England V Republic of Ireland - Thursday, 12th November 2020 - Friendly

**paul_oshea** · 12/11/2020, 8:49 AM

Long was called up, its in the article posted earlier.

I do agree on the Long thing, but given it was in the Uk and he lives around Southampton I'd have thought he would have joined up.

**Stuttgart88** · 12/11/2020, 8:52 AM

Originally Posted by Demesne Lad

Norn Iron often have to 'make do' with League One strikers. I think I'd prefer Paddy Madden to Conor Sammon at this stage -- averaging 13 or 14 League One goals a season for Fleetwood. We don't have many players who just put the ball in the net regularly.

Which is why James Collins deserves another look. 1 goal on his debut and a horror show against Georgia. He'd be a regular or v close to the NI team. He plays like yer man Kiefer Moore of Wales, a late bloomer, also Championship. I'm hopeful Collins will bring something to the team in the short term. I think we need an old-fashioned 9 in the box, and not just so we can play direct football.

**Stuttgart88** · 12/11/2020, 8:54 AM

Originally Posted by paul_oshea

Long was called up, its in the article posted earlier.

I do agree on the Long thing, but given it was in the Uk and he lives around Southampton I'd have thought he would have joined up.

Hadn't seen that, thanks. But it kind of backs up my point: Long is a more obvious call up than McMillan, for a host of reasons.

**tetsujin1979** · 12/11/2020, 9:06 AM

Originally Posted by Stuttgart88

I don't think this is the time for looking at LOI strikers tbh. For a start, I think Rovers won the league without a standout striker this year, Greene's hold up play is good but is similar to James Collins (already called up) and Collins is a far more frequent goalscorer. I'd say Collins > Hoban and by quite a bit. We have Idah, Maguire and Collins in the squad as well as attacking wide players already. Burke has been good in general play but his 5 against Cork flattered his output for the season.

Also, all our players except Byrne are in UK. This games was scheduled only because NZ pulled out because of COVID. X-border travel comes with risks as we are all too aware, and injury risk is a factor on international breaks. Dundalk have big Europa League and FAI Cup games coming up and imagine if they lost a player due to COVID or injury just so they can have an outside chance of playing at wembley? Shane Long hasn't even been called up.

I'm all for LOI involvement as you know. But no striker or full back has stood out domestically as being good enough for senior international football imho. Apart from Byrne the standout domestic players have been young players (Scales, Grant etc.) or NI or Cape Verde internationals(!) and they are deservedly being picked for the U21s.

If Jack Byrne - by a country mile the outstanding player in the LOI this year - can't get any action for the senior team then I think it's fanciful to think McMillan is in with a shout too. Come on Tets, you're usually well grounded and rational!

I think it sends a really bad message to the LOI - if playing, and scoring, in Europe doesn't get you into the national side, not even the squad, nothing will.
Byrne has been the outstanding player in the league this season, and still hasn't seen a minute of football under the new manager, despite being named on the bench twice, and (obviously) the team going goalless both times.

**paul_oshea** · 12/11/2020, 9:21 AM

That's a very fair point, i could produce a handful of pieces to back up the same which Kenny said himself back in the day when asked about Ireland squads and his players. It just goes to show Managers should really say nothing about their players as the subjective being objective is never the case.

In Byrnes case given the opposition and the general lack of scoring, and his ability to both shoot from distance and setup scoring chances it does seem shortsighted.

**tetsujin1979** · 12/11/2020, 9:28 AM

Originally Posted by paul_oshea

That's a very fair point, i could produce a handful of pieces to back up the same which Kenny said himself back in the day when asked about Ireland squads and his players. It just goes to show Managers should really say nothing about their players as the subjective being objective is never the case.

In Byrnes case given the opposition and the general lack of scoring, and his ability to both shoot from distance and setup scoring chances it does seem shortsighted.

Could you? Then you probably should.

**Stuttgart88** · 12/11/2020, 9:28 AM

Btw, I am now excited by this game

**nigel-harps1954** · 12/11/2020, 9:42 AM

I think Stutts has it fairly well covered, in fairness. Most of the LOI players worthy of callups, have been called up, or on the edges of international squads.

For those that aren't:

I'd say Sean Gannon is close enough, but he's never going to get past any of Coleman, Doherty or Christie.

Shields is unfortunate, probably deserved a callup last year, but has been more inconsistent this year. If Kenny were in charge 12 months ago, he might have had a shout.

There's not really any strikers in the LOI good enough. Serious lack of quality strikers within the league currently. Burke and Greene don't do it for me, and Rovers probably need a striker going into next year if they want to push on in Europe

**passinginterest** · 12/11/2020, 10:05 AM

Interesting suggested lineup from the42 https://www.the42.ie/england-ireland-5263690-Nov2020/
Republic of Ireland (Possible XI): Caoimhin Kelleher; Seamus Coleman (captain), Shane Duffy, John Egan, Matt Doherty; James McCarthy, Conor Hourihane; Daryl Horgan, Alan Browne, Robbie Brady; Adam Idah

In terms of form lines; Finland won 2-0 in France last night and Bulgaria 3-0 winners over Gibraltar.

**pineapple stu** · 12/11/2020, 10:12 AM

Originally Posted by tetsujin1979

I think it sends a really bad message to the LOI

Is that important though?

The LoI is a poor league that's going backwards the last few years (certainly in strength in depth, albeit that there's been a few EL group stage qualifications). It's a great league of course, but the point of the national team isn't to give the LoI a hands-up.

Too many LoI forwards have gone abroad recently and flopped - Hoban, Burke, McMillan off the top of my head - for an LoI player to be a serious contender for the national team at the moment unless they're really standing out.

**Tipp Townie** · 12/11/2020, 11:46 AM

Notwithstanding that he seems to be injured this time anyway, i just don't understand Kenny (or previously McCarthy's) attitude towards Shane Long. I'd have him in every squad. I take the point that his age will likely count against him looking forwards, and looking forwards is very important right now, but a bit of experience/nous in the squad wouldn't go amiss. I'd say he will still be able to do a shift come 2022

I do also appreciate that i'm massively biased though...

**Tipp Townie** · 12/11/2020, 11:52 AM

Anyway, against my better judgement i am also getting quite excited about tonight's game, even though my expectations are low. On top of that, it's my elder lad's 10th birthday tomorrow and he's asked to stay up and watch the game tonight... fingers crossed we've something to cheer. He's really nervous.

Personally i think the importance of tonight from a morale point of view, and Kenny's rep, outweighs that of Wales on Sunday, even though that obviously has more impact re. Nations League and avoiding relegation etc. I assume the Wales game carries more ranking points too- though i'd defer to others on that?

**Stuttgart88** · 12/11/2020, 11:56 AM

Originally Posted by nigel-harps1954

I think Stutts has it fairly well covered, in fairness. Most of the LOI players worthy of callups, have been called up, or on the edges of international squads.

For those that aren't:

I'd say Sean Gannon is close enough, but he's never going to get past any of Coleman, Doherty or Christie.

Shields is unfortunate, probably deserved a callup last year, but has been more inconsistent this year. If Kenny were in charge 12 months ago, he might have had a shout.

There's not really any strikers in the LOI good enough. Serious lack of quality strikers within the league currently. Burke and Greene don't do it for me, and Rovers probably need a striker going into next year if they want to push on in Europe

See, if even Nigel thinks there's nobody good enough in the LOI right now then we must really be at rock bottom

If Rovers lose Byrne next season I think someone like Paddy Madden would be a great option, or even if they retain Byrne. Different positions of course but Rovers really need a reliable goalscorer and as Nigel says, for Europe too.

**tetsujin1979** · 12/11/2020, 1:10 PM

James McCarthy has withdrawn from the squad

**Bielsa´s irish** · 12/11/2020, 1:52 PM

I hope he solves that issue. James will be back for the wales match. On Shane Long, sorry but I dont buy the injury and the short notice from the Saints camp. The thing is SK should have respect Long and named in the original squad

**paul_oshea** · 12/11/2020, 2:14 PM

McCarthy withdrew to watch the SCotland game with family.

**Fixer82** · 12/11/2020, 3:00 PM

Originally Posted by paul_oshea

McCarthy withdrew to watch the SCotland game with family.

It wouldn’t be an Ireland squad without McCarthy pulling out for injury or vague reasons

**Bielsa´s irish** · 12/11/2020, 3:18 PM

Come on guys, the kid got injured the last time while playing in Bratislava, he is our main asset at disposal, With the way things are panning out we need him happy in the camp, I buy the idea of him to start for the nations league games instead. He got kicked out of the match by that dirty Hamsik.