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Thread: All-Ireland League Thread

  1. #781
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    Quote Originally Posted by Straightstory View Post
    Yeah? They had little concern to riot about recently, but they still caused trouble - and yes, there weren't many of them. The announcement of a British withdrawal would mean trouble on an infinitely greater scale. I think if the majority in the north vote for a United Ireland, then a United Ireland there should be. However, many Unionists won't go quietly into a United Ireland. (After all, Republicans/Sinn Fein/The IRA never accepted the legitimacy of the Unionist Majority). There will be a bloody conflict and anyone who thinks otherwise is naive in the extreme.
    You obviously haven't been listening to unionists and loyalists in the north if you think they think they had little to riot about recently. They believe that the UK has bene broken, and they're now in an economic united Ireland.

    The days of ANY side using violence in the north to promote or stop things should be long over. I'd agree that some form of violence would be inevitable, but I think it would be containable and not last beyond the short-term to any great extent. What would loyalists be fighting for once London left ? It's also important to note that both NI and the south were born in violence 100 years ago, and that didn't stop either happening.

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    Without wishing to stray balls deep into a politica discussion on the subject, but I've always felt that Britain views NI the sane way it views the malvinas(falklands) or gibraltar.
    On the flip side I can't say for sure that people/politicians in the South of Ireland are really that interested in acquiring/unifying the North.
    My own uneducated guess would be for Northern Ireland to just become independent of all outside interference just like one of the former Yugoslavia nations.

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    International Prospect sbgawa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by placid casual View Post
    Without wishing to stray balls deep into a politica discussion on the subject, but I've always felt that Britain views NI the sane way it views the malvinas(falklands) or gibraltar.
    On the flip side I can't say for sure that people/politicians in the South of Ireland are really that interested in acquiring/unifying the North.
    My own uneducated guess would be for Northern Ireland to just become independent of all outside interference just like one of the former Yugoslavia nations.
    They tried that independence lark for 50 years and the Unionists gerrymandered the election process to keep large numbers of Catholics homeless and unemployed not to mention denying many of them a vote at all.
    Not sure the Nationalists would see independence as a solution

  4. #784
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    Quote Originally Posted by EatYerGreens View Post
    It's not about my politics to state that :

    1) UEFA isn't the only way that a single league on the island would be possible.

    2) That political unification would obviously also lead to football joining together.

    3) That polls suggest that the majority of people north and south think that political unification will happen within the next generation (and thereby football unification too).

    The above are statements of facts, not politics. If you're not happy with them, you're barking at the moon. Have a go at your fellow kinsfolk in the north for daring to have a view you disagree with.
    It appears that UEFA may be willing to drop their previous opposition to cross-border leagues, which opens up the clear possibility of an AIL on this island, and very soon at that.

    I had thought that this was what we were discussing.

    The fact that you believe that there may also at some stage in the future be a major change in the political settlement in Ireland is all very well, but the consequences of any such change would extend into much more important aspects of all our lives than mere football.

    So why don't you take this extraneous stuff to the Football Section of a Political site, rather than polluting a Football site with politics?

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    Quote Originally Posted by EalingGreen View Post
    It appears that UEFA may be willing to drop their previous opposition to cross-border leagues, which opens up the clear possibility of an AIL on this island, and very soon at that.

    I had thought that this was what we were discussing.

    The fact that you believe that there may also at some stage in the future be a major change in the political settlement in Ireland is all very well, but the consequences of any such change would extend into much more important aspects of all our lives than mere football.

    So why don't you take this extraneous stuff to the Football Section of a Political site, rather than polluting a Football site with politics?
    I repeat again, this is the point where this whole sub-discussion arose from :

    Quote Originally Posted by Kiki Balboa View Post
    If it goes ahead (i.e. UEFA supporting cross-border leagues), it really would be the best (and possibly only) opportunity to implement a full integrated league system within Ireland.
    UEFA clearly ISN'T the only route to getting a single integrated league system on the island. Politics would also be another route for that - as I've outlined a number of times now. So it therefore isn't extraneous to raise it - particularly in the context of the above point which originated the discussion.

    I appreciate that you personally don't want this point clarified or discussed, but that's not your call. And it appears that a number of others do want it discussed. So if you don't like it, don't read it.
    Last edited by EatYerGreens; 26/04/2021 at 4:44 PM.

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    https://twitter.com/SeanKellyMEP/sta...eTcL8nUbEE00Pg

    Irish MEP supports an All-Ireland league.

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    Quote Originally Posted by EatYerGreens View Post
    The new IFA President apparently thinks referring to Northern Ireland as small is "slightly pejorative". He'd better get onto the Our Wee Country crowd.

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    Quote Originally Posted by EatYerGreens View Post
    I find it amusing/ frustrating that the people he name checks in the article all come from a strong League of Ireland background and none from the Irish league, (Kenny Shields, Baraclough and Michael O'Neill).

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    I have to admit my enthusiasm for an all Ireland league have waned considerably over the years. I think the security would be headache for clubs for a start. I just not sure the hassle and logistics would bear fruit for out club’s financially. I think initially there would be big interest in an all Ireland league but I reckon that would wane after a year or two.

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    Regarding Irish League opposition, maybe LOI clubs could join (or in the case of Shels and Bohemian FC, re-join) the Irish League?

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    Quote Originally Posted by D24Saint View Post
    I have to admit my enthusiasm for an all Ireland league have waned considerably over the years. I think the security would be headache for clubs for a start. I just not sure the hassle and logistics would bear fruit for out club’s financially. I think initially there would be big interest in an all Ireland league but I reckon that would wane after a year or two.
    I'm probably of the same vein but the money if it became one of these "hands across the border" type government deals could be immeasurably more than we are getting now which might make us think twice.
    On the other hand given it will probably just mean 5k a week for Pat Hoooban/ A.N .Others at Pats/DFC/Bohs/Rovers maybe the clubs wont benefit that much.......
    I'm getting old..er and more cynical

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    Simple solution, money is only given out initially for stadia until all grounds are up to similar levels!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nesta99 View Post
    Simple solution, money is only given out initially for stadia until all grounds are up to similar levels!

    Jaysus 10 Tallaght stadium built, you might as well put me in the condolences thread now i'm definitely not expecting to live to see that

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    Im being fair and balanced, no self interest at all, Nor would I want fans of any other club feeling that it would be unfair!!

  18. #796
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiki Balboa View Post
    I find it amusing/ frustrating that the people he name checks in the article all come from a strong League of Ireland background and none from the Irish league, (Kenny Shields, Baraclough and Michael O'Neill).
    Er, Magherafelt man Shiels played for half a dozen IL clubs before becoming a manager.

    He then spent 15 years managing Tobernore, Carrick, Coleraine, Moyola Pk, Ballymena and Larne, before moving to GB for 8 years (Tranmere, Kilmarnock and Morton), plus a brief spell in Thailand(!) before his three year spell at Derry City. And he's been working for the IFA since then.

    Michael O'Neill played his youth football in NI before joining Coleraine, from where he went to GB for 15 years, before finishing playing with Glentoran. He also gained 31 NI caps.

    As a manager, he cut his teeth with Cowdenbeath and Brechin before his 3 yeear spell at Shams, prior to 8 years managing NI (now 2 years at Stoke).

    While Baraclough spent 20 years as a player in his native England. As for his 11 years in management, just 2 1/2 years of those were with Sligo, the rest having been in England, Scotland and NI.

    To imply that any of those was made in the LOI ("strong background") is grossly overstating it.

    But there's no need to thank us for our boys' contribution to your league - we like to think of it as "missionary work"!

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    Quote Originally Posted by D24Saint View Post
    I have to admit my enthusiasm for an all Ireland league have waned considerably over the years. I think the security would be headache for clubs for a start. I just not sure the hassle and logistics would bear fruit for out club’s financially. I think initially there would be big interest in an all Ireland league but I reckon that would wane after a year or two.
    It's funny, but my enthisiasm has probably increased, not waned.

    Originally I was opposed, due to 3 matters of principle:
    1. An AIL should not in any way corrode the separate existence and identity of the IFA/NI team etc;
    2. NI's separate European entries would need to be guaranteed;
    3. Those clubs joining an AIL should not be cut-off from the clubs left behind i.e. there would have to be a credible pyramid system beneath the AIL to provide genuine P&R.

    But recent developments have suggested that the first two will be respected, and for the third, the IL is now reasonably well positioned in this respect, while the "new" FAI might just get its act together now that Delaney is no longer responsible for the "problem child", to introduce a proper pyramid of its own.

    That being the case, I can see why, with the increasing "internationalisation" of club football, especially the increasing domination of the EPL and Champions League etc, that with a total population of 7 million, Ireland will find it increasingly impossible to maintain two separate pro- or semi-pro leagues totalling 22 clubs.

    However if properly organised, it might just maintain a top tier of, say a dozen competitive, f-t clubs, with P&R from two pyramids beneath, IL and LOI.

    Mind you, the key is the "properly organised" bit and there remains a hell of a lot of work to be done before that will come about.

    "Project 2030"?

  20. #798
    International Prospect sadloserkid's Avatar
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    I can't see any way an All-Ireland league keeps all the European places. It just seems like a complete non-runner.

  21. #799
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    Quote Originally Posted by sadloserkid View Post
    I can't see any way an All-Ireland league keeps all the European places. It just seems like a complete non-runner.
    When Lucid (I iknow, I know) was talking about this a while back, there were clear indications from UEFA that the separate Euro entries would be preserved - the new multi-team European Conference League helps greatly in this respect.

    And the IL teams are still seemingly supportive of an AIL. You can be certain they wouldn't if they thought they would have to compete with the likes of Shams, Bohs, Dundalk and Derry etc for four or five Irish European places.

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    I wouldn't be upset if it came to pass, it just feels unlikely that eight of a twelve team top tier could play in Europe every year. Could be interesting though if it came to pass. Do you then get a Baltic League of 12 teams for example, all of whom qualify for Europe every year.

    Lucid was a blocker to any chance of it coming to pass anyway, there was so little substance to his proposals it made the whole thing seem fantastical. Never was a man more woefully named.

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