The Guantanamo Guidebook

[GavinZac]

No? Sorry, they already have.

Irish people were among those barbarically killed by Al-Qaeda terrorists in New York.
Irishwoman, Annette Flanagan was kidnapped by terrorists in Afghanistan.
Irish citizens, Ken Bigley, and Margaret Hassan were tortured, humiliated, and eventually beheaded in Iraq.
If Islamic terrorists attack a nuclear power station in Britain, Irish people will be killed.

At the end of the day, this is all part of a war, and innocent people suffer in war. While a minority of suspected terrorists have been badly treated by coalition forces in the War against terrorism, it doesn't compare to what Westerners go through should they be captured by Islamic terrorists. They don't care whether their hostages are American, British, Japanese, German, or Irish. They see them as Westerners, they hate our lifestyle, so they just kill them anyway, to claim a propaganda victory for their "cause". None of the despots, terrorists, nuisances, and other undesirables banged up in Cuba were killed by coalition forces, they can wait for their trial, and some of them are even released. So they get off relatively lightly, for attempting to threaten the security of the civilised world.

this post brought to you by FOX Network News (c) 2004

[Lionel Ritchie]

No? Sorry, they already have.

Irish people were among those barbarically killed by Al-Qaeda terrorists in New York.
Irishwoman, Annette Flanagan was kidnapped by terrorists in Afghanistan.
Irish citizens, Ken Bigley, and Margaret Hassan were tortured, humiliated, and eventually beheaded in Iraq.
If Islamic terrorists attack a nuclear power station in Britain, Irish people will be killed

agreed so far

At the end of the day, this is all part of a war, and innocent people suffer in war.

what war? no-ne's declared any war?

While a minority of suspected terrorists have been badly treated by coalition forces in the War against terrorism, it doesn't compare to what Westerners go through should they be captured by Islamic terrorists.

Why? do we hurt more or something? Do they not feel pain and humiliation the same way we do?

They don't care whether their hostages are American, British, Japanese, German, or Irish. They see them as Westerners, they hate our lifestyle, so they just kill them anyway, to claim a propaganda victory for their "cause".

Like the "allies" segregate out the good guys from the bad guys before they bomb the sh i t out of places yes?

Listen you can dress it up as "collateral damge" or "unintended overkill" or whatever term some Army PR guy uses when talking at press conferences these days -but the fact remains -when you slash a path through the innocent to get at the guilty you forfeit the moral high ground. You p i ss on the values that make our society a better and fairer one than theirs and ultimately -you lose the right to bitch when they strike back with whatever tools are available to them.

None of the despots, terrorists, nuisances, and other undesirables banged up in Cuba were killed by coalition forces,

What despots are in guantanamo? Most of the worlds despots are running autocracies that are propped up by the patronage of the USA. define "nuisance" for me? define "undesirable"?

they can wait for their trial.

What trial? nobody's being tried for a damn thing.

some of them are even released.

How decent of them. Lock someone up for a couple of years without charge and then have the good nature to let them out without so much as a by your leave or an explanation. round of applause for America.

So they get off relatively lightly, for attempting to threaten the security of the civilised world.

aw stop! you're hurting my sides now. The Civilised world you say? what in the name of sweet screaming Jesus is civilised about what they've been doing to people in Guantanamo ...and Abhu Ghraib ...and god knows where else? Really that's brilliant. Your not Cardassian or Romulan by any chance are you? that's the type of hokkum nonsense the Carrdassians and Romulans used spout on Star Trek.

[Neish]

this post brought to you by FOX Network News (c) 2004

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[Neish]

No? Sorry, they already have.

Irish people were among those barbarically killed by Al-Qaeda terrorists in New York.
Irishwoman, Annette Flanagan was kidnapped by terrorists in Afghanistan.
Irish citizens, Ken Bigley, and Margaret Hassan were tortured, humiliated, and eventually beheaded in Iraq.
If Islamic terrorists attack a nuclear power station in Britain, Irish people will be killed.

At the end of the day, this is all part of a war, and innocent people suffer in war. While a minority of suspected terrorists have been badly treated by coalition forces in the War against terrorism, it doesn't compare to what Westerners go through should they be captured by Islamic terrorists. They don't care whether their hostages are American, British, Japanese, German, or Irish. They see them as Westerners, they hate our lifestyle, so they just kill them anyway, to claim a propaganda victory for their "cause". None of the despots, terrorists, nuisances, and other undesirables banged up in Cuba were killed by coalition forces, they can wait for their trial, and some of them are even released. So they get off relatively lightly, for attempting to threaten the security of the civilised world.

Yeah the likes of al-Queda torture, kill and slaughter the innocent and usually people are only there to help. But is this any different than the Christian crusades in the early part of the last millenium simply slaughtered peoples and tribes who refused to convert to christanity?
Westerns have constantly opressed the people of such contries to persue their own intrests usually oil. The british crown opressed Irish people for 800 years and I bet ya wouldn't blame anyone for hate them. In fact some of the people that have done similar(mayb not to such extremes) of this country are held up as National heros

[mypost]

what war? no-one's declared any war?
Why? do we hurt more or something? Do they not feel pain and humiliation the same way we do?
What trial? nobody's being tried for a damn thing.
How decent of them. Lock someone up for a couple of years without charge and then have the good nature to let them out without so much as a by your leave or an explanation. round of applause for America.
what is civilised about what they've been doing to people in Guantanamo ...and Abhu Ghraib ...and god knows where else?

It's a war between the free, tolerant, democratic world, against Islamic militants, their support networks, and rogue states. It's not a war in the conventional sense, but it's still a war.

I would take what was shown in the recent documentary with a pinch of salt. You have to remember, with so much anti-American feeling around these days, that such shows are hyped-up for tv, to suit a particular agenda. The guys locked up in Cuba are not on holiday, they're in a prison. While any abuse from coalition troops towards prisoners can't be condoned, they're not humiliated on the internet, to be later shot or beheaded, are they? A civilised society is not one that beheads people.

Al-Qaeda militants are those who hijack civilian airliners, and smash them into Western buildings. They wander into nightclubs and blow them up. They bomb Western trains, they blow up Western embassies, they destroy foreign vessels. Their followers threaten to throw acid at girls, who don't follow their strict dress code. They preach hatred of our way of life, and the free world. According to coalition troops, they pose a security threat. So, they're put in prison, in Cuba, Iraq, and other countries.

Many of the them have threatened to, and would attack us given the opportunity. Their goal is to create a worldwide Islamic state, which cannot, and will not be allowed to happen. They, their networks, and those who support them must be rounded up by the international community, wherever they are. When that's done, this war will be over.

[pete]

I always love the "...i don't condone...but..." lines.

Seen a bit of tv show about US prisons during the week. Regualr beatings of prisoners, pepper spray for basically talking back to guards etc...

US government should just admit they condone tortune as hardly seems to matter if natioanls or non-nationals.

Can anyone explain why Taliban member were taken by American soldiers from their own country & locked in jail in Cuba & not even charged with an offense?

Show on BBC last night likened American foreign policy to Steve Irwin crocodile hunter. If i keep poking him hes gonna get mad, hes getting mad...

[Macy]

Show on BBC last night likened American foreign policy to Steve Irwin crocodile hunter. If i keep poking him hes gonna get mad, hes getting mad...

Caught about 5 minutes of the "This Week" programme where they were discussing the UK's new laws. Basically internment again (but barely seems to making the news over here). Diane Abbot arguing for the house arrests without charges, trial etc and Michael Portillo arguing against it that there must be a trial process (even one without a trial) and totally anti these measures. Those who don't follow English politics pick out the probably next leader of the Tory part out of that pair..

[dahamsta]

I always love the "...i don't condone...but..." lines.

This is the issue I have with some of the comments in this thread. There should never, ever be a "but" when it comes to things like torture. It's simply unacceptable in a democracy. Saying things like "but those guys do it" is just childish, and things like "they're in jail, not a holiday camp" frankly disgust me. You'd have to wonder how acceptable it would be to people with these opinions if they found themselves in the same position, guilty or not.

adam

[Troy.McClure]

A civilised society is not one that beheads people.

Yup, you fry them instead And this is from the guy who represents what you are defending!