Champions League / Europa League 2017-18

[Stuttgart88]

To be perfectly honest, I derive my entertainment from many factors in a game and would have preferred a tighter game with both teams good at both ends. The poor defending for several of the goals over both legs actually took away from the game for me. I'd have preferred an example of football being played at its best at this stage of an elite competition. Context is everything. Had than been a group game or even a last 16 game I'd have been more forgiving, but last night bugged me just as much as it entertained me.

[DeLorean]

That's a much better way of putting it.

The Monaco Manchester City tie bugged me last year too but, as you say, at least that wasn't a semi final.

[BonnieShels]

5-1 over two legs and guardiola blames the ref!
such nonsense spoken this season about city being one of the all-time best EPL teams. not a patch on the great arsenal or man utd teams of the EPL era

I've been struggling watching any kind of soccer for a long while but he takes the biscuit. The pettiness of his arguments sometimes...

Remember when he drew with Wolves (?) in the EFL Cup and he blamed the ball?

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I'm with Stutts re these games. If we wanted to watch basketball....


That being said I hope we get a goalfest in the final because I want Liverpool to win and that's the only way it will happen.

[OwlsFan]

I thought we shouldn't let the Final pass without a comment even though I will be out and won't see it. The winner will probably be the team which defends the least badly of the two so my money (not really) is on Madrid. It's a toss up which I like the least: Klopp or Ronaldo so I am totally neutral on this one. In Spain I follow Real Betis if only for the reason a barman gave me a Betis jersey when I was in Seville for the 0-0 between Ireland and Spain (under Charlton) in 1992. Alas I no longer fit in to it but I liked the green and white stripes (stripes and green - ideal for me really).

So forecast: 4-2 Madrid.

[DeLorean]

Real looked a tired team at times this season, in the second legs against Juventus & Bayern in particular. They played (close to) their strongest team in their final league game last weekend, Zidane deciding that the game should keep them sharp rather than resting guys at the end of a long season. I wonder could that have been a mistake when facing a younger, energetic Liverpool side who have had a two week break? Winning back-to-back Champions League has proved notoriously difficult so for this team to be on the verge of three is remarkable and they're probably not given the recognition they deserve (compared to Barcelona 09-11 anyway). Another win tomorrow could change that but I fear for them a little, hope I'm wrong though!

[OwlsFan]

Real looked a tired team at times this season, in the second legs against Juventus & Bayern in particular. They played (close to) their strongest team in their final league game last weekend, Zidane deciding that the game should keep them sharp rather than resting guys at the end of a long season. I wonder could that have been a mistake when facing a younger, energetic Liverpool side who have had a two week break? Winning back-to-back Champions League has proved notoriously difficult so for this team to be on the verge of three is remarkable and they're probably not given the recognition they deserve (compared to Barcelona 09-11 anyway). Another win tomorrow could change that but I fear for them a little, hope I'm wrong though!

Why are you up for Madrid ? I can't really make my mind up who I'd like to see win. I used to like Liverpool primarily because they always had a rake of Irish playing for them. Now there's n'er a sign of a tricolour unless it's from Cameroon or Senegal. If Liverpool set off on the front foot like they did for example against Man City, it could be their evening but the odds are in favour of Madrid 6/5 vs 9/4.

[DeLorean]

I'd always have supported Man Utd so pretty natural reasons for not liking Liverpool, although at this stage I'd probably dislike them more than a I actually like United.

I've always preferred Real to Barcelona also, and actually love this particular side. Big Bale fan too despite what he did to our Joshy.

So, this is a very easy one for me.

[NeverFeltBetter]

How about that then? Are Liverpool lost without Salah? Could Karius have been any worse? Will Dunphy ever stop writing off Madrid and Ronaldo after they win something?

[osarusan]

That could destroy Karius and his career. Mistakes that were as bad as you could imagine, on one of the biggest stages possible.

[pineapple stu]

True - though Ulreich made as bad an error in the semi-final and it's almost forgotten now.

Not a great game overall though. Got a feeling Real had weathered the early Liverpool storm when Salah went off. Real were comfortable winners after that, though they did need Karius' intervention in the end.

Bale's other goal was superb; better than Ronaldo's equivalent (which to me is a contender for the most overhyped goal of the tournament - cracking goal, but got excessively talked up purely because it was Ronaldo)

[OwlsFan]

Only saw the goals, not the game, and then only one glimpse. Is there any rule how far a player has to be away from the keeper when he's entitled to block a keeper's kick out from his hands or a throw ? The other mistake: he seemed to be in two minds about whether to punch or catch. Keepers get a lot of stick sometimes for going for the two handed punch instead of catching - now we know why they go for the latter option sometime.

[NeverFeltBetter]

I wondered about the stated rules too when I saw Karius complaining. Looking at my favourite PDF from FIFA, page 123 appears to cover this under three possible infringements. Benzema didn't prevent the keeper from releasing the ball, clearly. I think the ball had been released when Benzema stuck his foot out, so he can't be sanctioned for attempting to play the ball while the keeper was in the process of releasing it. And I don't think Benzema restricted the movement of the keeper in any way, he just darted in front of him as he played the ball.

I can't find any reference to a specific distance a player should be away from the keeper when the keeper has the ball in his hands, or as he is playing it from that position.

[DeLorean]

True - though Ulreich made as bad an error in the semi-final and it's almost forgotten now.

Unfortunately for Karius, a mistake in a final is far more memorable, and two mistakes as bad as they were is off the charts really. I don't think I'd even remember the name Petr Kouba if it wasn't for his error in the Euro 96 final, which was nowhere near as bad as the Karius ones. Being a historic 'Golden Goal' added to it but still.

I doubt many Bayern fans have almost forgotten Ulreich's mistake either.

[NeverFeltBetter]

It's being claimed Karius was suffering from a concussion when he made the two errors.

As has been pointed out elsewhere, Karius and Ramos had a, shall we say, collision of some sort a few minutes before Benzema's goal. Whether it was deliberate or accidental is a matter for debate. It's likely it's what Karius was complaining about to the ref's after the Benzema goal.