What a load of waffle masked as intelligent comment.
Members are 1 block vote and Ray Wilson is hardly an American vulture fund trying to take over the club...his family have been around the club for 50 years. Honestly the BS on here is hilarious. I said it earlier rabbit hole for I'll informed rovers bashing......
Cork supposed to have chanced their arm with a 50,000 bid to Oldham for Courtney Duffus, but were turned down. It looks likely that he'll extend his loan with Waterford.
They understand quite well how things work and could go. Nobody is claiming that a directors loan with attached conditions can happen without approval. What has been claimed is that the board have considered the possibility of additional directors loan with conditions attached as per the previous one that was accepted. If it comes to pass that the director in question gets 50% ownership I cant see how he can be prevented in real terms having a majority 'vote' that could agree to allow complete ownership. Whats to stop his associates being members and and voting in his favour. He has 50% and the 800 club need 100% of their 50% to counter any of his proposals. There is little stopping him loading the 800 club with a good few people that will would back him and then it isnt 100% of the 50%.Originally Posted by sundance kid
On the current situation, if things are financially bleak enough and the 800 club has access to equity via a director then a proposed cash injection isnt dead in the water before it goes to the members. The chance to change manager, secure the clubs future as competative in the league but at a cost, maybe under a similar term of repaying hypothetically €1mil in 3-5 years or its a conversion to shares also. These things are a real possibility as the board needs financial room to manouvre. The Burke transfer has changed the landscape for now but its acknowledged that without additional income from Europe next season the same circumstances will happen again without further transfers out and the money generated by those. A financial restructuring is otherwise on the cards and that is cutting costs (player budget), or take additional investment from a director which, as per previous examples, will have strings attached.
I dont think even the most ardent of Rovers fans will claim that their board's performance has been up to standard over the last 5 or 6 years or so. Wilson has got on board with some of his own trusted people and he has his own end game plans if Rovers are not sufficiantly well run to pay back what is owed - €150k per year over 10 years currently and maybe more if additional loans are needed.
My 'pal' knows exactly how things works, he is pretty skeptical on members of the current board and their motives. He feels that the board have been backing themselves in to a corner. He believes that the likes of Wilson are quite happy for this to happen, for his position and influence to grow, that he is in a win win position - it the money is paid back he is happy and it would mean the club he supports is doing well; if the club isnt doing well then he is manouvering to be in a position to take control and he can expidite this if he is required to offer additioanl loans. Whether they are accepted at an EGM or not is anotther thing but as said, if things are bleak enough then members might take a pragmatic approach even if it risks the supporters owned model. Its members of the 800 club that cannot or will not see that this is a quite real possibility are the ones that dont grasp how things work, as with a loan already accepted then the 800 club control of the club is on the clock. If Rovers had never had a dip in form, if they had or do win the league in the next few years then the situation changes. The problem is though it will only get tougher to get back to top of the heap as other clubs get European income year on year and consolidte at the top. For Rovers to break in to that they will have to spend money they dont currently have and real consideration of additional cash injection from Wilson gets closer. Not to consider this possibility is naive. If Wilson was to get a 40% stake in the club if loans get exchanged for shares then it would have shown a greater understanding to the risk to 800 club control not a lack of understanding.
Nobody is suggesting that Wilson doesnt want whats good for Rovers as a fan, he is simply waiting in the wings to take things on if the club doesnt perform sufficiently well to repay loans. He can then run things in the way he sees fit to be a success.
Last edited by Nesta99; 07/06/2018 at 9:48 PM.
The number of home games left have to be taken in to consideration too with the weighting of fixtures so front heavy.
It wouldnt be 51% owned by members it would be 50% and the other 50% in one director's hands. At best that would cause a deadlock in a vote with the chairman I presume then casting their vote to break the deadlock. It is not inconcievable that the single largest shareholder would be the chairman by then as it is not inconcievable that the current chairman is casting the balance of power vote either. But in all likihood with the way thing have been going at borad level will JP be in the chair for another x number of years!?
Lol . So attendances are no longer down but forecast to be down....about as much sense as all the other stuff "A fella told you and you are repeating" I know lots of members who look around the entire club and think we are on track but then I'm sure your lad knows it all.
Does it strike you as ironic that you are so worried about rovers fan ownership model allowing Ray Wilson to take over from your position as dundalk dynamos or whatever the rebrand iskeep worrying about us we love the attention.
That doesn't surprise me. I haven't heard anything to back that up but he's a very good player and a JC style player installed position we lack depth.
I'm usually the first to slag Rovers off and I'm massively skeptical of this whole deal but if what you are saying is out of your buddy's mouth and he's a member then he's an idiot.
I don't know the exact percentages but if the Rovers membership own 50% and Wilson owns 50% then is not a case of them all sitting in a room for votes and Wilson needing to convince 1 Rovers member to back him. The Rovers membership are a block Inthe same way Wilson is. They have their own meetings and make a decision and then they go back to the board and vote whichever way they have decided.in your scenario Wilson would need close to half the membership to make decisions plus his own votes.
Obviously the rovers members representatives can't go back to the board on every decision but I'd imagine they would generally vote the same way on key decisions aNd be wary of Wilson.
Lads, do yous not have a Stephen Bradley interview to talk about?
Lol good one.
Dufus would be a good signing for cork but with Waterford in the shake up for Europe I'm not surprised he is staying put.
Where did I say that? I'm saying that with most home games played that with finanances there are not so many games left that will generate income.. There is an imbalance to the season and majority of money is already banked. I neither claimed that anybody knows it all and that is ringing true with some very blinkered Rovers fans too. Laugh and deflect all you like, it doesnt change what is happening currently and that change will continue without an upturn of fortunes, pardon the pun, on the field (and in transfer markets on from the Burke sale). I have mentioned the 50/50 block voting - it will be a deadlock at best and a casting vote will be need needed. That casting vote can facilitate many things including watering down further the membership say. Do articles of membership insist that members must always tow the party line, that any dissenting group cannot ballot together as an additional block!? As for worry about Rovers, not by me as the clubs future is not at risk imo. It should be a concern for members though if they want to maintain their control in the club as this is at risk. To assume that there wont be a vote on a change of ownership model is not the wisest thing as all eventualities should be prepared for. It might even be of benefit to the club to relinquish supporter ownership going forward. How other clubs are owned or run isnt relevant, Dundalk tried the supporter ownership model and it failed, private ownership has worked better but not without fault and risk to the club. No Dundalk fan blindly trusts the clubs owners now or before with concern about a land grab of Oriel or the draining of cash assets out of the club etc. The motives of people involved have always been questioned. I dont see why it is an issue to discuss another club, people have been doing so in relation to Bray, Athlone, Limerick, Dundalk in terms of ownership, motives and conduct of owners included, but dare anyone question things about Shamrock Rovers. Of all clubs Shamrock Rovers should be open to discussion considering the Kilcoyne experience rather than scoff and ridicule the mere consideration that the precious current model is at risk at minimum of being weakened by 50% (and more if finances continue to tighten). I presume that there is an element of a popularity contest among the membership at AGM's when underperforming officers on the board are annually voted back, shouldnt this be of concern if a simple majority of a block vote continues to reinstate people if say opposition is 49.9%? Is it the case that part of the conditions of the loan was to allow seats on the board for Wilson and co rather than them having to go through the standard process of obtaining a place on the board trough the articles of membership. In other words circumvented the standard regulations of how the 800 club appont members of the board, to me when exceptions like that are made then a membership are already weakening their role and on the slippery slope. Time will tell as usual!Lol . So attendances are no longer down but forecast to be down....about as much sense as all the other stuff "A fella told you and you are repeating" I know lots of members who look around the entire club and think we are on track but then I'm sure your lad knows it all.
Does it strike you as ironic that you are so worried about rovers fan ownership model allowing Ray Wilson to take over from your position as dundalk dynamos or whatever the rebrand is
It's 400 club, not 800, and actually it's a lot less than that since the club is no longer in critical condition. I think most Rovers fans have a healthy dose of scepticism with regard to the wisdom of taking the loan but Wilson has had plenty of opportunities to take the club over in the past and hasn't. If he ends up keeping his 50% stake it's because the club has been run improperly but, more likely, he's going to let his shareholding dwindle like he did the last time.
He can do without more ridicule. He has a couple of matches to win before the break to save his job.
He believes that two wins against Bray and Limerick will put Rovers around 3rd or 4th.
He's probably not wrong about 4th. Everyone from 3rd to 6th seems to be losing the plot at the same time. Pat's should be well clear at this point but they've been just as bad.
Rumours of Damien Delaney to Cork.
EDIT: also, any chance the thread title could be amended to 2018, or just drop the year altogether.
Last edited by osarusan; 08/06/2018 at 9:34 AM. Reason: DAMIEN!!!
Damien
That would be a superb signing ahead of the European games. It would seem to make sense for everybody ones he was happy with terms.
[/B][I]P.Esc.
Quite possible, after Dundalk and Cork (for me a mini league for the title) there are a clutch of teams that are equally inconsistent, Pats, Shams, Derry, Waterford have all shown a penchant to win 3/4 games and then lose 3/4 games, they could finish in almost any order.
Surprised Shams gates (on average) are up this season, although most of their results woes have been on the road. Not aware of any financial difficulties off the park - sure losing money is almost mandatory in LOIWilson appears to be a genuine fan of the club so doubt he would pull the plug and unless that happens I cant see any immediate threat,Presumably next seasons budget would be impacted by qualification (or otherwise) for European football and that will be known before any decisions are made on next years budget.
At this point shams problem all seem to be ON the pitch (and long may it last)
When Bohs fans start making sense the end of the world can't be far behind
Its actually mad how the 3rd to 6th teams appear to be trying desperately hard to avoid Europe.
I can see us beating Bray and Limerick and that would make the last match before the break against Derry a big one.
I could also see us losing all 3not really ....I hope
a lot might depend on if Car and Finn are back
Agreed - two wins would likely see them into 4th place on GD. 3rd place by the break is mathematically impossible.
Who knows how it will pan out for the rest of the season, but based on recent form the European qualification places are far from the given that they should be.
The implications of non qualification for Rovers could be significant in many ways
They all really want to compete in the much more prestigious Irn Bru cup, Europa League money is nothing compared to that experienceWhen Bohs fans start making sense the end of the world can't be far behind
Its actually mad how the 3rd to 6th teams appear to be trying desperately hard to avoid Europe.
I can see us beating Bray and Limerick and that would make the last match before the break against Derry a big one.
I could also see us losing all 3
a lot might depend on if Car and Finn are back
Mon the Town!
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