World Cup Tournament 2018

[osarusan]

But part of the point of VAR was that everything would be clear

I don't think so. If it was promoted in that way, it shouldn't have been. Some stuff will never be clear, or clear enough.

We are not talking about stuff like the ball being over the line or not, we are talking about subjective decisions. I don't know how the VAR panel reach a decision as to whether to ask the ref to review an incident or not, but I think it should be more transparent (and just improved too).

I also thought the Nigeria penalty was soft, but I could see why the ref made the decision he did. I don't think that VAR should be used for stuff like that to be honest. It should be used for the more blatant errors - the ones where there is no doubt that the ref just got it wrong.

I think VAR would be better promoted as a way to correct the worst decisions (offsides, blatant dives, off-the-ball incidents, and so on), rather than something that will get every decision right, which it won't ever be.

Last night there was another claim for a penalty after an Argentinean defender mis-headed the ball onto his own arm late in the game. I couldn't believe that the panel asked the ref to review it, and was very pleased to see that he watched it and decided it was not a penalty. Was that a clear an obvious error? I certainly didn't think so, and was shocked to see a panel, who are apparently working off such a criterion, ask the ref to review.

But then again, maybe the ref himself asked to view the footage, and there was no implication that he had made an error.

[OwlsFan]

A huge amount was made of Messi's goal on the Beeb and RTE but very little was made of the absolutely brilliant pass which put him through. Messi took it well ok but the pass was sublime. If it had been Higuain, and the pass was by Messi, all the talk would have been about Messi's pass.

There is speculation that the manager asked Messi's permission to make the substitutions. This is the apparent footage: https://metro.co.uk/2018/06/27/argen...6/?ito=cbshare Who knows. I can't lip read Spanish.

Did Aguero actually touch the ball for the 10 minutes he was on the pitch ?

According to Messi ‘We knew God was with us and wasn’t going to let us go out. I thank all the fans that are here, for all their sacrifice and to all those in Argentina that were always with us. The shirt of the national team is above all else.’ You could imagine God in heaven with his Argentinian shirt on cheering them on, despite many of the Nigerian players blessing themselves before the game.

[ifk101]

A huge amount was made of Messi's goal on the Beeb and RTE but very little was made of the absolutely brilliant pass which put him through. Messi took it well ok but the pass was sublime. If it had been Higuain, and the pass was by Messi, all the talk would have been about Messi's pass.

He controlled a long ball on his thigh, in the same movement brought it down with his left foot, and controlled it so that it landly perfectly on his right, with which he placed a scoring opportunity from a tight angle out of reach of the goalie. And all this at speed.

Yeah he took "ok".

The pass was ok. Any professional footballer given that much space and time should be able to play a ball over the top like that.

[NeverFeltBetter]

A huge amount was made of Messi's goal on the Beeb and RTE but very little was made of the absolutely brilliant pass which put him through. Messi took it well ok but the pass was sublime. If it had been Higuain, and the pass was by Messi, all the talk would have been about Messi's pass.

There is speculation that the manager asked Messi's permission to make the substitutions. This is the apparent footage: https://metro.co.uk/2018/06/27/argen...6/?ito=cbshare Who knows. I can't lip read Spanish.

The players are leading that team now, and it'll end in tears at the weekend.

[NeverFeltBetter]

And Germany heading home. Woeful today. The Korean time-wasting was bugging me, since they had nothing to gain from a point, but they oddly always looked a bit more likely to get a goal. Mexico off the hook big time after a terrible show against Sweden.

Is this the end for Low?

[pineapple stu]

I imagine Loew has earned a chance to rebuild. For Germany, this is surely no worse than Euro 2004, and they recovered fairly spectacularly from that.

There will be no more than 6 former finalists in the quarters. Italy, Hungary, Czech Republic/Czechoslovakia and Holland didn't qualify; Germany are gone, and either France or Argentina won't make it too. 1974 was the last time a country qualified for their first World Cup Final. Would be nice to buck that.

Edit - completely forgot about Spain's first World Cup final in 2010... Oops!

[tetsujin1979]

Didn't Loew sign a new contact before the tournament?

[OwlsFan]

Sport: the great leveler. But a few days ago the Swedes were devastated and the Germans on a high. Loews and highs

[pineapple stu]

If someone doesn't tell Ronnie Whelan that it's Jay-sus, not Hay-sus, I'm going to reach into the telly and slap him.

[sidewayspasser]

Didn't Loew sign a new contact before the tournament?

He did, until 2022. However, I somewhat expect that he will resign within the next 24 hours.

[osarusan]

Don't mention ze VAR.

[seanfhear]

Germans come a cropper in Russia . And looks like they didn’t see it coming ....again .

[NeverFeltBetter]

Loew is considering his future. I'm sure neither he or the Germans will rush into any decision, there should be some investigation into what went wrong this summer and if a change of manager is the appropriate solution, but I have a feeling he'll go. While I'm sure Germany will stroll into Euro 2020, he won't want to tarnish his legacy any further with another dud Finals performance.

Germany become the third straight defending champions to go out at the group stage. Is there a motivation issue there, of just not having the drive to do it all again once you've already done it (albeit it took one more tournament win for Spain to reach that point)?

[OwlsFan]

Germans come a cropper in Russia . And looks like they didn’t see it coming ....again .

Yes, and they can't blame the snow or mud this time. Didn't see the game. This work business is inclined to get in the way of some games. I hope all the knock out games will be in the evening.

So far no unheralded star has come through the ranks to earn a big money transfer at the end of the tournament. Alexis Sánchez was one of the stars of 2014 although he had of course already made a name for himself at Barcelona.

[osarusan]

Colombia with 45 minutes to stay in it. I thought they looked superb against Poland, but Poland just seem to have been so weak throughout the tournament.

[Stuttgart88]

Mascherano penalty iincident n ARG v NGR:

VAR is there to overturn a clear and obvious ref mistake. If the initial decision was pen, then if the replay showed it was technically a pen but very soft, then the decision to stick with penalty is correct no?

It's all about the burden of proof given the first decision. In cricket, for example, in a LBW decision if the umpire says out and the replay shows exactly half the ball is hitting the stumps, then it's still out. If umpire says not out in the first instance, the fact that half the ball is hitting the stumps isn't sufficient to overturn the decision. And also in rugby, the "can I award a try?" or "is there any reason not to award a try?" change the burden of proof.

That's how I see it anyway!

[Stuttgart88]

A huge amount was made of Messi's goal on the Beeb and RTE but very little was made of the absolutely brilliant pass which put him through. Messi took it well ok but the pass was sublime. If it had been Higuain, and the pass was by Messi, all the talk would have been about Messi's pass.

There is speculation that the manager asked Messi's permission to make the substitutions. This is the apparent footage: https://metro.co.uk/2018/06/27/argen...6/?ito=cbshare Who knows. I can't lip read Spanish.

Did Aguero actually touch the ball for the 10 minutes he was on the pitch ?

According to Messi ‘We knew God was with us and wasn’t going to let us go out. I thank all the fans that are here, for all their sacrifice and to all those in Argentina that were always with us. The shirt of the national team is above all else.’ You could imagine God in heaven with his Argentinian shirt on cheering them on, despite many of the Nigerian players blessing themselves before the game.

The goal reminded me of Long vs Germany. Same finish certainly and a lovely first touch (I think Long's was deliberate). Comparing the initial passes would be a stretch I admit!

[Stuttgart88]

Coach in name only?

Ciaran Lennon of the Indo tweeted a great photo pair yesterday: Messi shaking hands with Sampaoli without looking at him, Keane shaking Mick's hand after the Dutch win. The body language was identical in each.

[NeverFeltBetter]

What do people think of Japan's manner of progression? After GD, GS and result between the teams concerned, I can't think of a better tiebreaker than disciplinary record.

Also, last 16 over the last three tournaments:

2010:

AFC: 2
CAF: 1
CONCACAF: 2
CONMEBOL: 5
UEFA: 6

2014:

AFC: 0
CAF: 2
CONCACAF: 3
CONMEBOL: 5
UEFA: 6

2018:

AFC: 1
CAF: 1
CONCACAF: 1
CONMEBOL: 3
UEFA: 11

Europe ftw.

[osarusan]

What do people think of Japan's manner of progression? After GD, GS and result between the teams concerned, I can't think of a better tiebreaker than disciplinary record.

If that's the tiebreaker, so be it. It was known in advance, and anything is better than drawing lots. Japan came through against 3 teams that would have physically outmatched them and picked up fewer bookings.

They were very lucky in other ways though - I think the match against Colombia would have been completely different apart from the early red card and penalty.

EDIT: The way they went through on 'fair play' rings somewhat false after the farcical last 10 minutes of their game too. It looked horrible, but at the same time, it was probably the right thing to do. They are through.