Think that will make him their club record signing. Also now holds the 1st and 2nd spot for most expensive fee paid for an Irish player.
Deal completed on a 6 year contract…
Irish by birth ,Harps by the grace of god.
And Brentford have the option to extend it by another two years also. They also confirm it's for a club record fee.Originally Posted by joey B
So effectively an eight year deal? That's mad. Can't remember many players getting an eight year deal before.
Chelsea started doing it last year with some of their big signings coming on 8 year deals,UEFA actually changed the rules afterwards to limit amortisation on transfer fees to 5 years no matter the lenght of the contract.....
Irish by birth ,Harps by the grace of god.
That length of contract you'd expect he's been well looked after financially or there's a buy out clause included. Wouldn't want to be signing for 8 years and not having a way out if after a few seasons you're attracting interest from bigger clubs.
No, not "effectively", just potentially. That is, the option will only be exercised if BFC are happy with his first six years and/or they don't receive a suitable offer from elsewhere beforehand.
And I say "suitable", since as a selling club, every player at the club has his price, adjusted up or down according to the market. And this applies from Day One, since no sooner have they signed someone, than they're sizing up potential replacements.
For example, they signed Scott Hogan, late of this parish, for £750k in July 2014. They sold him to Villa for a big profit (£8m?)in January 2017, with Neal Maupay lined up to join them later in the summer from Ligue 2 for £1.6m. In August 2019 they sold Maupay to Brighton for £20m, and replaced him at No.9 with Ollie Watkins, who'd joined them two years earlier from Exeter for £1.8m, as a young winger. Watkins scored 25 league goals the following season, earning him a £32m transfer (incl add-ons) to Villa. At which point they signed Ivan Toney from P'boro for £5m + £5m add-ons.
Each player has been better than the one preceeding him, with (gambling habit notwithstanding) Toney the best/most valuable of the lot (imo). Meanwhile, they signed a young German winger, Kevin Schade, at the begining of this year for £20m-odd from Freiburg, who has since made his senior German NT debut. And although he's not made a huge impact just yet, I suspect he's being lined up to replace Toney at centre-forward when the time comes for him to depart.
My point being that Brentford's recruitment processes are amongst the very best in the PL, so that they don't splash out Collins-money on a player without having a very clear plan* for his time at the club. Of course no club ever gets it right every time, but if I were an ROI fan, I'd be very excited by this move, especially since his last couple of moves didn't really work out.
The other thing about the club is that they manage their finances extremely well. For although they're extremely ambitious, and certainly won't be satisfied with another 9th place finish next season, they're also very mindful of what can go wrong. Having now survived two seasons in the PL, they are now reassured that in the event of relegation, they would now qualify for 3 years parachute payments rather than one. Which means they would not have to conduct a "fire-sale" of players if they should get relegated and can amortise Collins' transfer fee in the accounts over a 5 or 6 year period to tide them over the financial hit.
* - It wouldn't surprise me if they hoped to do a John Stones with him?
Last edited by EalingGreen; 04/07/2023 at 2:50 PM.
If there is a buy-out clause, it will more likely be in the club's favour than the player's.
For no harm to Collins, who I think is a good prospect, if you look at his career to date, he probably wasn't in a position to make demands if he wanted to stay in the PL.
That is, two and a half injury-hit seasons in the Championship at Stoke, where he played 39 league games, followed by a season at Burnley (19 PL games, then relegation) and a season at Wolves (26 PL games, nearly relegated). Brentford have a history of taking a long-term view on players who might have a few question marks on their CV, but not every club does, especially those with a new manager who is expected to get results straightaway i.e. half of them!
Last edited by EalingGreen; 04/07/2023 at 3:02 PM.
I urge everyone to avoid feeding this troll.
What on earth was "troll-like" about any of my posts on the subject?
The man just explained Brentfords business model with facts and figures and you are calling him a troll? Shot way wide there dude
He's not trolling. And although not someone I'd be too bothered about having a pint with, a bit glib & smirky, he has posted also some good quality content in the LOI section of late across multiple threads incorporating some NIFL historical stuff.
Stephen Kenny Saviour, Leader, Winner, An Autobiography - In All Good Bookstores Now
"A bit glib and smirky" is it? It's probably a good thing you haven't met me with a few drinks in me!
Anyhow, thanks for the rest.
Not trolling, but glib and smirky. :-) Your first post was informative, second post reads as “fortunate to be in the PL, injury prone, got one club relegated, nearly got a second club relegated, his new club has a fondness for questionable CVs, one for the future”. Can understand Ole Ole’s objection as why flippantly summarise the career of a now established senior international on an Ireland forum when you make it clear you are not a fan of the team (free tickets aside) if not for the glib and smirky angle.What on earth was "troll-like" about any of my posts on the subject?
But agree Brentford breaking their transfer record for Collins is a good signal – given their past transfer dealings they consider Collins under-valued at their highest ever paid transfer fee. Needs to iron out some youthful sloppy exuberance in his game, but otherwise the kid’s a beast and hopefully Brentford have the financials to hold on to him for an extended period so that he has a settled environment to improve without upheaval.
You're not reading what I wrote/intended, you're taking from it something you imagine me to mean. My point was that if you look at his CV, due to injuries and unfortunate club transfers, his progress has been patchy.
Or as the BBC's reporter today put it:
"The Premier League is a hard school. For players like Nathan Collins, doing their learning on one of the most public stages in sport, it’s perhaps no surprise that progress is uneven – and all the more so when they haven’t yet put down footballing roots."
And as I said, this is the sort of thing which puts many other PL clubs off - i.e. they have the money to pay for ready-made players, and/or demand instant success. But I would bet that I have more first hand experience of Brentford than any other poster on this forum, and so highlighted their ability to spot underrated players with potential and develop them into an asset which improves the team and adds real transfer value to them. For example, should NC form part of a back three, he could be playing alongside Ethan Pinnock. At 23, Pinnock was still playing for Dulwich Hamlet. He then went to Forest Green (Lge Two) followed by Barnsley (Lge One), from where BFC signed him. Last season Pinnock was one of the best CB's in the PL, even at the age of 30. While NC's other colleague could be Ben Mee. Let go at 32 by relegated Burnley, everyone assumed that was the end of his career at the top level. Yet BFC signed him on a free, to captain the team, where he too was outstanding last season. (Just look at BFC's defensive stats).
Moreover, I highlighted the fact that BFC don't just sign any old player because they "think he's a bit good". I said they would have a plan for him, possibly a John Stones-type role, which I'd have thought was very complimentary. Anyhow, look at what the player himself is saying today:
"[Me and Thomas Frank] have talked a lot. He’s said what he likes about me and has a plan in place."
And then there's what Frank himself says:
"His character is really good, and we know that character is everything. He will fit into our culture, I have no doubt about that. I see leadership potential in Nathan. He’s a perfect Brentford player - hungry and ambitious with a desire to learn."
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/teams/brentford
All of which I might have written myself - in fact I actually did, pretty much!
As for your clear insinuation that I was somehow doing the player down, presumably because I'm an NI fan, then did you miss the bit where I posted: "If I were an ROI fan, I'd be very excited by this move"?
Since that was a clear and umbiguous commendation for both player and transfer, may I ask that next time you drop the prejudicial mindset and judge me on what I actually post?
- "he probably wasn't in a position to make demands if he wanted to stay in the PL" - Brentford have paid £23m for him. I doubt many sides in the Championship would shop in that price range. And I'm sure he would have stayed with Wolves if nobody met the asking price. So he didn't have to make demands if he wanted to stay in the PL. His PL status wasn't at risk;
- "two and a half injury-hit seasons in the Championship at Stoke, where he played 39 league games" - he made his debut in defence at 18 and clocked up 39 games in defence by the age of 20;
- "a season a Burnley (19 PL games, then relegation)" - 19 league games in the Premiership, mostly at the age of 20; same point re Wolves, he played 26 games which isn't anything to be sniffed at.
In my view, you are sharing a biased view regarding his club history and your overall assessment of his club history is clearly coming in with a poorer rating than managers at the 3 Premiership clubs who have now paid tens of millions for him. As I said, his retention of Premiership status was never at risk and the "question marks" on his CV clearly haven't impacted his value or desirability - no matter what way you try to spin them.
Last season, Brentford had the second lowest wages bill in the Prem (ahead only of Bpournemouth). If they were paying a club record transfer fee, plus a competitive package, they are clearly pushing the boat out. Do you really imagine they were also going to concede over extras? As a club, they are known for having their terms, beyond which they will not go - see eg their telling Spurs they pay £40m for Raya, or he goes nowhere. Or having chased him for two transfer windows, they offered £28m for Mudryk, Shaktar wanted another £5m (I think) and BFC said no. Chelsea paid £60m to get him in the next window.
Lopetegui has stated that he wants to buy new players, otherwise he has threatened to leave. Except that Wolves are screwed over FFP (I suspect they didn't tell him that when he joined), meaning the only way he'll get any budget is if they sell first. And if you look at Collins' record at Molineux after the New Year (i.e. once Lopetegui had settled in), he got progressively fewer starts and less game time. Meanwhile, Wolves signed a 33 y.o. CB, Craig Dawson, on a free from WHU at the end of the January window. In other words, Lopetegui didn't fancy Collins. Which is no reflection on Collins - it often happens with managers, especially new ones, but it does indicate there was nothing down for Collins at the club.
No-one is denying that he is/was a "prospect" - the very word I used, but you appear to have ignored. But through bad luck with injuries, and a couple of transfers which didn't really work out, his career trajectory has been interrupted - "patchy" as I called it, "uneven" as the BBC termed it.
But my point was that since they cannot compete with the Big Boys on transfer fees or wages, Brentford often rely on picking up under-appreciated assets and advancing their careers carefully. Collins falls precisely within that category, which is why I predict he can potentially be a big success at the GTech.
As for Burnley, a month after Kompany arrived, he (Kompany) clearly decided he'd rather have the transfer fee than the player. Again, that's not a reflection on Collins, but it was more disruption to his nascent career. Which is why on this latest occasion, there were no other PL clubs in for NC, certainly none of the Big Clubs*, meaning Brentford got a free run.
* - If he proves to be a success at Brentford, they will be happy to come back in another two or three seasons and pay £40m+ for the finished article, another reason why BFC signed him on a long contract i.e. gives the club more leverage, rather than the player.
My comments were less a reflection on the player and his clear potential, and more a reflection on how the transfer market works generally, and how Brentford work specifically.
I don't think you understand either of these last two, but are looking for advertse criticism in my comments where none should be inferred. And I think I know why: "He's one of Themmuns, so he's not capable of objectivity, he's only out to do our players down"
Which is the last I shall say on the matter, other than to predict that Collins can be a big success at the GTech, considering how frequently and successfully they find rough diamonds to polish.
Last edited by EalingGreen; 05/07/2023 at 3:24 PM.
Glib. Smirky.
Take it easy, Olé. You've made your points, EG's made his.
Bit weird that Wolves have sold Kilman to Napoli today too. First of all I wouldn't have thought he's good enough to go there, but you would have though Wolves would have kept one of them
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