Aye right, let's just ignore the facts then.Originally Posted by RathfarnhamHoop
Er, yes.
But that doesn't absolve DCFC, it makes it worse!
That is, even after being gifted a tidy new stadium rebuilt with public money, they still can't manage their affairs.
Or do you imagine that eg their neighbours in Ballybofey or Sligo wouldn't want to be in the same situation?
If it were one driver saying it you'd have a point. Every single club in the LOI has said things need to change though so at the stage when there's 20/20(19/19 if you exclude limerick) drivers saying the cars at fault then it's definitely the cars fault.
Clubs are driving carefully, look at sligo, invested in facilities, great local engagement, play the market well, offer low wages, strict budget, yet they still rely massively on extra fundraising.
Just accept that the system is broken despite whatever the chip you have on your shoulder about derry tells you.
Exactly what Derry did. They may have gone bust in the process but that doesn't mean that since then they've gone back to living within their means just as much as Glentoran.Glentoran accepted they'd screwed up and went back to living within their means in order to clear up their own mess.
Over and above that, they and the other senior clubs, in conjunction with the IFA, worked hard to reform the system to make it work.
They didn't just throw their hands up and blame everyone else.
Which is exactly what Derry have said what should be done. I don't see how you've read it any differently. There's that chip again I suspect.
You clearly have issues with Derry for whatever reason and refuse to see the truth so as far as I'm concerned this conversation is over
The clear implication of all that is that it simply isn't possible for the ROI to sustain a professional football league (whether f-t, p-t or a mix of the two), without also bringing in a handful of clubs from outside?
Wow! Whatever happened to the first 80 or 90 years of the LOI then?
The "system" may be broken, I'll give you that.
But that's hardly the same as saying it's broken beyond repair.
My advice would be to prove you can fix the car and drive it properly, before looking for a bigger, faster car and taking it onto the new motorway.
Just like the IL has been forced to do.
Wtf!
DCFC are only still in business today because (a ) they were able to walk away from their debts; (b ) they received huge public moneys to gift them a new ground; and (c ) they've had a benefactor pumping huge amounts into the club for a decade(?) eg
The director’s report said that the club’s income for the year [2017] “includes a donation of £225,000 from Philip O’Doherty”:
https://fora.ie/derry-city-fc-philip...81884-Jan2018/
Whatever happens in future, none of that applied to GFC over the same period.
Right, so when you can't/wont play the ball, you resort to playing the man then?
For the record, I have no "chip" on my shoulder over DCFC. I regret that they were forced to leave the IL, just as I regret that the IL didn't do more/better to keep them.
But it was a long time ago, they're content to be where they are and we're managing without them, so I'm over it.
Moreover, assuming a number of obstacles can be overcome (IFA to remain independent; IL's European places to be preserved; summer/winter calendar; rest of the NI pyramid not cast adrift etc), then I am in favour of any new AIL which could overcome them and offer the rewards being promised.
But just as LOI clubs might (properly) be concerned that too many IL clubs would be uncompetitive on the pitch and drag down the standard of play, as the fan of an IL club, I would be concerned that too many LOI clubs would continue to be irresponsibly run off the pitch and so bring the whole thing crashing down.
At which stage we might not have an IL to go back to.
P.S. When I say "too many LOI clubs", DCFC are only one of that number, and I only single them out because they issued their contentious statement in the first place. Had another club in their situation done the same, my response would have been exactly the same.
Last edited by EalingGreen; 15/05/2020 at 3:16 PM.
And what should you do when a large part of the problem is the road itself ?
Fact you even think their statement is contentious in the first place says I'm right about the chip
What else do you call it when they appear to have grossly misrepresented the prize money available in the IL (see posts #266, #267 and #271)?
Or talked about football being a "business" as well as a "sport", after two decades of running their own club in anything but a business-like manner?
Has 'Mr. Parker' also got a chip on his shoulder?
Pardon my ignorance on this as this AIL was proposed a good few months ago by Mr Lucid remind me of this proposal of how this will work as I am a bit confused by this?
Gary Cronin is he the right man to manage Longford Town?
Where were Derry factually incorrect regarding the prize money the winner of the IL gets?
How has it not been run in a business like manner? Do you have intricate knowledge of how Derry City FC has been run that shows it hasn't been run like a business? Whatever that means.
Leagues will run independently up to a point at which point as well as their normal round teams will play teams from the opposite league once each. Points from this round will form a joint league table which will lead to a knockout phase to decide the AIL winner.
That's the TLDR of it anyway.
Living within your means doesn't require a £250k cash injection to pay the wages each year.
Either that, or I've grossly misinterpreted what 'living within your means' entails.
You don't need intricate knowledge of how Derry City are run. The public accounts make it plainly clear how they're run. Businesses that require large sums of money pumped in each year to meet costs aren't well run businesses.
https://kesslereffect.bandcamp.com/album/kepler - New music. It's not that bad.
Not sure this is true, Derry City are still (by far) the best supported team in NI, even if they play in LOI, last season avg was 3k, compared to next best within NI, which was Linfield at 2,300 I think.
#DundalkFC - First Irish club to win an away game in Europe (1963), first Irish club to win points in a group stage in Europe (2016).
My point wasn't that Derry are living within their means exactly, it was that they are just as much as glentoran are, ie with a benefactor pumping money in.
Again my point wasn't that they're a well run business it's that they're being run in a business like manner because that description doesn't really make sense because businesses can make losses no matter how well run they are.
Derry aren't just having money thrown at them, there is some hope of a return and the investment isn't endless, that's a business like manner in my books.
How many clubs fans, if they are being honest with themselves care about their clubs financial management (or indeed mismanagement)?
If the worst case scenario for a League of Ireland club is to start from scratch in Div. 1 and as a new entity but carrying over every single thing associated with the previous entity except debt (therefore being, in a footballing sense, the exact same club) then there is no real deterrent at all.
If clubs have people willing to throw short term large sum money at them for short term success, is there something to be said for playing the boom and bust game?
In Derry City’s League of Ireland history we have never actually won a League title without financially crippling ourselves, but as a fan I am not sure I would change that to be honest.
While, EG himself might not have done so at the time, many others did when the Platinum 1 AIL proposals were put on the table some years back, when the then Glentoran chairman and vice chairman, were championing the proposals and appeared to be heavily involved. Is it a coincidence that the same former VC is involved in Lucid's group?
Last edited by Mr_Parker; 16/05/2020 at 11:08 AM.
Yes they were in the context of the the statement they made. They misrepresent the facts.
And my only axe to grind, is with any club, media outlet or others, who continue to misrepresent such.
Have a read at their accounts.
https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/c...filing-history
Maybe he just believed in the idea of an all-island league then, and still believes in it now. I'm not sure consistency is such a terrible thing to be honest?
What are you suggesting is going on?
I don't know Mr Parker or EalingGreen (no relation) to judge, but it wouldn't be unfair to point out that a lot of Irish League fans seem to have a small obsession or shoulder chip about Derry City to be honest. Always saying they should rejoin the IL or jumping on the media stories to that effect, for example, before inevitably claiming they wouldn't want them back when the club yet again makes it clear it won't be moving.
They deny it of course. But there's definitely a touch of the jilted/huffy former lover about some in the north
My point isn't about what others may or may not have done, it's about EG being hypocritical because one party is Derry City.
That shows numbers and not business plan. Running a business isn't as black and white as making a profit or loss
The numbers given are correct though but it could be said they were given in a context to suit the desired narrative, which if you read back through the posts is exactly why I said what I said because once again I said it purely to point out EGs hypocrisy when it comes to Derry City.
Last edited by RathfarnhamHoop; 16/05/2020 at 12:26 PM.
Careful Nigel - you'll be accused of having a chip on your shoulder next...
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