Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 37

Thread: Overlooked players

  1. #1
    First Team Fixer82's Avatar
    Joined
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Ceatharlach
    Posts
    2,159
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    746
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    523
    Thanked in
    359 Posts

    Overlooked players

    What players were criminally overlooked for Ireland?
    Players who got little or no caps, not through injury but due to the manager not fancying them.

    Andy Reid and Hoolahan are obvious ones to have been ignored for long periods of time but both got more than a handful.

    Off the top of my head, Rory Delap stands out as a player who was consistently ignored despite being a consistent performer in EPL. And one with a magic throw-in too.
    I remember him scoring a brace against Arsenal, including an overhead bicycle kick iirc and being snubbed for international call up three days later.
    Folding my way into the big money!!!

  2. Thanks From:


  3. #2
    First Team
    Joined
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    2,213
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    2,617
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    325
    Thanked in
    228 Posts
    I was going to say Rory Delap myself even before i got to him in your post. Look what Iceland did with those type of Throw Ins !

    If Rory had been around in Jack Charlton's time I’d say Rory would have a lot of Caps if even just off the bench !

    I certainly would have in the squad and at least on the bench much more than he was !

  4. #3
    Biased against YOUR club pineapple stu's Avatar
    Joined
    Aug 2002
    Location
    In the long grass
    Posts
    30,958
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    1,449
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    2,865
    Thanked in
    1,773 Posts
    Yeah, Delap was always a strange one. We've rarely been in a position where we could overlook Premier League regulars.

    Graham Kavanagh was a good grafter, but he was maybe more unlucky in that he was competing against Keane, Kinsella and Holland in centre-mid.

    Dave O'Leary of course!

    I don't think we've had too many though. Scotland, by comparison, seem to have loads for some reason. Alan Hansen, Brian McClair, John Wark, Pat Nevin, Steve Archibald, Lou Macari, Alan Gilzean, Ian St John, Pat Crerand, Gary Gillespie, Graeme Sharp, Alan McInally, Duncan Ferguson - none got more than 30 caps, and most got a good few less. Archibald got 27 caps but spent three years at Barcelona. Crerand got 16 caps but played in the 1968 European Cup final. McInally spent four years at Bayern but only got 8 caps. I think our efforts will pale in comparison with the Scots!

  5. Thanks From:


  6. #4
    First Team irishfan86's Avatar
    Joined
    Sep 2004
    Location
    Vancouver, BC, Canada
    Posts
    2,231
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    456
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    168
    Thanked in
    124 Posts
    Doherty the best contemporary example, but I suspect thatís about to change.

    I thought Keiren Westwood should have got a lot more caps ó I appreciate there were injury and perhaps attitude/commitment issues but he was the natural heir to Shay, no disrespect to David Forde.

  7. Thanks From:


  8. #5
    Biased against YOUR club pineapple stu's Avatar
    Joined
    Aug 2002
    Location
    In the long grass
    Posts
    30,958
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    1,449
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    2,865
    Thanked in
    1,773 Posts
    Always tough for keepers I guess, but yeah, with a lot more friendlies these days, there should be scope for more experimenting

  9. #6
    First Team
    Joined
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    2,213
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    2,617
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    325
    Thanked in
    228 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by pineapple stu View Post
    Yeah, Delap was always a strange one. We've rarely been in a position where we could overlook Premier League regulars.

    Graham Kavanagh was a good grafter, but he was maybe more unlucky in that he was competing against Keane, Kinsella and Holland in centre-mid.

    Dave O'Leary of course!

    I don't think we've had too many though. Scotland, by comparison, seem to have loads for some reason. Alan Hansen, Brian McClair, John Wark, Pat Nevin, Steve Archibald, Lou Macari, Alan Gilzean, Ian St John, Pat Crerand, Gary Gillespie, Graeme Sharp, Alan McInally, Duncan Ferguson - none got more than 30 caps, and most got a good few less. Archibald got 27 caps but spent three years at Barcelona. Crerand got 16 caps but played in the 1968 European Cup final. McInally spent four years at Bayern but only got 8 caps. I think our efforts will pale in comparison with the Scots!
    I think the Alan Hansen was Liverpool doing a Man Utd before Man Utd did it. Did Hansen actually make himself available for Scotland all that much ? ?

    Archibald , again was he making himself available for Scotland during a lot of that time ?

    Alan McInally got a serious injury and that may have affected him making himself available. He looked some Prospect before it all went Pete Tong.

    Ian Durrant of Rangers is another one. This one is probably entirely through Injury.

    For a Small Country like Scotland to lose two such prospects at such an early age to injury was particularly Bad Luck ! !

    It goes to show the quality of players Scotland had in the 60’s, 70’s and 80’s maybe a bit into the 90’s that a lot of the time there was no big Hurrah about some of them not playing for Scotland. Scotland had replacements not that far behind them !

    Kenny Daglish did play quite a lot for Scotland but did not do all that much for Scotland (if I recall correctly ). I wonder was he under instructions from Liverpool or self instructed not to get injured playing for Scotland ! !

  10. #7
    Biased against YOUR club pineapple stu's Avatar
    Joined
    Aug 2002
    Location
    In the long grass
    Posts
    30,958
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    1,449
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    2,865
    Thanked in
    1,773 Posts
    I've no idea why those got so few caps. It could be as you say, just not making themselves available. I'd be interested to know more. It's a heck of a lot of players to lose.

    McInally had injuries, true, but 8 caps is nothing for a guy at Bayern. .

    Archibald won the league with Aberdeen without being capped. Then all his caps were in a six-year spell at Spurs and Barca. Was still a Barca player when his international career ended.

    Dalglish is Scotland's top scorer, so harsh to accuse him of slouching I think.
    Last edited by pineapple stu; 30/05/2020 at 6:34 PM.

  11. Thanks From:


  12. #8
    First Team
    Joined
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    2,213
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    2,617
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    325
    Thanked in
    228 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by pineapple stu View Post
    I've no idea why those got so few caps. It could be as you say, just not making themselves available. McInally had injuries, true, but 8 caps is nothing for a guy at Bayern. It's a heck of a lot of players to lose though.

    Dalglish is Scotland's top scorer, so harsh to accuse him of slouching I think.
    30 goals in 102 caps. I just don’t ever remember seeing him playing that well for Scotland. Probably would only have seen him at World Cups. If I recall it was not considered that he had played that well for Scotland. Maybe the expectation was too high !

  13. #9
    Biased against YOUR club pineapple stu's Avatar
    Joined
    Aug 2002
    Location
    In the long grass
    Posts
    30,958
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    1,449
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    2,865
    Thanked in
    1,773 Posts
    Just looking into the Hansen thing there - suggestions that Ferguson preferred his Aberdeen centre-back pairing at international level too (McLeish and Miller), so didn't want Hansen breaking that up.

    Hansen was left out of the Scotland squad for 86 - when he was Liverpool's player of the year as they won the double - and Dalglish pulled out, maybe in protest.

    Suggestions also that Hansen was prone to missing friendlies, and that the Scots preferred domestic-based players to an extent (and the SPL was a good league back then of course)

    So all sorts of interesting stories - but it does seem like Scotland have shot themselves in the foot a number of times in the past with regards player selections. I don't think we've anyone really to compete with that (thankfully)

  14. Thanks From:


  15. #10
    Reserves
    Joined
    May 2003
    Location
    London
    Posts
    290
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    37
    Thanked in
    28 Posts
    We had a few players over the years who played regularly or semi regularly in the english top flight without getting any caps - John Coady, Tommy Gaynor, Paul McGee, Derek Geary are a couple that spring to mind. Alan Campbell was very unfortunate the season he scored a lot of goals in Spain.

  16. Thanks From:


  17. #11
    First Team
    Joined
    Oct 2016
    Posts
    1,028
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    17
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    239
    Thanked in
    182 Posts
    Matt Doherty is 28 with only 9 caps

  18. Thanks From:


  19. #12
    First Team
    Joined
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    2,213
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    2,617
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    325
    Thanked in
    228 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by Diggs246 View Post
    Matt Doherty is 28 with only 9 caps
    Considering the quality of his play the last few years that seems crazy ! !

    He must not have convinced Martin O’Neill and Roy Keane that he saw “ How great they Were ! "
    Last edited by seanfhear; 31/05/2020 at 4:39 AM.

  20. #13
    Reserves
    Joined
    Feb 2019
    Posts
    370
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    6
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    177
    Thanked in
    100 Posts
    Stephen McPhail only got 10 caps. Always thought he should have had a lot more... Earned his last cap at age 24...

  21. Thanks From:


  22. #14
    Biased against YOUR club pineapple stu's Avatar
    Joined
    Aug 2002
    Location
    In the long grass
    Posts
    30,958
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    1,449
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    2,865
    Thanked in
    1,773 Posts
    Was McPhail overlooked or did he just never reach his potential?

    Spent most of his career outside the Premier League with Barnsley and Cardiff. When Cardiff were promoted, they released McPhail.

  23. Thanks From:


  24. #15
    First Team
    Joined
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    2,213
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    2,617
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    325
    Thanked in
    228 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by pineapple stu View Post
    Was McPhail overlooked or did he just never reach his potential?

    Spent most of his career outside the Premier League with Barnsley and Cardiff. When Cardiff were promoted, they released McPhail.
    He was one who had a very promising early career but he never lived up to that. Was it injury / something else ?

  25. #16
    First Team Fixer82's Avatar
    Joined
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Ceatharlach
    Posts
    2,159
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    746
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    523
    Thanked in
    359 Posts
    Horgan certainly deserves more caps too I feel. He never played badly in a green shirt.
    Folding my way into the big money!!!

  26. Thanks From:


  27. #17
    First Team
    Joined
    May 2010
    Location
    Dublin
    Posts
    2,202
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    995
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    1,445
    Thanked in
    707 Posts
    Always felt McPhail was more suited to a continental game than English, and could have played more games abroad. Illness cost him game time, of course.

    Others...

    Gary Kelly (GK). Made the bench several times but never a minute of senior action.

    John Anderson and Ashley Grimes didn't really see many squads after Charlton took over and both ended up with under 20 caps.

    Mike Milligan - one cap wonder despite playing in the top two divisions for most of his career.

    Lots of others shone briefly - Jason Gavin, Michael Reddy, Lee Power (good call on Tommy Gaynor and Derek Geary, RiffRaff) - and a few were tried and discarded pretty quickly - Ken de Mange, Liam Daish, Jon Macken, Alan Moore, Thomas Butler, Alan Mahon. Less overlooked, I suppose, than didn't take their chance.

    <Edit> Could add Brian Carey to that list - capped while a Man Utd reserve before a tumble down the divisions.
    Last edited by Eminence Grise; 31/05/2020 at 1:56 PM.
    Hello, hello? What's going on? What's all this shouting, we'll have no trouble here!
    - E Tattsyrup.

  28. Thanks From:


  29. #18
    Coach John83's Avatar
    Joined
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Dublin
    Posts
    7,290
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    1,144
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    544
    Thanked in
    303 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by seanfhear View Post
    He was one who had a very promising early career but he never lived up to that. Was it injury / something else ?
    He was perceived as a very technically gifted passer, but not really physically up to the challenges of central midfield. I don't know how fair that was, but it's likely he needed the right environment to make it (3 central midfielders weren't as common then), and he never found it.
    Dental Plan

  30. Thanks From:


  31. #19
    Banned. Children Banned. Grandchildren Banned. 3 Months. Charlie Darwin's Avatar
    Joined
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    17,980
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    3,729
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    5,093
    Thanked in
    3,221 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by RiffRaff View Post
    We had a few players over the years who played regularly or semi regularly in the english top flight without getting any caps - John Coady, Tommy Gaynor, Paul McGee, Derek Geary are a couple that spring to mind. Alan Campbell was very unfortunate the season he scored a lot of goals in Spain.
    I think Stephen Quinn played in the same team as Geary without getting a cap, and only got one a few years later when he made the step up again.

  32. Thanks From:


  33. #20
    Reserves
    Joined
    Feb 2019
    Posts
    370
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    6
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    177
    Thanked in
    100 Posts
    Re McPhail

    He was very technically gifted, his performances for Ireland were good. I remember a friendly against Finland which was as good a Irish midfield display as Iíve ever seen. Obviously opposition and importance of game reduce how youíd rate it but he was superb.

    He grew up in an upper premier league environment. He went down two divisions to play regular football but it was a totally different game and he had to adapt to an environment where no one else was playing football and he was getting lumps kicked out of him. He did adapt but it took about a year.

    But he was one of the best midfielders in the championship for a few years and he captained an upper championship side. Eventually he got ill, I think, lymphoma - which was a career altering illness and led to him being released by Cardiff when they were promoted to the premier league.

    Itís often the case that good players get forgotten in the championship, or at least it was in the olden days when highlights were harder to come by. Wes only got into the irish team cause the public saw him on MOTD. Matt Doherty too - he was cracking in the championship for years but thereís far less eyes on you.

    Anyway, there were plenty of players much less talented than him who were part of the set-up.

    Itís also true he never reached his potential. Heís probably someone who could have blossomed had he played for that Reading side under Coppell or someone like that...

  34. Thanks From:


Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. RTE: Rodgers happy for Leicester to be overlooked
    By Foot.ie in forum Football Feeds
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 08/12/2019, 5:30 PM
  2. FIFA: Van Dijk: Overlooked diamond to global sensation
    By Foot.ie in forum Football Feeds
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 28/08/2019, 12:50 PM
  3. FIFA: Van Dijk: Overlooked diamond to global sensation
    By Foot.ie in forum Football Feeds
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 28/08/2019, 12:41 AM
  4. FIFA: Van Dijk: Overlooked diamond to global sensation
    By Foot.ie in forum Football Feeds
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 27/08/2019, 12:40 PM
  5. RTE: Neil Lennon defends 'overlooked' Celtic record
    By Foot.ie in forum Football Feeds
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 16/05/2019, 2:00 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •