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Thread: LOI In Europe 2020

  1. #1521
    Seasoned Pro sbgawa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oriel View Post
    Above sounds spot on sbgawa, but I`m sure I looked earlier in the year, and its almost certain that Rovers will be unseeded for CL R1 in 2021.

    I think Dundalk will be the only one seeded next season, with a coefficient of around 8.0.
    Yes i agree on that more likely to be unseeded but things can go in your favor with teams that don't have a European pedigree winning their league
    Molde have a coefficient of 11 but the team that have won the Norwegian league this year (by 20+ points) have a co-efficient less than Rovers , (Bodo Glimt).
    We need a few results like that going in our favor.

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    First Team Yossarian's Avatar
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    Dundalk’s coefficient for next year will be 10.5 so we’ll be comfortably seeded for the first two rounds at least. I think Rovers will be touch and go but as stated above you’d want a few league titles to go to clubs who’ve no real pedigree in Europe. This happened this season more than normal due to leagues finishing early and some teams won who wouldn’t normally have done.

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  4. #1523
    The Cheeto God Real ale Madrid's Avatar
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    Shamrock Rovers' co-efficient is 4.750 - 3 teams had that co-efficient last season 2 were seeded and 1 was not so its right on the bubble.

    Very interested to see Prize money for the ECL - no news of that yet from UEFA. Could have a fundamental impact on clubs here.
    Last edited by Real ale Madrid; 04/12/2020 at 2:34 PM.

  5. #1524
    Biased against YOUR club pineapple stu's Avatar
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    Also prize money for the CL next year - talk of that being reduced because of covid, which would be only logical in fairness.

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    First Team ger121's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pineapple stu View Post
    As did Slovan Bratislava in 2014.

    And I think Dudelange lost 5 out of 5 and drew their sixth game in 2017.

    Ludogorets and Gent also have no points this year. I'm sure lots of teams have lost all group games.
    There has been a few PS. As mentioned could be 3 this year alone. I think it will be 2. Dundalk and Gent have tough last matches. The latter are away too. Ludogorets should maybe getting something at home to Lask.

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    First Team EalingGreen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ger121 View Post
    There has been a few PS. As mentioned could be 3 this year alone. I think it will be 2. Dundalk and Gent have tough last matches. The latter are away too. Ludogorets should maybe getting something at home to Lask.
    Yeah, my mistake originally - misread the BBC report

    "Dundalk equalled the Europa League record of five straight defeats in the group stage as the League of Ireland side lost 3-1 to Molde in Norway."
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/55164272

    (Though I think they may have amended it after originally saying it was an outright record? Unsure)

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    First Team Yossarian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EalingGreen View Post
    Yeah, my mistake originally - misread the BBC report

    "Dundalk equalled the Europa League record of five straight defeats in the group stage as the League of Ireland side lost 3-1 to Molde in Norway."
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/55164272

    (Though I think they may have amended it after originally saying it was an outright record? Unsure)
    Surely the record is six straight defeats seeing as it has happened a number of times before? Or am I missing something?

  9. #1528
    First Team D24Saint's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yossarian View Post
    Surely the record is six straight defeats seeing as it has happened a number of times before? Or am I missing something?
    I don’t know for a fact but sounds like something that happens regularly.

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    I saw somewhere that the record in question is 9 straight group stage defeats (obviously across multiple seasons), which Dundalk equalled with the defeat in Norway. The other club to have 9 straight group stage defeats is Slovan Bratislava (3 defeats in 2011 and 6 in 2014).

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  12. #1530
    Biased against YOUR club pineapple stu's Avatar
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    Yeah, that'd do it alright

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    International Prospect Nesta99's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Straightstory View Post
    Looking at a probable loss for Dundalk to Arsenal next week, it will mean LOI sides have played 18 matches in the Europa League group stages and lost 16 of them. We're just not good enough unfortunately. I presume (I've found it incomprehensible and baffling trying to research this) that from next season Irish clubs will end up - if they qualify at all - in the Europa Conference League, and that will be more our level.
    I've enjoyed watching Dundalk's adventures in Europe this season. The games have been entertaining with lots of goals, and they haven't been humiliated. And to see Irish clubs play in 'proper' stadiums is a bit of a thrill.
    Also - Flores' goal last night was breathtaking.
    Its a bit mad that the general competitiveness of LoI since the introduction of the non straight knockout formats, has had an overall detrimental effect on our league. Excluding clubs that collapsed soon after winning the league, nobody has ever really sustained things to build ranking, co-eff, easier routes to latter qualifying rounds, more money, prestige and so on. Clubs tried of course but Ye look at the Bate Borisovs with class grounds in leagues not massively superior to our own, not well supported either, but one or 2 sides dominate. As long as it was my club dominating and reaping the benefit grand, but how dull for a league. Does a rising tide raise all boats if for example Dundalk and Rovers were to battle it out for UCL (and the title obviously).

    Info on ECL is still scant, possible finances havent been finalised due to the year thats been. Has there been an indication of adding to coefficients? As a league we really should be targeting ECL groups annually, with our champions occasionally making EL groups. Until money is announced whether that can be resourced is another thing unless the FAI start weaving gold for domestic success.

    You are spot on Calcio about making history, fly in the ointment is when it is unwanted history! :P

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    First Team Yossarian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sidewayspasser View Post
    I saw somewhere that the record in question is 9 straight group stage defeats (obviously across multiple seasons), which Dundalk equalled with the defeat in Norway. The other club to have 9 straight group stage defeats is Slovan Bratislava (3 defeats in 2011 and 6 in 2014).
    That makes more sense alright.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nesta99 View Post
    Its a bit mad that the general competitiveness of LoI since the introduction of the non straight knockout formats, has had an overall detrimental effect on our league. Excluding clubs that collapsed soon after winning the league, nobody has ever really sustained things to build ranking, co-eff, easier routes to latter qualifying rounds, more money, prestige and so on. Clubs tried of course but Ye look at the Bate Borisovs with class grounds in leagues not massively superior to our own, not well supported either, but one or 2 sides dominate. As long as it was my club dominating and reaping the benefit grand, but how dull for a league. Does a rising tide raise all boats if for example Dundalk and Rovers were to battle it out for UCL (and the title obviously).

    Info on ECL is still scant, possible finances havent been finalised due to the year thats been. Has there been an indication of adding to coefficients? As a league we really should be targeting ECL groups annually, with our champions occasionally making EL groups. Until money is announced whether that can be resourced is another thing unless the FAI start weaving gold for domestic success.

    You are spot on Calcio about making history, fly in the ointment is when it is unwanted history! :P
    The gas thing about BATE is that they have Athlone or Cobh's average attendance in their space-age stadium. Not sure how I'd feel about that as one of their fans. Great stadium, no-one cares. You'd hate to see a Dundalk or Shamrock winning 20 leagues in a row ala Sheriff, and our already low attendances leauge-wide to plummet. On the game the other night, Dundalk beat themselves as much as Molde. Criminal schoolboy defending for all 3 goals. It was incredibly disappointing how softly all 3 goals were tucked away. And yet, some of their forward play was quite good, until it broke down in the last 3rd. Flores would drive you mad though. He's clearly very talented but has been missing all year, except for the two worldies he has scored. It's been said before, but Dundalk need some surgery over the close-season if they want to qualify, and compete in the Europa League again.

  16. #1534
    Coach John83's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nesta99 View Post
    Its a bit mad that the general competitiveness of LoI since the introduction of the non straight knockout formats, has had an overall detrimental effect on our league. Excluding clubs that collapsed soon after winning the league, nobody has ever really sustained things to build ranking, co-eff, easier routes to latter qualifying rounds, more money, prestige and so on.
    It ain't hard to knock clubs off their perch when it's only knee high.
    Vaccinated.

  17. #1535
    International Prospect Nesta99's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by John83 View Post
    It ain't hard to knock clubs off their perch when it's only knee high.
    Lol true, Rovers have enough cup wins already so share te wealth! Without looking in to it deeply, there cant be too many leagues that have had so many winners than loI, both those that gambled by selling the family silver and went bang soon after, or the winners that have stuck around albeit with plenty of spells in the doldrums. Football being all about business and making money in most leagues more and more, general competitiveness is disappearing bar the odd Leicester or Bodo Glimt and for bigger leagues its been like members only club for decades. Volatile finances here is probably the main reason it hadnt happened but its a positive too that any club really, with the right pople involved can have a go at a title or to get in to Europe. What odds would there have been on Sligo nabbing a place prior to league suspension or what would have happened without the disruption.

    Flores has plenty to prove, I hope he stays and shows more than the glimpses of a very talanted footballer, 2 or 3 GoTS contenders and the rest of the game time passing him by isnt worth a bump in his pay. But I suppose he does have to want to stay at the club too. He has been treated well at Oriel when few other were willing to work with him, for whatever that is worth. Motivation became a real issue with the squad for whatever reason and very unusual with these players. Get that driven attitude back and there wouldnt have to be a major turnover of player imo.

    The way the zonal marking system has been applied so far has been very poor. Almost like players werent willing to move out of their zone of responsibility even when there was an obvious threat. Far too static to be able to compete in the air especially when opposition were arriving at pace to attack the ball, getting above some pretty big defenders in the process. It looked pretty and organised but was far to rigid. Zonal marking is all the rage, maybe Im old fashioned but Id prefer M2M as at minimum it disrupts an attacker in the process of losing a marker and also get the leap on defenders. Thursday night we might as well have put some free kick mannequins along the 6yd box, stood back and hoped for the best. Maybe a work in progress but there was enough experience there to know when to switch in or out of another zone. I'm sure Rovers will test the new system tomorrow and corners will be nerve wrecking!
    Last edited by Nesta99; 05/12/2020 at 4:26 PM.

  18. #1536
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    I'd be fairly confident Rovers won't be relying on set pieces to expose the difference between the two sides tomorrow.
    Hopefully the cut up surface won't be a leveller on the game.

  19. #1537
    Seasoned Pro sbgawa's Avatar
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    Its a role reversal this year in the final.
    Last year going to the final i was up to 90 worried about the consequences of losing and Dundalk doing the treble and looking like seperating themselves totally from us, going on and winning the league again this year.
    This year its Dundalk that need a moralle booster against us in the final.
    I will be disappointed if we don't win the match but last year i would have been devastated to lose.
    I expect to win but its a cup final so anything is possible. Dundalk were the better team on form going into every cup final against Cork and didnt win them all.
    Looking forward to it but am also really looking forwatd to starting again next year

  20. #1538
    International Prospect Nesta99's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by placid casual View Post
    I'd be fairly confident Rovers won't be relying on set pieces to expose the difference between the two sides tomorrow.
    Hopefully the cut up surface won't be a leveller on the game.
    I didnt mean that rovers would be relying on set pieces, they have players that can unlock the meanest of defences. It would be remiss of Bradley not to instruct his players to put a few corners in to the mixer early at least, test whether the keeper has the confidence to go claim a ball or will stick and leave it to defenders. On recent displays at the back either would cause a worry!

    It will very much be a kick on to Dundalk to win the cup, especially against a team unbeaten so far this season, solidify FGs credentials as a LoI manager. I dont think it will be a make or break thing psychologically in a 1st trophy way. Plenty of the players have both won and lost cup finals with silverware in the last season (2019) - not just like breaking a duck. Dunno how to call it at all - Rovers odds on, but not beyond Dundalk to put in that complete type performance. Rovers could even be a bit stale where Dundalk have had a run out, training match against a decent European side in preperation.

    A poor pitch wont suit either side, it wont be a case of Dundalk looking for a ropey pitch to stop Rovers from playing if thats whats meant as a leveller. I'd even think that Rovers are better equipped to change things up if the pitch is messy.
    Last edited by Nesta99; 05/12/2020 at 8:30 PM.

  21. #1539
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    Yeah, it's not the end of the world if Rovers don't retain the cup, the league and the knock on benefits from it, were the main focus this year.
    Lots of talk from Dan McDonnell about this being Jack Byrnes last game for the hoops- it seems to be said more in hope than any concrete knowledge or expectation.

  22. #1540
    Seasoned Pro sbgawa's Avatar
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    it may very well be Jacks last game for us this time around but if he does leave i can see him back in Tallaght again even if its ten years from now.

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