Today I'm ashamed to be Irish

[DubJohn]

I know nothing of the Beggars Bush incident.
I was however a proud part of the Palestinian falg waving in Landsdowne and wholeheartedly let my abhorance of Zionist opression in Occupied Palestine be known...

Who do you think you are? Osama? P.O'Neill?

You've been reading too many terrorist press releases.

You are indeed a tosser sir.

[Poor Student]

Where were you all when China came to town recently? Were there such sizeable protests outside their embassy? Did anyone have Tibetan or Taiwanese symbols? I don't think anyone could argue it was pure jump on the bandwagon stuff. That said I don't think we will see this happen too often as our opponents are one of the countries who will bring out this unique reaction. It's not exactly an ongoing problem to talk of solving is it? It won't rear its head again until we play one of a select few nations.

[redgav]

Israeli keeper, accused of foul play, attacked by fan


Gerry McDermott and Ben Quinn

06 June 2005
Israeli goalkeeper Dudu Awate was attacked in the team's hotel after Saturday night's World Cup qualifier in Lansdowne Road.

A man poured the contents of an ice-bucket over the back of the 27-year-old-goalkeeper as he walked through the lobby of Dublin's Burlington Hotel.

The incident followed a controversial 2-2 draw which angered Irish fans who claimed that the goalkeeper's overacting resulted in defender Andy O'Brien being sent off.

Israel security staff intervened after the player was attacked and it is claimed that punches were thrown in the ensuing melee.

"It was a lunatic who doesn't have anything to do with his life but attack me," journalists were later told by Awate.

It is believed that an Israeli TV crew may even have captured the attack on camera.

A contingent of gardai stationed at the hotel over the weekend as part the security operation are thought to have spoken about the incident with Awate andIsraeli officials.

However, a Garda spokesperson said that there was no record or a complaint being lodged, while a spokesperson for the hotel was also unaware of any complaints.

During the match, which saw Israel come back from two goals down, Awate was both the hero and villain.

He produced a string of saves to prevent Ireland scoring the winning goal but was booked for time-wasting and was involved in the controversial sending off, which the FAI are to appeal.

Television replays showed Awate throwing a punch at O'Brien and then feigning injury when O'Brien turned around to see who had struck him. But Awate, who was booed off the pitch at the end, claimed he was more sinned against than sinner.

"I don't know what the Irish are complaining about. I was the victim. I was punched all through the game," he said.

The President of the Israeli Football Association, Itzhak Menahem, said that they would not be filing an official complaint with soccer's world governing body FIFA. "The Irish people have treated us very well and this was only one supporter," he said.

Meanwhile, political tensions also led to scuffles on Saturday between Israeli fans and some participants in a pro-Palestinian march in Dublin city centre. There was a heavy Garda presence around Lansdowne Road in the run-up to the game

[Metrostars]

I know nothing of the Beggars Bush incident.
I was however a proud part of the Palestinian falg waving in Landsdowne and wholeheartedly let my abhorance of Zionist opression in Occupied Palestine be known...

It would be more appropriate if idiots like you brought your tricolour flags instead.

As someone said earlier, we like to call ourselves the best fans in the world at big tournaments such as the World Cup Finals. It's sad that a minority has has to spoil that reputation. But what is worse is the racism and anti-semetism directed at the Israeli fans. That is truly shamful.

[thecorner]

I know nothing of the Beggars Bush incident.
I was however a proud part of the Palestinian falg waving in Landsdowne and wholeheartedly let my abhorance of Zionist opression in Occupied Palestine be known...

and why were u taking it out on football fans????????/

[Munsterchick]

Roughly how many fans jumped on this 'bandwagon' then? Not just shameful, downright cringeworthy!

[AmenToThat]

Who do you think you are? Osama? P.O'Neill?

You've been reading too many terrorist press releases.

You are indeed a tosser sir.

Seems we have an 'Indo' reader on the board.
Heres a suggestion, why not learn to think for yourself instead of just repeating word for word what you read in the biased and morally bankrupt Irish press or hear your ****ed braindead mates moaning on about the pub on a saturday night.

[Green Tribe]

Donal, i didn't see any of these eejits taunting the israeli fans before the game. This is really awful to hear this. I was at the stadium quite early and met a few israeli supporters on the way, all singing, having fun, mostly middle-aged people and some with young children, i chatted to a few welcomed them to ireland etc, just how i would like to be treated wherever i would go as a fan. I am horrified to hear what went on outside these pubs , disgracing our country and our reputation as fans these morons are.

I didn't see the salutes either , If i had seen anyone saluting i would tell one of the stewards, wouldn't think twice about it. no salutes or nasty comments where i was sitting thank god, but plenty of flags i said to one wee twerp (obviously brainwashed) "do you not think you should have a flag like mine(irish flag)"? he just smirked, the brat. On the way back to the city centre, a few americans and english tourists stopped me to ask the score, they were nice, tried to cheer me up as they could see i was heart-broken. The only taunting i saw on the way back to the city centre was a few middle-aged irish supporters with a palestinian flag, shouting at israeli fans on the other side of the street, i told them to wise up, you're only looking for a beating..., they told me to f*ck off, charming! a few other teenyboppers were doing the same, but i was too scared to say anything to them as they were taller than me!

I did meet a nice israeli fan in my hostel, and he had spent 3 days in ireland already, and he said the people have been more than nice, he really loved dublin and the irish people. he said all the flags and whatever at the game didn't matter to him, but it still made me feel craapy. I had to make sure that he wasn't going back to haifa with a bad opinion of ireland

[Green Tribe]

I'd like to congratulate all those who condemned the evil Zionnist oppressive Regime that descriminates against the Christian and Islamic Palestinian people on a daily basis.

I proudly flew my Palestinian flag on the night and am only soirry more did not do likewise.

It sadly shows the lack of moral courage in Ireland today...

why didn't you concentrate on the main objective of that day, supporting your country in an important game, not hijacking a cause to wind up the israeli fans. You do not deserve to be called an Ireland fan.You're just trying to provoke them, try to cause a fight. I find this behaviour to be very typical of English supporters, wise the hell up!!!!!!!! I lost respect for Israel on Saturday, this respect I lost was for the team, in particular that excuse for a man Awat. But I would never deliberately try to wind up or provoke opposition fans in the way some did on saturday, grow up!!!!. And i would never disrespect a fan because of their team. I spoke to some afterwards, and they were disgusted at their goalie's actions too, but they were really happy with the result, but i wasn't, we should have won.

[FarBeag]

I did not see so much as reported, but its so sad that it came to this.I was seated in the South Bucket and some imbecile started shouting 'you fcuking Jewish Cnut ' to the goalkeeper.A bloke from Donegal built like a brickhouse approached him in a calm manner and said 'I am Jewish,have you got a problem with me then' This was the last word that came out of this fools filthy mouth.Apart from this some plastic bottles were also throw on to the field directed at the Israel Keeper,did anyone see this? It's all so embarrassing and if these rejects concentrated on directing their support for the Irish team instead of the sick insults thrown at the Israeli supporters then maybe we could have won the game.Jesus our supporters blow hot and cold during games.

[Karlos]

to throw my 2 cents in, I was disgusted by some of the antics of Irish fans inside the stadium. I sat in the West Lower right beside a small pocket of Isreali supporters who were pleasant and a good laugh - at one stage even mustering up a chant of 'shall we sing a song for you' and they didn't deserve the shameful abuse dished out. It was no worse than recent events I've seen at Madrid and Stadium of Light Sunderland involving Real Madrid and England 'supporters'. Unfortunetly it wasn't a 'minority' case in my section of seating.

I heard racist and biggoted comments made around me and this was even when we were 2-0 up.

If you can pinpoint a person making constant racist abuse, make a note of their seat number and report it to the FAI in writing along with any other witness who are willing to do it also. The beauty of the all seater stadia and block booking schemes means the person or their ticket allocation can be located and WILL be revoked by the FAI if they see fit. I've been involved with 2 such situations in the past (reporting them, that is! ) and the FAI will follow it up and keep you informed. At the very least a warning to future behaviour of the ticket holder will be issued.

You don't have to stand up to these people in person but don't let it slide. Do something about it. For instances that happened in the ground, it's the FAI you should be telling aswell as the foot.ie community

I'm a strong supporter of the anti-racism movement in football and urge you to not let this happen.

make a stand, it's never too late.

[Closed Account 2]

I saw one or two the Nazi salutes on TV (watched it in a Swedish bar), but heard there was more than a few people doing it.

Absolutely disgusting, I had a suspicion that the protest would generate anti Jewish stuff, but never thought so many of our "fans" would give a Nazi salute of all things. I am not supportive of some Israeli-Army actions (and some Palestinian actions), but how a sizable number of them could show such overt support for a regime that effectively killed so many millions of people (eg 20m Russians, 6m Jews, 6m Roma, 2m in the Balkans etc) in 12 or so years just beggars belief. I was against the protest because I knew something like this would happen, if the protest had gone ahead then it should have been at the Embassy, people should have sat down for their anthem, or should have declined to go to the game.

To any Jewish or Israelis reading this, I am sorry that some brainless people at the match made such disgusting actions, especially given your fans were very nice to Irish fans who were at the previous game in April. I can only say that these people brought shame on Ireland, and shame on Irish soccer.

[M@ttitude]

Well said, keep racism, politics and anything else that hasn't got to do with football OUT!! I told some idiot to get his palestine flag out of my face or ill stick it up his arse..

[Green Tribe]

[QUOTE=KarlosIRL]If you can pinpoint a person making constant racist abuse, make a note of their seat number and report it to the FAI in writing along with any other witness who are willing to do it also. The beauty of the all seater stadia and block booking schemes means the person or their ticket allocation can be located and WILL be revoked by the FAI if they see fit. I've been involved with 2 such situations in the past (reporting them, that is! ) and the FAI will follow it up and keep you informed. At the very least a warning to future behaviour of the ticket holder will be issued.
QUOTE]

good on you, Ireland does not need fans like this, I would do the same as yourself, there is just no need for racist and personal abuse at games.

[onenilgameover]

[QUOTE=kerr's tribe]

If you can pinpoint a person making constant racist abuse, make a note of their seat number and report it to the FAI in writing along with any other witness who are willing to do it also. The beauty of the all seater stadia and block booking schemes means the person or their ticket allocation can be located and WILL be revoked by the FAI if they see fit. I've been involved with 2 such situations in the past (reporting them, that is! ) and the FAI will follow it up and keep you informed. At the very least a warning to future behaviour of the ticket holder will be issued.
QUOTE]

good on you, Ireland does not need fans like this, I would do the same as yourself, there is just no need for racist and personal abuse at games.

I'ill second that did not think of that and its a great way to wash em out....supercool!

[soylent green]

Sport and Politics. See Tom Humphries take on it from yesterday's Times

Harkin back to when we had a conscience
Tom Humphries
06/06/2005


LockerRoom: On match days if you dawdle long enough at the crossroads outside Lansdowne Road you'll meet everyone. Including parts of your former self.


On Saturday I met a fella handing out leaflets about the Palestinian state. Hugh Harkin was his name. Still is probably. We shared a similar background. Well, same school, same straggly beards.

Hugh lamented that he was kind of a single-issue guy. I nodded sympathetically. Hugh is just an issue away from being a zero-issue guy. Like me.

Those of us who used to hand out leaflets and stand behind placards and banners and get dragged out of occupations trod a little uneasily through the crossroads on Saturday night. Somewhere along the line we got fat enough and comfortable enough to give things like playing soccer with Israel a free pass.

You can look at the series of games with Israel in a couple of ways. Four points dropped. Or just glad it's over. Mainly, being one of those who contributed so handsomely to the lack of debate over whether we should be playing Israel at all, I'm just glad it's over.

I left Hugh Harkin's company and drifted onward toward the little lane the press use for access to Lansdowne and was met straight away by a band of beery (my presumption) football fans who were blithely singing the words Football Not Politics, Football Not Politics as they chugged through the throng, disdaining the proffered leaflets lest they might learn something. A shiver took a long, leisurely walk down my back.

Football not politics! A level of intellectual engagement comparable with a three-year-old sticking his hands over his ears and screaming La! La! La! La! I'm Not Listening! La! La! La! Is that what we've become?

Well just about. We didn't even have a debate this time around about the necessary mingling of football and politics, about the implications of one state's representative team playing against another state's representative team regardless of what the other state represents.

Most of us had a few uneasy thoughts about the Israeli state when the draw was made and the fixtures were announced but we shelved them conveniently. Inside the ground on Saturday night, we old guilt-toting lefties were pleased to see a good scattering of Palestinian flags about the place. Some people had been more engaged than us. Thumbs up to them! We had a chuckle at the recordings of the two captains for Saturday night reading out a scripted statement for the Football against Racism campaign. Plenty of ironies there if you were a Palestinian listening in, heh, heh.

The problem, though, lies with us, with how complacent and distracted we've become. I can remember a couple of months ago leaving the Tel Aviv Hilton (reality central!) and wandering off in a state of semi-serious endeavour. I had the intention of re-educating myself about Israel. I found a bookshop and then lost concentration altogether. In the end I bought a book called How Israel Lost, by Richard Ben Cramer. Why that one?

Well I liked his biography of the baseball player Joe DiMaggio and his entertaining account of the 1988 US election. There might be good one-liners. The bookshop had a little section serving drinks and nice cakes and sticky buns so I sat down, got stuck into Richard Ben Cramer for about three minutes and then remembered I had some printouts of soccer articles from the Israeli media in my bag. Football not Politics. Sticky Buns too. Priorities puhl-ease.

I finished Richard Ben Cramer when I got home. Easier that way.

When I got home on Saturday night there was an email waiting for me from Hugh Harkin. I'll use a few paragraphs of it rather than paraphrase and pretend I thought of them myself.

"It may also be useful to add - knowing how difficult it is to keep track of alternative news - that despite the incessant mainstream chatter over 'disengagement' and the 'peace process', little, as always, has changed on the ground in Palestine. West Bank settlements continue to expand, Jerusalem is being irrevocably annexed, the Wall gets longer every day, and raids, arrests and killings are still the unreported lot of the ordinary Palestinian. As for this bloody 'disengagement', Amnesty's Israeli human rights partner B'Tselem released a report in March entitled One Big Prison, which stated pretty much bluntly that disengagement was occupation by remote control.

"And I regularly receive reports from Palestine myself, such as this heartbreaking one last week from friends in Jayyous, a West Bank village cut off from its (now annexed) farmland by the Wall, with access through one gate only: 'We call you to do something to help the farmers in Jayyous who couldn't reach their land since five days continuously. Every day the farmers go to gate number 25 and wait at the gate to open but no way.

"'The farmers and their families wait under the hot sun looking for this gate to open, but the hope disappears. The source of living for 300 families in Jayyous is through this gate. Who is responsible to feed the kids of these families? Who is responsible for the trees and vegetables which will die if this situation will continue? If this wall is build for security then who should be responsible for the life of 300 families in Jayyous?'"

So there you go. One small story, from one small almost forgotten place. There's lot of stories like that (and a lot worse) in Richard Ben Cramer's book, which is also shot through with the depressing thought that decades of military conscription have made the Israeli population more hawkish than they would naturally have become.

The absence of debate here merely reflects the absence of debate in Israel. The line of greatest paranoia is followed in Israel and accepted like a credit card everywhere else.

This time I'll quote Cramer.

". . . the shootings and suicide bombings started after Israel turned over policy on Palestine, and the Arabs who dwelt in it, to Jews who justified their seizure of the land, their occupation and the violence required to maintain it, simply and solely by their Jewishness, a promise to them by their God."

So here we are in this little country bedevilled by a history of occupation and religious extremism and acidic sectarianism and dividing walls and collectively we are chanting Football Not Politics!

Let Us Eat Cake And Sticky Buns! We're Not Listening. Blah, Blah, Blah! The old notion of a nation being loyal to the lessons of its own history has become as redundant as the thought that the measure of the success of the nascent Israeli state would be found in its treatment of Palestinians.

All these decades on and we have the new apartheid. Most of us haven't the energy or the cojones to stand up to it but the least we can do is not go chugging past singing Football Not Politics.

Like Shankly's nostrum about football being more important than life, it makes fools of us.

This column has no solutions but it knows this. We had a responsibility to have a debate. There are worse things in the world than what Dudu Aouate got up to on Saturday night.

[pegan]

One word, one feeling...

[Malby]

after what went on last nite

The filth and abuse showered on fellow football supporters that travelled half the globe to be here was a disgrace
Outside murrays last nite and gangs of "Irish" fans hurling abuse at the passing isrealis.

Palestine flag waving was bad enough,but chanting Murderers at them ( glass houses concept was lost on them ) but to have gangs of irish fans giving nazi salutes at them made me cringe

And as for our supposed "official supporters club", 2 of them ,dressed in their official black t-shirts ,hurling pints of stout at people walking past.I never came as close in my life to hitting someone as I did at that moment

For years ,away fans have strived to show that we are the best fans to travel, we enjoy ourselves,have a party etc etc .Last night detroyed that concept of Ireland fans being special, we are now as bad as The English

we went to Isreal and were treated with respect ,had a great beach party and a enjoyable few days ,How would people have felt if isreal supporters had lined the streets ,hurling beer at us ,calling us murderers while waving union jacks on our faces ?????????

Because that is exactly what "Irish people " did last night

I was outside the Lansdowne and I saw no such things going on!!

A chant of 'Where's your foreskin gone' went up but was taken in good humour by both sides as far as I could see.

Though after the match I would have quite happily turned into a suicide bomber to take that bloody keeper out!!!

[Plastic Paddy]

Though after the match I would have quite happily turned into a suicide bomber to take that bloody keeper out!!!

Not even in jest, Malby, not even in jest...

PP

[Malby]

Thank you Soylent green and thank you Tom Humphries for highlighting the plight of the Palestinian people who have to live under the evil Zionist regime in their own occupied lands.

Some here are so ignorant its untrue.

None are so blind as those who shall not see.

The Irish fans lost the 'best in the world' status when they blindly ignored the conditions the Palestinian People have to endure in order not to 'offend' the peole who flew the Zionist flag. the same flag that represents violent opression and a flag that is bankrolled and armed to the teeth by the Born Again regime in the Oval office.

Shame on any one calling themselves Irish who ignore tyranny...

Israel was formed by a UN mandate. We support the UN. Not all Israelis are zionists.