All-Ireland League Thread

**pineapple stu** · 09/04/2021, 8:40 AM

Actually, the Dutch league is broadcast in Arabic in Morocco.

Which, now that you've clarified your initial point, means it's still somewhat undermined. The Dutch and Belgian leagues both have global TV deals, so there being two broadcasting languages in Belgium and only one in Holland isn't necessarily that big a deal in the global scale of things.

Also, on a more general level and because I don't think this has been mentioned as yet, but the BeNe league doesn't have a TV deal worth €400m. It doesn't have any TV deal. It has a report from Deloitte* saying that a joint TV deal "could" be worth in the region of €250m to €400m. You would have to imagine that the upper boundary of that would be dependent on maximising international rights. Of course, outside of Declan Conroy's fantasy world, the LoI doesn't have to worry about international rights.

* - The cynic in me would also note that Deloitte also said the FAI's finances were fine, so I'll believe those figures when/if I see them.

**EatYerGreens** · 09/04/2021, 11:46 AM

Originally Posted by pineapple stu

Actually, the Dutch league is broadcast in Arabic in Morocco.

Which, now that you've clarified your initial point, means it's still somewhat undermined. The Dutch and Belgian leagues both have global TV deals, so there being two broadcasting languages in Belgium and only one in Holland isn't necessarily that big a deal in the global scale of things.

Also, on a more general level and because I don't think this has been mentioned as yet, but the BeNe league doesn't have a TV deal worth �400m. It doesn't have any TV deal. It has a report from Deloitte* saying that a joint TV deal "could" be worth in the region of �250m to �400m. You would have to imagine that the upper boundary of that would be dependent on maximising international rights. Of course, outside of Declan Conroy's fantasy world, the LoI doesn't have to worry about international rights.

* - The cynic in me would also note that Deloitte also said the FAI's finances were fine, so I'll believe those figures when/if I see them.

Well there is no BeNe league at the moment - just an aspiration in some quarters to have one. So no great surprise really that it doesn't have concrete commercial arrangements yet

The fact that you keep digging the hole on that Moroccan thing is hilarious

**pineapple stu** · 09/04/2021, 12:09 PM

Originally Posted by EatYerGreens

Well there is no BeNe league at the moment - just an aspiration in some quarters to have one. So no great surprise really that it doesn't have concrete commercial arrangements yet

True, but given the figure was quoted, more than once, by Buller on this thread - one of the posters most in favour of this - then it's relevant to point out that it is complete pie in the sky at present. So a post like -

Originally Posted by Buller

So together currently generate €160m between them at the moment, and joining together would push that to €400m. Joining two markets pushes value up disproportionately higher than you would expect.

- is immediately undermined, and that's worth pointing out.

Originally Posted by EatYerGreens

The fact that you keep digging the hole on that Moroccan thing is hilarious

Not really - just countering your point about one broadcasting language in Holland affecting the TV rights deal. If you have an argument to make against my suggestion that the number of domestic languages isn't really relevant in the context of a global TV deal, fire ahead.

**EatYerGreens** · 09/04/2021, 1:27 PM

Originally Posted by pineapple stu

Not really - just countering your point about one broadcasting language in Holland affecting the TV rights deal. If you have an argument to make against my suggestion that the number of domestic languages isn't really relevant in the context of a global TV deal, fire ahead.

And still you keep digging !

Look - it's very simple. Having a league which has to be broadcast domestically in two languages will obviously increase broadcast costs/complexity and make it intrinsically less appealing for advertising. Because you split the potential viewing audience into two, so any commercial entity wishing to target them then has to double their activity/spend to reach the total audience across the two languages. The overseas broadcast stuff is irrelevant in that, as it will always be broadcast overseas in the target language anyway. That has no influence or bearing at all upon the reality of having to broadcast domestically in two different languages across different channels, and the implications that has cost-wise and commercially.

For the love go God, let it go man....

**sbgawa** · 09/04/2021, 1:46 PM

At the risk of coming between a rock and a hard place, the languages is in all likelihood a non issue.
I remember watching Grahame Burke at Preston when you could watch whatever Championship game you wanted via the "red Button" on whatever channel was showing it (i think it was BT) by picking your match after pressing the red button from the alternatives offered, the half time adverts were all the same.
You would have the cost of an extra commentator studio based i guess.

**pineapple stu** · 09/04/2021, 1:52 PM

Originally Posted by sbgawa

At the risk of coming between a rock and a hard place, the languages is in all likelihood a non issue.
I remember watching Grahame Burke at Preston when you could watch whatever Championship game you wanted via the "red Button" on whatever channel was showing it (i think it was BT) by picking your match after pressing the red button from the alternatives offered, the half time adverts were all the same.
You would have the cost of an extra commentator studio based i guess.

Exactly. And the cost of an extra commentator is tiny in the context of the overall package.

EYG is still ignoring the global nature of TV deals these days, which come in all sorts of languages and overseas broadcast is certainly not "irrelevant" as overseas is a growing market and in fact for the Premier League, overseas is worth almost the same as domestic now. So Belgium having two broadcast languages is tiny in that context, even before you factor in that the broadcast just slots in around ads, etc.

**WeAreRovers** · 09/04/2021, 2:26 PM

Broadcaster staffer here, multi-lingual coverage is essentially a non-issue. Carry on...

**Bucket** · 09/04/2021, 2:43 PM

But replays are an issue?

**EatYerGreens** · 09/04/2021, 2:58 PM

Originally Posted by sbgawa

At the risk of coming between a rock and a hard place, the languages is in all likelihood a non issue.
I remember watching Grahame Burke at Preston when you could watch whatever Championship game you wanted via the "red Button" on whatever channel was showing it (i think it was BT) by picking your match after pressing the red button from the alternatives offered, the half time adverts were all the same.
You would have the cost of an extra commentator studio based i guess.

That suggests that the same channels in Belgium broadcast in different languages at the same time. They don't. You have Wallonian language channels and Vlaams language channels (plus German for the east, but we'll ignore that). There isn't just one channel doing both simultaneously. There is no unified national TV broadcaster in Belgium. There aren't even unified broadcasting, media or advertising laws - as they're decided on a regional basis too. Different people watch different 'regional' channels on the basis of the language they use. And not every channel in Belgium is accessible in every part of Belgium either.

It's not like the Irish model where RTE is available in English everywhere, and chucks in the occasional show 'as Gaeilge'.

**EatYerGreens** · 09/04/2021, 3:05 PM

Originally Posted by WeAreRovers

Broadcaster staffer here, multi-lingual coverage is essentially a non-issue. Carry on...

Someone who lived in Belgium here (Mechelen). It is in a country where there is no single channel covering the whole place, and instead there are completely separate channels covering each language in each linguistic region.

Belgium makes Northern Ireland look like a model of social/community integration

**nigel-harps1954** · 09/04/2021, 7:04 PM

Ireland and Belgium are very different.

**Kiki Balboa** · 09/04/2021, 8:13 PM

Originally Posted by EatYerGreens

Someone who lived in Belgium here (Mechelen). It is in a country where there is no single channel covering the whole place, and instead there are completely separate channels covering each language in each linguistic region.

Belgium makes Northern Ireland look like a model of social/community integration

Eh... a bit far , all hings considered....

**Mr_Parker** · 10/04/2021, 11:02 AM

Originally Posted by EalingGreen

Actually you're right, but so what if it is?

It has no relevance to any proposed AIL.

Meanwhile, as far as IL competitiveness goes, Linfield, Crues and Glens already are (or are about to go) f-t. All three have big plans for the future.

And Larne's benefactor has big ambitions (and big money!) to do the same for them - f-t contracts, stadium, European aspirations etc. So that if they can make the same progress over the next 3 or 4 years we've seen over the last 3, then you couldn't discount them.

While Coleraine are very well managed, and Portadown have potential (though they've ****ed it up the wall for a decade or more).

And all the above would surely prompt Cliftonville to try to keep up - Mr.P, any comment?

My guess is that if an AIL doesn't actually materialise for another 3(?) years, and the IL continues in the interim to grow as it has recently, I'd suggest that it could contribute 4, 5 or even 6 clubs who would all be competitive in the company of their LOI counterparts. For if an AIL produced the revenues which its backers are projecting, then being generally well-managed clubs, they all have the potential to grow to be bigger fish in a bigger pond.

Of all you have said, only Linfield have the potential to be a truly full time club. While others have been playing with the concept, none of them are close to what is a full time set up. Indeed I am aware of frustration and doubt within those same clubs, that fulltime football is something that will work in the short to medium term for them. There are a few egos that are driving their push to fulltime, while others in their clubs see the realities. It's the same egos that want to see an AIL so that they can play football manager on a larger scale. If they try to follow the same paths as some LOI clubs, then it will end in tears imo.

As for Cliftonville, and indeed the rest of the clubs, of course they will want to "keep up" with their competitors, but I doubt they will risk their existence just to do so.

**EatYerGreens** · 10/04/2021, 2:35 PM

Originally Posted by Kiki Balboa

Eh... a bit far , all hings considered....

It really isn't. Belgium basically isn't a single country. It's two countries that just about manage to remain together, with a King and a football team being pretty much the only thing that unifies them. Although even within that the football team inevitably has to take 'sides', as it has to be managed, play etc in one or other language. Same with fans singing.

People don't seem to realise how divided Belgium is. At least NI has a single language that everyone uses, media they all share etc. Just because Belgians don't riot occasionally doesn't make it a more coherent society. Belgium went almost 2 years without a government recently as the two sides couldn't agree on one. And unlike in NI with its recent Assembly down-time, there is no fall back solution when an entire country doesn't have someone to run it. But hey - the big issue there is apparently that a few people are Moroccan....

**pineapple stu** · 10/04/2021, 3:11 PM

Originally Posted by EatYerGreens

But hey - the big issue there is apparently that a few people are Moroccan....

Which of course has nothing at all to do with what I was saying.

But you keep telling us how you know more about TV deals than someone who actually works in TV. It would go well alongside your pyramid system that didn't actually have a pyramid system.

**EatYerGreens** · 10/04/2021, 4:33 PM

Originally Posted by pineapple stu

Which of course has nothing at all to do with what I was saying.

But you keep telling us how you know more about TV deals than someone who actually works in TV. It would go well alongside your pyramid system that didn't actually have a pyramid system.

And you keep claiming you know more about Belgium than someone who actually lived there !

Which is doubly funny when you have a weird obsession with Moroccans (some 'interesting' holiday experiences to share with the class ?), yet still managed to over-inflate the number in Belgium by a factor of 4.

For the love of God - move on before you make this any worse !

**sadloserkid** · 10/04/2021, 5:25 PM

Originally Posted by EatYerGreens

For the love of God - move on before you make this any worse !

He might be able to if you stopped bringing it up.

**pineapple stu** · 10/04/2021, 6:40 PM

Originally Posted by EatYerGreens

And you keep claiming you know more about Belgium than someone who actually lived there !

"Living in Belgium" isn't really a point in defence of your claim that having to broadcast in two languages devalues the value of its league's TV rights.

My point that global TV rights are sold in lots of languages so what's one more, and WaR's point that languages don't really impact broadcasting anyway, do counter your point.

And that, so far as I can see, is where the matter sits at the moment.

**EatYerGreens** · 10/04/2021, 6:56 PM

Originally Posted by pineapple stu

"living in belgium" isn't really a point in defence of your claim that having to broadcast in two languages devalues the value of its league's tv rights.

My point that global tv rights are sold in lots of languages so what's one more, and war's point that languages don't really impact broadcasting anyway, do counter your point.

And that, so far as i can see, is where the matter sits at the moment.

MOD EDIT : Stop. Please.