie, but all are dissolved at this stage (which isn't unusual in itself, incidentally)...

[exile]

rumour going around on btid that he has been sacked reynolds that is

[Martinho II]

the last time i can remember a club that were getting into financial difficulites during the season in the top flight was dundalk in 98/99. If I can rem correctly , they had to sell their top earner paul doolin and they went down that season!

my heart goes out to waterford! best of luck lads! spoke to a few waterford supporters in longford on saturday a very loyal bunch they were to!

[Mr A]

Interesting article, but I can say for a fact that Harps operate on a smaller budget than Waterford do.

It looks like Waterford will be forced to cut the wage bill to a level they can sustain. This will surely be helped by the departure of Reynolds and is exactly what every club should be doing anyway.

[harry crumb]

They have a ****e soccer stadium. Not a great place to watch a match.

[thecorner]

They have a ****e soccer stadium. Not a great place to watch a match.

and sh!t fans..everything about the club stinks


i say"good riddance"

[Dick Long]

O'Brien is the main creditor has agreed to write off 'the bulk' of the club's debt to him - accrued mostly through deferred income as general manager - in exchange for an agreed percentage of the Murphy. It makes sense for the club to pay him say 50k in order to write for example a 150k debt out of their books. The one other main debt of 150k is being serviced through a direct debit membership scheme. Aside from that the club is probably in a healthier state than many other eircom clubs.

As a result of recent drastically dropping crowds it is obvious to the directors that there is a serious danger of getting into debt, and they are trying to head it off before that happens. They have been honest about this and are making an appeal for support. So it can't be said that it's their fault for allowing this to happen - it's not happened yet. All is needed is a bit of good will from the public, another 3 or 400 on the gate plus the release of one or two of the higher earners not pulling their weight, and things would be OK.

With Reynolds gone, Doherty is the biggest earner and while he's been excellent when on the pitch, he's been injured almost constantly. Two of the other signings Paul Crowley & Sean Finn have hardly played for one reason or another, while Willie Doyle who was signed as Daryl Murphy's eventual replacement has just not worked out at all. If they could get Doherty playing regularly results would improve, and ridding themselves of the other three they would probably save them 1k per week.

[Slash/ED]

Doherty is the biggest earner and while he's been excellent when on the pitch, he's been injured almost constantly.

Story of his career, if it wasn't for that he'd probably have had more success at Liverpool nevermind Shels.

[pineapple stu]

Aside from that the club is probably in a healthier state than many other eircom clubs.

Interesting thread from the UCD forum - Waterford fans noting back in November that their club was one of the most stable in the league despite others arguing otherwise. With all due respect, I'd be inclined to take Waterford fans' views with a pinch of salt after that! Putting the entire squad up for sale (as has been mentioned) is a very drastic step if the club only has the threat of financial worries over it - they'll end up losing their best players and wind up relegated...then there'll be financial troubles...

Two of the other signings Paul Crowley & Sean Finn have hardly played for one reason or another

What's the story with Seán Finn? Quality player - don't understand how he's not getting a game unless he's injured?