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Thread: New crossborder tournament: Unite the Union Champions Cup

  1. #101
    Reserves Kiki Balboa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by White Horse View Post
    I was in the main stand also and could hear very little from the Shed. They were quieter than usual.

    I think I hear a variation of the "We know what we are, Champions of Ireland etc" at one point. It sounded like "You know what you are. You're Irish. You know what you are." Certainly the Linfield officials close to me in the stand were laughing at that one.
    Your only here for your Passports .

    On a different issue, just how bad were Linfield. Sure they were missing the striker, but they got their tactics totally wrong. Gave acres to McGrath and Duffy, and folded badly. Felt bad for their decent travelling fans/

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ezeikial View Post
    The political pontification on social media is verging on the absurd. One chap even thinks that the NIFL can sort out these issues for us


    https://twitter.com/mrtndvn1/status/1193997125396369415

    Surely thats not you mrtndvn?
    Get the old sarcasm detector on there. It was a common theme among NIFL fans that we were asking for an AIL to save ourselves.
    MD

  3. #103
    First Team ToberonaTornado's Avatar
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    Jaysus Wept- some of the stupid faux outraged comments on this!

    6 fine goals by Dundalk tonight to sweep aside Linfield.Brilliant display by the Lilywhites to round off a magnificent year.
    Bob Bensons prob the best of the half-dozen we put past them.
    Him announcing he's leaving us is prob the worst thing that happened in OP tonight.

    I'm praying for a lot of yee,any wonder LOI fora are totally screwed these days when you see the crap that's going on in here.

  4. #104
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    I have to view this “sectarian chanting” stuff in a different light to everyone else here as regards it’s impact on a possible AIL.

    Surely if the main gripe as regards fans following two games between Dundalk and Linfield is merely some chanting and half a dozen flags (and that is not to condone either of those) then this bodes well for an AIL in the near future?

    In the not so distant past the genuine concern was violence not chanting, in fact I wonder without social media acting as the fuel to the fire how much airtime some chants would actually get.

    Not nice but it’s a football game, no big deal in my opinion and certainly a gross over reaction to say in it any way puts paid to hopes of or plans for an AIL.

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  6. #105
    First Team ToberonaTornado's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mrtndvn View Post
    You might think that's acceptable, but you clearly don't have to deal with the ramifications of it.

    Some of us are from an area of the Island where Irish people have been discriminated against for years. Where are now facing a huge challenge in Brexit, where things will most certainly get worse for those areas, and if you think nights like tonight will encourage the unionist people to a new or united ireland, it won't.

    Some of us are trying to move on and improve parts of this island that need it most. This **** is most unhelpful.

    Never mind a new Ireland, even a basic AIL is hugely damaged by tonight.
    Without a doubt this is the stupidest post i have ever read on any LOI forum.****ING EVER!!

    I won't even tell you why,you figure that out all by yourself.

    UN FCUKING BELIEVABLE NONSENSE DUDE.

  7. #106
    International Prospect Ezeikial's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ezeikial View Post

    Anxious to fill in the gaps, I checked some media reports to read some impartial reports on this crowd misbehaviour. Heck I even looked for some partial ones from the more sensationalist media. Amazingly all I could find were reports that detailed the magnificent performance by Dundalk in the 6-0 win.
    Surely the Sun will be apoplectic with rage on the de-railing of a New Ireland nation and AIL that occurred last night?

    Nope, it seems Owen Cowzer missed it too
    There were justified concerns that the clash could be marred by sectarian chanting after a small minority made their voices heard during Friday’s first leg at Windsor Park.


    If anything, Oriel Park was a little quiet.
    That bodes well for the future of either this competition or a potential all-island league.
    https://www.thesun.ie/sport/football...box=1573526941

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    Did anyone on here honestly expect that there would be no sectarian chanting? It was an Irish border town vs the biggest team from NI, football is tribalistic and there is 2 fairly significant tribes these 2 sets of fans belong to. I thought the match was a great occasion, fair play to the massive number of Linfield fans for travelling down, I joined in the chanting (nothing too outrageous just the usual Celtic Symphony and a few funny passport jibes, I've far more offensive ones, usually reserved for Drogs & Shams), had a great time and was delighted to see there were no incidents of violence before or after the match. To claim OUTRAGE and that the concept of an All-Island League is dead because of a few songs is an absolute joke and virtue signalling at best. People who use this as reason to derail the AIL never had any interest in it in the first place, the final score is probably a bigger deterrent to IL clubs than any songs or flags. Anyway Dundalk FC Champions of All-Ireland, what a season that was despite the FAI Cup disappointment, roll on next season!
    Mon the Town!

  9. #108
    Seasoned Pro White Horse's Avatar
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    I was surprised at how many people were triggered on social media last night.

    We live on a divided island that has an unresolved political issue. If you look at any comparable area with a geo-political conflict, the fact that the game could be held safely, with mutual goodwill being extended by the vast majority of attendees was a positive sign.

    I don't know whether the outrage is due to the influence of the snowflake generation or an opportunity being grasped by those opposed to an all island league.

    Probably a bit of both. Also, add in the disdain some other fans feel for Dundalk fans.

  10. #109
    International Prospect Ezeikial's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by White Horse View Post
    I was surprised at how many people were triggered on social media last night.

    We live on a divided island that has an unresolved political issue. If you look at any comparable area with a geo-political conflict, the fact that the game could be held safely, with mutual goodwill being extended by the vast majority of attendees was a positive sign.

    I don't know whether the outrage is due to the influence of the snowflake generation or an opportunity being grasped by those opposed to an all island league.

    Probably a bit of both. Also, add in the disdain some other fans feel for Dundalk fans.

    In my opinion, for some it is probably a genuine abhorrence of anything sectarian.

    For many more, I think it is the social media induce snowflake mentality of wanting to be offended or outraged - there are many double standard hypocrites in this category.

    And then there are those who identify with other tribes (clubs) who are envious or jealous of a rivals success.

    The vast majority who fall into the latter categories claim (and maybe even believe) they are in the first category

  11. #110
    The Cheeto God Real ale Madrid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by White Horse View Post

    I don't know whether the outrage is due to the influence of the snowflake generation or an opportunity being grasped by those opposed to an all island league.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ezeikial View Post
    For many more, I think it is the social media induce snowflake mentality of wanting to be offended or outraged - there are many double standard hypocrites in this category.
    There it is again - the most overused word in the English language now. Sigh.

    There has been more posts lamenting social media here now then there was social media posts about the chanting.
    Last edited by Real ale Madrid; 12/11/2019 at 10:23 AM.

  12. #111
    First Team Mr_Parker's Avatar
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    I think some are missing the bigger picture. In the NIFL, there have been year on year improvements in dealing with supporter behaviour, particularly with offensive chants and banners. Yes it pops up now and again, but it is the exception, not the rule. When it does occur, clubs are generally quick to take action to deal with those responsible. E.g. Cliftonville played Linfield twice recently. At the first game there were issues which both clubs attempted to deal with on the night, but in the middle of a game it is not always to do more than minimise such, as it can inflame a situation. However, for the next game action was taken, including the identification of some of those involved and several were refused entry. There were no such issues at the 2nd game.

    With all the talk of an AIL, many were looking to see the 2 games between Linfield and Dundalk as a sort of measure of a potential future league, both on and off the pitch. The off pitch issues have and will be focussed on by supporters of a losing team. That is natural and happens over all sorts of issues, not just offensive songs etc. Therefore what has happened has been viewed by many as a microcosm of what an AIL might hold. People focus on Linfield given the past, but there are other clubs who if playing in an AIL could give rise to bigger reactions/issues to their presence at a LOI ground. Therefore, many view that an AIL could reignite many of the issues that have been nearly extinguished in the NIFL.

    However, the football on the pitch aside, from reading their comments post last night, it was not the songs that did most damage to support from Linfield supporters, and indeed many other NIFL team supporters, for an AIL, it was how they were treated like cattle just to go to a game. They had to meet in Banbridge at 4pm. Then they had to get on buses and be transported to the game. They then travelled by back roads, lights had to be kept off on the bus, only arriving at the ground some 3 hours later just as the teams were coming out. Normally a 30 min journey. That's what they and fans of other NIFL clubs view as a possible future in an AIL just to support their team at an away game. Fans will quickly vote with their feet.

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  14. #112
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr_Parker View Post
    I think some are missing the bigger picture. In the NIFL, there have been year on year improvements in dealing with supporter behaviour, particularly with offensive chants and banners. Yes it pops up now and again, but it is the exception, not the rule. When it does occur, clubs are generally quick to take action to deal with those responsible. E.g. Cliftonville played Linfield twice recently. At the first game there were issues which both clubs attempted to deal with on the night, but in the middle of a game it is not always to do more than minimise such, as it can inflame a situation. However, for the next game action was taken, including the identification of some of those involved and several were refused entry. There were no such issues at the 2nd game.

    With all the talk of an AIL, many were looking to see the 2 games between Linfield and Dundalk as a sort of measure of a potential future league, both on and off the pitch. The off pitch issues have and will be focussed on by supporters of a losing team. That is natural and happens over all sorts of issues, not just offensive songs etc. Therefore what has happened has been viewed by many as a microcosm of what an AIL might hold. People focus on Linfield given the past, but there are other clubs who if playing in an AIL could give rise to bigger reactions/issues to their presence at a LOI ground. Therefore, many view that an AIL could reignite many of the issues that have been nearly extinguished in the NIFL.

    However, the football on the pitch aside, from reading their comments post last night, it was not the songs that did most damage to support from Linfield supporters, and indeed many other NIFL team supporters, for an AIL, it was how they were treated like cattle just to go to a game. They had to meet in Banbridge at 4pm. Then they had to get on buses and be transported to the game. They then travelled by back roads, lights had to be kept off on the bus, only arriving at the ground some 3 hours later just as the teams were coming out. Normally a 30 min journey. That's what they and fans of other NIFL clubs view as a possible future in an AIL just to support their team at an away game. Fans will quickly vote with their feet.
    AGS haven't a clue when it comes to handling crowds at - "SOCCER" - matches.
    I don't buy into the crap that an overturned lorry on the A/M1 created the delay for Linfield fans getting to OP.
    It's all small detail though,they're an adaptable force who can learn quickly from the psni.

  15. #113
    Seasoned Pro White Horse's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ToberonaTornado View Post
    AGS haven't a clue when it comes to handling crowds at - "SOCCER" - matches.
    I don't buy into the crap that an overturned lorry on the A/M1 created the delay for Linfield fans getting to OP.
    It's all small detail though,they're an adaptable force who can learn quickly from the psni.
    It was obviously planned that their bus would arrive at Oriel 5 minutes before kick off. They appear to have had to take a scenic tour around north County Louth as they arrived earlier than expected. The Guards closed the Carrick road to traffic, erected barricades and escorted the fans into the away section.

    There is no way I would go to an away match is these circumstances.

    For all the horror being mouthed by snowflakes about political chants, this is the issue that would get to me most as a fan.

    It was humiliating night for Linfield fans. To see them taking down their "No Surrender" flag at halftime out of embarrassment almost brought a sympathetic tear to my eye.

  16. #114
    International Prospect Ezeikial's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr_Parker View Post

    However, the football on the pitch aside, from reading their comments post last night, it was not the songs that did most damage to support from Linfield supporters, and indeed many other NIFL team supporters, for an AIL, it was how they were treated like cattle just to go to a game. They had to meet in Banbridge at 4pm. Then they had to get on buses and be transported to the game. They then travelled by back roads, lights had to be kept off on the bus, only arriving at the ground some 3 hours later just as the teams were coming out. Normally a 30 min journey. That's what they and fans of other NIFL clubs view as a possible future in an AIL just to support their team at an away game. Fans will quickly vote with their feet.
    Quote Originally Posted by White Horse View Post
    It was obviously planned that their bus would arrive at Oriel 5 minutes before kick off. They appear to have had to take a scenic tour around north County Louth as they arrived earlier than expected. The Guards closed the Carrick road to traffic, erected barricades and escorted the fans into the away section.

    There is no way I would go to an away match is these circumstances.

    For all the horror being mouthed by snowflakes about political chants, this is the issue that would get to me most as a fan.

    It was humiliating night for Linfield fans. To see them taking down their "No Surrender" flag at halftime out of embarrassment almost brought a sympathetic tear to my eye.
    Getting stuffed on the pitch just added to the indignity of the whole overall experience for Linfield supporters

    The poor conditions of the away section at Oriel Park is enough for visitors to have to endure, without the excessively restricted travel requirements.

    The Linfield officials seem to have taken a fair bit of flack as a result of these arrangements

  17. #115
    Banned marinobohs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr_Parker View Post
    I think some are missing the bigger picture. In the NIFL, there have been year on year improvements in dealing with supporter behaviour, particularly with offensive chants and banners. Yes it pops up now and again, but it is the exception, not the rule. When it does occur, clubs are generally quick to take action to deal with those responsible. E.g. Cliftonville played Linfield twice recently. At the first game there were issues which both clubs attempted to deal with on the night, but in the middle of a game it is not always to do more than minimise such, as it can inflame a situation. However, for the next game action was taken, including the identification of some of those involved and several were refused entry. There were no such issues at the 2nd game.

    With all the talk of an AIL, many were looking to see the 2 games between Linfield and Dundalk as a sort of measure of a potential future league, both on and off the pitch. The off pitch issues have and will be focussed on by supporters of a losing team. That is natural and happens over all sorts of issues, not just offensive songs etc. Therefore what has happened has been viewed by many as a microcosm of what an AIL might hold. People focus on Linfield given the past, but there are other clubs who if playing in an AIL could give rise to bigger reactions/issues to their presence at a LOI ground. Therefore, many view that an AIL could reignite many of the issues that have been nearly extinguished in the NIFL.

    However, the football on the pitch aside, from reading their comments post last night, it was not the songs that did most damage to support from Linfield supporters, and indeed many other NIFL team supporters, for an AIL, it was how they were treated like cattle just to go to a game. They had to meet in Banbridge at 4pm. Then they had to get on buses and be transported to the game. They then travelled by back roads, lights had to be kept off on the bus, only arriving at the ground some 3 hours later just as the teams were coming out. Normally a 30 min journey. That's what they and fans of other NIFL clubs view as a possible future in an AIL just to support their team at an away game. Fans will quickly vote with their feet.
    That was certainly NOT the experience of NIFL fans during the Setanta Cup. I personally saw fans from many NIFL clubs drinking in the bars in Dalymount prior to matches and I know it happened elsewhere across the LOI. I cant speak about why the police (PSNI/AGS) decided on the arrangements for this game but Brexit debacle (heightened tensions), one off nature of match and the generally crap set up at Oriel Park probably contributed. To suggest that is an accurate example of what an AIL match would be like is simply ridiculous.

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    Certainly the measures put in place for Linfield fans travelling are not suitable and feasible on any kind of long terms basis but again have to viewed in perspective. Any logical thinking would lead us to security operations around games being significantlyt refined over the course of the first few years. Also likely that these games becoming the norm would make them more mundane to those that might pose a trouble risk.

    Again not a barrier to an AIL although of course I back the view that no set of football fans should be treated like that but these are things that can be overcome.

    All in all there was no major incidents over the course of the two games in fact no incidents of any note really that is the bottom line.

    Over the top security operation and dodgy chants? Hardly new for football anywhere.

  19. #117
    First Team Mr_Parker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marinobohs View Post
    That was certainly NOT the experience of NIFL fans during the Setanta Cup. I personally saw fans from many NIFL clubs drinking in the bars in Dalymount prior to matches and I know it happened elsewhere across the LOI. I cant speak about why the police (PSNI/AGS) decided on the arrangements for this game but Brexit debacle (heightened tensions), one off nature of match and the generally crap set up at Oriel Park probably contributed. To suggest that is an accurate example of what an AIL match would be like is simply ridiculous.
    I am talking about the perception that will now be held in regards to an AIL.

  20. #118
    Reserves ArFella's Avatar
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    The AIL will not be happening any time soon and fan chants and security reasons will be very far down the long list of reasons it won't happen, the top of that list will be all to do with €€€/£££, too many blazers would lose their cushy number, clubs will lose out on UEFA money, etc, etc.
    Mon the Town!

  21. #119
    Like the Fonz. Only a dog. Mr A's Avatar
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    I think we can all agree that both clubs were a disgrace and should be deducted 50 points each for next season.
    #NeverStopNotGivingUp

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  23. #120
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    Quote Originally Posted by ToberonaTornado View Post
    Without a doubt this is the stupidest post i have ever read on any LOI forum.****ING EVER!!

    I won't even tell you why,you figure that out all by yourself.

    UN FCUKING BELIEVABLE NONSENSE DUDE.
    Steady on there, Bart Simpson! Attack the post, not the poster.

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