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Thread: Post-1992 Ireland XI

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    Post-1992 Ireland XI

    The obsession with 1992 will annoy Pineapple Stu, but here's a bit of filler from a football site desperate for content:
    https://www.football365.com/news/pre...-keane-mcgrath

    Would anyone argue the point? Townsend and Coleman seem reasonable choices, but there's competition. Kilbane, yay or nay?
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    Always good filler, but we have such little genuine competition for places that once you pick the nailed-ons (Given, Keanes x 2, Duff) or stretch it to include players who spent most of their careers before '92 (McGrath - all hail) there isn't an embarassment of riches in most places.

    So, purely to be argumentative, here's an 'XI Better than their Caps Total Suggests' - injury-shortened careers, unlucky to have a better/preferred player ahead of them, just not in favour with the management, or the gods didn't smile on them somehow...

    Dean Kiely
    Kevin Foley Andy O’Brien Damien Delaney Curtis Fleming
    Steven Reid Graham Kavanagh Keith Fahey
    Eddie McGoldrick Keith O’Neill
    Stephen Elliot
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eminence Grise View Post
    Always good filler, but we have such little genuine competition for places that once you pick the nailed-ons (Given, Keanes x 2, Duff) or stretch it to include players who spent most of their careers before '92 (McGrath - all hail) there isn't an embarassment of riches in most places.

    So, purely to be argumentative, here's an 'XI Better than their Caps Total Suggests' - injury-shortened careers, unlucky to have a better/preferred player ahead of them, just not in favour with the management, or the gods didn't smile on them somehow...

    [TABLE]
    Dean Kiely
    Kevin Foley
    Andy O’Brien
    Damien Delaney
    Curtis Fleming
    Steven Reid
    Graham Kavanagh
    Keith Fahey
    Eddie McGoldrick
    Keith O’Neil
    Stephen Elliot
    That's a great shout actually EG.

    Are we talking about Irish players in general since the dawn of the PL, or Irish players who played in the PL?
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    Seeing that Keith O'Neill wouldn't last 5 minutes

    Keith O'Neill Andy Reid

    and this
    Curtis Fleming Jim Beglin

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    I just took '92 as the start date from John83's opening post, and decided that my team would be players who played all or at least most of their career after this, and not necessarily PL players, though it ended up that most played there for some period. Go back pre-'92 to, say, the start of the Charlton era (I'd have very shaky knowledge pre-'86) and some interesting names jump out. Gerry Peyton, 33 caps - but over 15 years - kept a clean sheet against Liverpool as a teenager on his debut. He was probably better than a lot of our first choices before and after him. Mark Kelly - 4 caps by 20, who knows what he might have become but for injury. Liam O'Brien...
    Hello, hello? What's going on? What's all this shouting, we'll have no trouble here!
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    Quote Originally Posted by geysir View Post
    Seeing that Keith O'Neill wouldn't last 5 minutes

    Keith O'Neill Andy Reid

    and this
    Curtis Fleming Jim Beglin

    Fnarf fnarf! So, by my reckoning that takes you up to 20 minutes in both positions!
    Hello, hello? What's going on? What's all this shouting, we'll have no trouble here!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eminence Grise View Post
    Fnarf fnarf! So, by my reckoning that takes you up to 20 minutes in both positions!
    No contest really.
    Keith O'Neill would trip over his shoelace and break his leg on his first game after a 12 month recovery from previously running into a blade of grass.
    Whereas Jim Beglin's promising career at the top level was destroyed by a late horror tackle.
    Andy's intl career was cut short by ill favour.

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    I thought Reid's problem was a tight g-string when it would have been better to b flat....
    Hello, hello? What's going on? What's all this shouting, we'll have no trouble here!
    - E Tattsyrup.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eminence Grise View Post
    I thought Reid's problem was a tight g-string when it would have been better to b flat....
    Maybe he was thinking of Stephen Reid, who seemed liable to be injured by physiotherapy, much less football.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eminence Grise View Post
    I thought Reid's problem was a tight g-string when it would have been better to b flat....
    I did not extrapolate on which factor brought Andy into ill favour with Trap. But according to your criteria "just not in favour with the management", Andy wins hands down over Keef whether it be musical or football favour. Andy was never a factor after Monenegro, when he was last seen disconsolate on the touchline after Trap decided not to bring him on to win a game, when a draw satisfied Trap's ambition.
    Whereas Keith was eventually brought back to the team, all was forgiven for Keith and as a consequence of that decision we were left inconsolably brokenhearted on the fields of Macedonia.

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    Maybe Andy R should have learned to play Bella Ciao. It could have made all the difference - for him and for us... I was looking at my team and wondering if Paddy Kenny or Rory Delap merit inclusion. Stephen McPhail. I'm sure there are others too. Actually, I'm sure there's a flip team out there too - an XI who I can't believe won as many caps as they did!
    Hello, hello? What's going on? What's all this shouting, we'll have no trouble here!
    - E Tattsyrup.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eminence Grise View Post
    Actually, I'm sure there's a flip team out there too - an XI who I can't believe won as many caps as they did!
    GK: David Forde (23)

    RB:
    CD: Paul McShane (31)
    CD: Darren O'Dea (20)
    LB: Stephen Ward (50)

    RW: Aiden McGeady (92)
    CM: Paul Green (20)
    CM: Glen Whelan (84)
    LW: Kevin Kilbane (110)

    ST: Andy Keogh (30)
    ST: Shane Long (80)

    Subs:
    Conor Sammon (9) (all in the same year!)
    Alan O'Brien (5)

    Obviously, all inclusions relative to their number of caps. I can't think of a decent right back, because we've been fairly blessed there with the likes of Finnan, Carr, Kelly, and Coleman in the time I've been watching Ireland.
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    I'd have Shane Duffy ahead of Dicky Dunne.
    I'd have McAteer on the right instead of Duff and Duff on the left instead of Kilbane
    Folding my way into the big money!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eminence Grise View Post
    Maybe Andy R should have learned to play Bella Ciao. It could have made all the difference - for him and for us... I was looking at my team and wondering if Paddy Kenny or Rory Delap merit inclusion. Stephen McPhail. I'm sure there are others too. Actually, I'm sure there's a flip team out there too - an XI who I can't believe won as many caps as they did!
    I get the flip team idea but there is no argument with Jim Beglin - a class act v your Curtis Fleming - a good durable plodder. And Keith O'Neill after his appearance at Montenegro 1999 and previous form, would inspire the gravest apprehension in the bravest of souls. If in your opinion Andy Reid could not rate higher than the hapless Keith in the forgotten/neglected but talented players, then that will surely subtract from your football soul.

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    Quote Originally Posted by John83 View Post
    GK: David Forde (23)

    RB:
    CD: Paul McShane (31)
    CD: Darren O'Dea (20)
    LB: Stephen Ward (50)

    RW: Aiden McGeady (92)
    CM: Paul Green (20)
    CM: Glen Whelan (84)
    LW: Kevin Kilbane (110)

    ST: Andy Keogh (30)
    ST: Shane Long (80)

    Subs:
    Conor Sammon (9) (all in the same year!)
    Alan O'Brien (5)

    Obviously, all inclusions relative to their number of caps. I can't think of a decent right back, because we've been fairly blessed there with the likes of Finnan, Carr, Kelly, and Coleman in the time I've been watching Ireland.
    You have to have Sammon in there over Long. Sammon was a dreadful footballer, no idea how he got 9 caps.

    Long is 33 and has been deservedly playing for us for 13 years, with his goal ratio similar to Quinn's! Not to mention the Germany goal!

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    I've said it before and I'll say it again. For all his height and awkwardness, Sammon wasn't actually that good in the air. And was actually better on the deck. I remember him picking Robbie out for a couple of goals in friendlies and being pleasantly surprised by his awareness and assists.

    But yes, not international standard unfortunately.
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    Quote Originally Posted by geysir View Post
    I get the flip team idea but there is no argument with Jim Beglin - a class act v your Curtis Fleming - a good durable plodder. And Keith O'Neill after his appearance at Montenegro 1999 and previous form, would inspire the gravest apprehension in the bravest of souls. If in your opinion Andy Reid could not rate higher than the hapless Keith in the forgotten/neglected but talented players, then that will surely subtract from your football soul.
    Beglin was a superb player, but gone before '92 which I took as the start date. Push the date back and I agree he's a shoe-in. Fleming was a solid pro without being anything special who could have wone more caps at a different time -an unlucky Stephen Ward prototype, maybe?

    Andy v Keith? Positional stuff. I always thought Andy was best centrally.* Mind you, both scored the same number of goals (4) - though Keith in just less than half the games... Discuss, with examples. (Sorry - I'm spending waaaay too much time reformattting exam papers to other assessment forms at the mo and cabin fever is beginning to set it...)

    *Drop McGoldrick, push Steven Reid right and play Andy at 10 in a 4411? Less down the flanks, but more creative in the middle?
    Hello, hello? What's going on? What's all this shouting, we'll have no trouble here!
    - E Tattsyrup.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eminence Grise View Post
    Always good filler, but we have such little genuine competition for places that once you pick the nailed-ons (Given, Keanes x 2, Duff) or stretch it to include players who spent most of their careers before '92 (McGrath - all hail) there isn't an embarassment of riches in most places.

    So, purely to be argumentative, here's an 'XI Better than their Caps Total Suggests' - injury-shortened careers, unlucky to have a better/preferred player ahead of them, just not in favour with the management, or the gods didn't smile on them somehow...

    Dean Kiely
    Kevin Foley Andy O’Brien Damien Delaney Curtis Fleming
    Steven Reid Graham Kavanagh Keith Fahey
    Eddie McGoldrick Keith O’Neill
    Stephen Elliot
    Perhaps Alan Kelly in goal - heir-apparent to Packie in 1994, first-choice for the Euro 96 campaign, then Shay came on the scene and he ended up with only 34 caps.
    With the wealth of right-backs we had from the late 1980s to the mid 2000s, you could include any of Kelly (Stephen or Gary), Carr, Morris or Finnan, but the stand-out would probably be Premier League-winning Jeff Kenna with 27
    Up front, surely Didsy over Stephen Elliott

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    Kelly and Finnan have over 50 caps and Carr over 40. Finnan and Carr born within a few months of each other in 76 and Kelly in 74. Three cracking footballers. You'd think that if any two of the three were not as good then any one of the three could have had over 100 caps.

    I would say Finnan was my favourite but I would also say that, relative to talent, Carr under-achieved and Finnan over-achieved.

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    John Sheridan. With the Irish senior team for 7 years, played in two World Cups and was one of the most naturally gifted footballers available to us.

    34 caps!!
    Folding my way into the big money!!!

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