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Thread: Gaa 2016

  1. #21
    Coach BonnieShels's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kingdom View Post
    My own take on Donaghy is that he offers nothing positive, and plenty of negatives, while detracting from the teams performance. He's the proverbial elephant in the room. While pointing to your own social media pages are never a good indicator, if I was to image my Fb updates and tweets on the days of Kerry games for the past 2 years then it would display the disgust I have for him and his antics for the past while, along with being selected. He is immobile, and doesn't appear capable of winning his own ball anymore. He is not inter-county standard at midfield either.

    The punch, let's call it what it was, on the Clare player - a much smaller player too - was unforgiveable, low and cheap. Part of me hopes the ccc take a look at it, and decide to ban him, because it removes one of the problems for Kerry.
    In fairness if he's been riling you up can you imagine what he's been doing to the rest of us?

    I got banned on boards for 2 days on Sunday for calling him a scumbag after the punch. And whilst I should have used less flowery language, I don't think scumbag is beyond reproach in this instance. I mean come on. How about thug?

    I only got to see the match live from about the 20th min (the punch happened on 17) as I was out with the missus, but I was keeping abreast with boards and RTE text commentary. And then of course I went looking for the video of the incident as everyone on boards was going mad about it.

    RTE had NOTHING to say about it. Absolutely nothing. It's these things that (what are brought up further down your post) lead the rest of us to believe there's a conspiracy or some sort of "ah sure it's Kerry" and on it goes.
    My natural distaste (cos ya know, I'm a Dub) for the Kerry team has evolved into this almighty hatred since around 2009. And it's usually as a result of one man. Game after game he's defended for stuff like this and game after game he gets away with it. "Poor oul Star"

    Like I said, if it Philly McMahon or Neil McGee that threw the punch it would have been headline news but as it was a Kerry player there was nothing. Even in the reviews of the game it was all talk about.

    In the studio O'Rourke brought it up ever so briefly only for Brolly and Lyster to change the subject about how Kerry were "bored" out there.

    As of today nothing mentioned in The Irish Times!


    I think it also is high-time to start questioning Eamon Fitz. He definitely started off well, his coaching at colleges level is apparently legendary, and he has racked up an All-Ireland already. However, and it's a big however, he just doesn't look to believe in an alternative to the plan that he has in place at the moment. There has long been a worry that senior club football in the county is in a bad place and has been for a long time.
    In my post before I posted it I called Fitz a spoofer. But I thought that it might come across as tempestuous.

    But tbh I can't see how he couldn't be construed as such.

    He manged to bag an AI with a fairly average team after resorting to hit and hope against a naive Mayo side and a handy ref in the SF. You would have thought at that point he would have said to the likes of Donaghy, O'Mahony and Cooper etc. Good luck and thanks. And then with that done set about blooding younger players that haven't really gotten a chance.

    With that AI in the bag he had time to establish a new squad and a new ethos and draw a line under that other era of players. Instead as you said you have this mish mash of styles abilities and fitness and he's, for whatever reason, persisting with it.


    I never go in for (in GAA) the talk of "how many players would play on the Dublin team?" because it's not clever, and different counties do have different styles and traditions (something McGuiness spoke well about for once). But the Kerry squad is a worry.
    [...]

    Part of me looks at Fionn and thinks he'd be excellent in a system Dublin employ, but it's counter-productive to do that. It's a huge worry that Marc Sé and Aidan Mahony are still go-to-guys, particularly when there is more exposure for weaker clubs in the Kerry Championships than ever before.

    [...]

    I track it all back to when Ger Brennan literally stopped Declan O'Sullivan in his tracks. That was the turning point in the Kerry-Dublin relationship.
    It's a fun thing to do though. I think that the prospects of the younger players as you've mentioned have been hampered by who's around them.

    I also like that you hate Kealy as much as I do. Well hate is too strong, I love seeing him in goal, but it kills me he has an AI medal.

    I'm no sports psychologist (obviously) but I think that the managers and the squads themselves do work in funny ways. Look at Dublin now.

    [...]

    *The reverse is true for Kerry. There is always a mindset about Down that has transcended generations. There is the hang-ups with Tyrone (which there isn't with Armagh)
    You're onto something there alright. It's funny, Kerry were a nothing team when I was growing up, like Brazil, and dining out on their glorious past... then 1997 happened.

    The Down hang up is gas. As was the Tyrone one. Which despite the victory last year I don't think is gone.



    ----------------------
    Bonnie, on a fair level, what do you call the big 5? Dublin, Tyrone, Mayo, Monaghan, Donegal? Mayo beaten by Galway, who in turn were beaten by Tipp, who were in turn beaten by Kerry (although you could argue they were beaten by the occasion)?
    The big 5 I was referring to are Tyrone, Mayo, Dublin, Donegal and Kerry. Until Monaghan get to AISFs consistently (or at all then they'll stay with the "rest")

    Kerry will not win an All-Ireland this year, nor were they ever. The win two years ago was very much a bonus All-Ireland, because the young players that won the All-Ireland down in Limerick in the replay, have either not kicked on, or just had an exceptional 6 weeks of football for ordinary players.
    As I said above they weren't allowed kick on.


    Maybe I'm insulated from it, being of Kerry stock, but I never feel that you get from Kerry people speaking on a National stage any aura of arrogance or self-hype. I certainly don't feel Kerry are ever en-vogue or lauded from the hills a-la Donegal or Tyrone.
    You certainly are. The commentary on Newstalk and RTE was nauseating. I'm sorry to say that it's rare that I meet someone from Kerry around matches that have anything complimentary to say about Dublin or whoever.

    I'm certainly not levelling this at you, but there is definitely a holier than thou attitude when it comes to football with Kerry people (again not all); like they are the keepers of the flame. I know the internet isn't representative but some of the stuff be it on Hogan Stand or Boards, is bordering on potty from your compatriots. And yet I don't see the same coming from other counties. Even the most mental of Rossies isn't as bad.

    The level of hate that there is for Kerry here I find somewhat upsetting. I can understand hate towards individuals (for Bonnie, read Kingdom, and for Donaghy read MDMA - even writing MDMA wants me to punch the wall), but not towards the county.
    It's only a natural upping of the ante. I think the rise of Ulster ball in the noughties certainly made more Kerry people bristle at the notion that they weren't kingpins anymore. I was once in Kilorglin and I was chatting to the barman during the Dublin-Tyrone QF in 2010 and he hadn't a decent word to say about Tyrone. And this was the Tyrone team that gave a masterclass in 2008. There they were playing Dublin adn all he could go on about was the northern filth yada yada.

    Now I know I do a fair amount of defending of Tyrone but that sort of blindness is annoying.

    Everyone seems to whinge that Kerry are dirty, or that Kerry portray themselves as holier-than-thou. We don't.
    What I'll say about this is why do people think this?

    The media is awash with Kerry-folk who peddle this sort of guff so naturally enough the rest of us get miffed at it.

    We know we've cynical tactics, no different to every other county that wants to win the big one. Aidan O'Mahony was the best centre-back in the country by a country mile, and then decided to have a moment of madness against Cork, and his career has never been the same. Donaghy has always been a scumbag on the field, but because he isn't contributing positively only the negatives are discussed.
    [...]
    Because it works for them, and because they are the ones winning, no attention is drawn to it.
    Kerry have done over the years gotten away with their fair share. And yes the cynicism has always been there, but when that cynicism which we all see is coupled with blinkers then it gets up people's goats.

    Like I said, I didn't grow up with these all-conquering Kerry teams or great Kerry teams so I just think of them as AN Other tbh so the antics of fans around me at matches over the years makes it a tad harder to take.

    Kerry were very poor in the All-Ireland final last year, and to be honest the rain and conditions probably helped Kerry keep the score respectable. We knew from 10 mins out that the goose was cooked. This years league final
    [...]
    The black card was definitely a turning point, but I agree with you Bonnie, I think age would have been the turning point anyway.
    You see, this is why I enjoy these rants in here with you because they aren't blinkered. The consensus I got last year was that Dublin won because of the conditions etc. Bull. It was a three-point hammering if ever there was one.

    ---

    I didn't properly get a chance to respond to this earlier.
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  2. #22
    Coach BonnieShels's Avatar
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    This came up when I went to post it:

    "The text that you have entered is too long (13473 characters). Please shorten it to 10000 characters long."

    Maybe it is a ramble!
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  3. #23
    International Prospect bennocelt's Avatar
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    Don't know, but anytime I look at Donaghy he is a class act, big and strong and usually does the job. Must be a Kerry thing, 4 all Ireland's and still considered not good enough.

  4. #24
    Coach BonnieShels's Avatar
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    Credit where credit's due. But we're taking about this year and his thuggery on Sunday.
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    International Prospect bennocelt's Avatar
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    a link?

  6. #26
    Coach BonnieShels's Avatar
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    I searched all evening. It's omitted from the official GAA clips. So you'll have to go into RTÉ player and look at the match itself. 17min is when it happened.
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  8. #27
    Capped Player DeLorean's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kingdom View Post
    Everyone seems to whinge that Kerry are dirty, or that Kerry portray themselves as holier-than-thou. We don't.
    I had to laugh when you went from this ^ ... to this...

    Quote Originally Posted by Kingdom View Post
    Kerry could have been relegated this season from Division 1 when Donegal came down to Tralee and tried to beat us up. There's no point debating that, because that's what happened.
    I was actually at that match and it was very much a two way street. Obviously the McGee incident (on Fitzgerald) was the most unsavoury but this notion that Donegal came to bully Kerry is typical of the houlier-than-thou delusion that you think doesn't exist.

    I remember the Michael Quirke (who I actually have some time for) article in the aftermath of this match and it really was the epitome of the pretentiousness that exists amongst a lot of the Kerry support.

    It was interesting that he basically said Donaghy started the whole thing off...

    This was by no means one-way traffic where Kerry were inanimate victims of the intimidation and aggression of their Ulster opponents. If anything, Donaghy lit the fuse with his man-handling of Donegal’s pack leader Michael Murphy following an early hop ball. He threw him to the turf in what seemed like a statement of intent… ‘ye boys won’t come into our house and bully us today’.
    Now it has to be remembered that the previous few Kerry Donegal games passed with little or no incidents, even the All Ireland final where everything was on the line. So, tell me, why was there a feeling that Donegal were so intent on coming to Tralee to beat up the poor Kerry boys? Why would Donaghy feel the need to make a statement early on? Sometimes games just spiral out of control and that's exactly what happened here and, if anything, Donaghy started the whole thing off as Quirke pointed out.

    Aidan O'Mahony is the ultimate chest-out, macho warrior at the best of times, but even by his own standards he was possessed that day. How he didn't see the line I'll never know.

    What I found ridiculous was that Quirke seems to accept that Kerry started it, and they were no angles in the whole affair, yet he still manages to portray the view that they were only standing up for themselves against the bold Ulster team.

    His final paragraph summed up the delusion...

    For years, Kerry were criticised for having a weak underbelly when faced with the Ulster grit and grind. But those days are a distant memory. If you want to play ball, they’ll play ball, but don’t be fooled, if you want to fight, they’ve no problem dancing under those lights either.
    How could the likes of Seamus Moynihan, Tom O'Sullivan, Aidan O'Mahony, Tommy Griffin, Fitzmaurice, Tomás, Marc, Darragh, Galvin, Seamus Scanlon, Declan O'Sullivan, Donaghy, Tommy Walsh, Quirke himself, etc. ever be accused of having a weak underbelly when it comes to standing up for themselves? These are some of the toughest nuts to ever grace a football field.

    Can he really say with a straight face that the current crop are more capable of 'defending' themselves than those guys, as that is the generation he is presumably referring to? Where Kerry have improved is their ability to mix it up tactically, they can meet defensive systems fire with fire and cope more productively with swarm tackling. That's a completely different thing.

    And it is portraying a houlier-than-thou mentality. It's like "all we want to do is play beautiful football but if ye want to fight we'll be forced to stick up for ourselves".

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  10. #28
    Capped Player DeLorean's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kingdom View Post
    Tralee football is in the doldrums, regardless of how many drums Stacks want to beat at matches
    Didn't they beat their drums all the way to an All Ireland Club semi final just last year? Doldrums definitely has a different definition in Kerry than elsewhere.

    Rahillys seem to be motoring a bit better now too, they've a serious amount of talent if they can tighten up a bit defensively.
    Last edited by DeLorean; 03/08/2016 at 10:53 AM.

  11. #29
    Capped Player DeLorean's Avatar
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    Just checked out that Donaghy incident on the RTÉ player. It's a bit wild in fairness but I wouldn't be overly convinced there was that much malice in it. I wouldn't have him in the 'thug' bracket at all anyway, an annoying mouthpiece yes but it's rare enough he does anything actually dirty. I'd be slow to write him off also, if ever there was a man for the big occasion and with Dublin down O'Carroll there could be a bit of vulnerability there. Obviously he can't start midfield though.

  12. #30
    Coach BonnieShels's Avatar
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    I have to disagree DeL but time is tight to properly respond so... :P

    I'll be back on later.

    In other news... Jimmy Mac is back:

    http://www.rte.ie/sport/gaa/2016/080...rt-for-dublin/
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  13. #31
    Coach BonnieShels's Avatar
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    And just as we're about to start a domination the GAA go and sort out the championship mess... ish:

    Quote Originally Posted by GAA
    Proposal on the format of the All-Ireland SFC
    GAA Ard Stiúrthóir Páraic Duffy has produced a far-reaching proposal on how best to restructure the All-Ireland Senior Football Championship and condense our calendar of inter-county games to give our club championships more room to breathe.

    The Ard Stiúrthoir's proposal seeks to present a modest adjustment to the championship format that would produce a more exciting senior football championship within the current provincial championship structure and in a way that should not have a negative impact on the playing of county club championships.

    The proposal will add eight extra matches to the provincial and All-Ireland senior football championship programme. However, when one allows for the abolition of the Allianz League semi-finals, the increase in the overall annual inter-county senior football programme is reduced to six matches.

    Also, tighter scheduling and a revised policy on replays can bring improvements to the situations that affect the scheduling of club fixtures and the availability of inter-county players to clubs.

    The proposal seeks to replace the quarter-final stage of the Championship with a group stage contested by the four provincial champions and the four round 4 qualifier winners. Pitting the eight best teams in the country against one another in this way would increase the number of high-quality matches at the height of the summer when playing conditions are optimal.

    The new structure would provide a more exacting pathway to the All-Ireland final: the finalists will have had to compete with three of the best teams in the country at the group stage, followed by a semi-final with a top-four team that came through the same test. This will have the effect of ensuring that the finalists will have been equally tested and that the two best teams in the country contest the All-Ireland final.

    Both All-Ireland Semi-Finals would be played over the one weekend which should generate greater excitement and also ensure both teams have the same period of time to prepare for the All-Ireland Final.

    Under the Ard Stiúrthoir's proposal, the format of the All-Ireland senior football championship would be as follows:

    PROVINCIAL CHAMPIONSHIPS: Knock-out format as at present.

    ALL-IRELAND QUALIFIER SERIES

    Round 1: Sixteen teams that do not qualify for provincial semi-finals

    Round 2: Eight round 1 winners play eight defeated provincial semi-finalists

    Round 3: Eight round 2 winners play each other on an open-draw basis

    Round 4: Four round 3 winners play four provincial runners-up

    Proposal 1:

    (i) A Division 3 or 4 team drawn against a Division 1 or 2 team in rounds one, two or three of the qualifiers will be granted an automatic home-venue advantage.

    (ii) The format of ‘A’ and ‘B’ sides to the qualifier draw will be ended.

    QUARTER-FINAL STAGE

    Proposal 2:

    The current quarter-final stage of the championship to be replaced by a Group Stage, contested by the four provincial champions and the four round 4 qualifier winners.

    The group stage will be organised on a league basis with two groups of four teams, with each team playing the other three teams once.

    After the group stage is completed the top two teams in each group will progress to the All-Ireland semi-final with the Group 1 winner playing the Group 2 runner-up and the Group 2 winner playing the Group 1 runner-up

    Order of fixtures in both groups

    Round 1

    Team 1 v Team 2. Croke Park

    Team 3 v Team 4. Croke Park

    Round 2

    Team 1 v Team 3 or 4. Home advantage for provincial champions.

    Team 2 V Team 3 or 4. Home advantage for provincial champions.

    Round 3

    Team 1 v Team 3 or 4. Home advantage for Team 3 or 4.

    Team 2 v Team 3 or 4. Home advantage for Team 3 or 4.

    Note:

    Home venues shall be subject to approval by the Central Competitions Control Committee (CCCC) and
    shall meet the criteria set down by the National Facilities/Health and Safety Committee. CCCC shall
    make the draws for Rounds 2 and 3.

    The above fixtures format for the group stage means that each team will have one game in Croke Park,
    one home game and one away game.

    Tie-breakers in the event of teams finishing level on points (in order of application):

    (i) Result of game between two tied teams (only where two teams are level on points)

    (ii) Score difference

    (iii) Highest score for

    (iv) Goals scored

    (v) Play-off match

    All-IRELAND SEMI-FINALS:

    Group 1 winner v Group 2 runner-up

    Group 2 winner v Group 1 runner-up

    (to be played over one weekend)

    All-IRELAND FINAL

    ***

    At its meeting on Friday 22 July, An Coiste Bainistíochta considered the attached proposal and agreed to circulate it to all counties. It will be discussed at the next meeting of Central Council.
    http://www.gaa.ie/football/news/prop...l-ireland-sfc/

    And the PDF:

    http://www.gaa.ie/mm//Document/GaaIe...al_English.pdf
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  14. #32
    Capped Player DeLorean's Avatar
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    They've basically targeted only only part of the GAA season that doesn't need restructuring.

  15. #33
    Coach BonnieShels's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeLorean View Post
    They've basically targeted only only part of the GAA season that doesn't need restructuring.
    It's a stepping stone. Change is a pain in the GAA. Within 20 years the Provincials will no longer be part of the AI Championship.
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  16. #34
    Capped Player DeLorean's Avatar
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    A stepping stone in the wrong direction. There were some pretty decent suggestions out there, particularly the McGuinness and Parkinson ones, but they have come up with a something utterly useless. The snoozefest from May to August remains intact and the club schedules still in disarray .

  17. #35
    Seasoned Pro NeverFeltBetter's Avatar
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    Can't make sense of this proposal. The insistence from some on maintaining the provincial championships, in both codes, is rapidly moving from a well-intentioned sop to tradition to something actively harming the game. It's crying out for a group stage to knock-out structure from the start, not this weird alternative.
    Author of Never Felt Better (History, Film Reviews).

  18. #36
    The Cheeto God Real ale Madrid's Avatar
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    Did Tyrone sack Harte yet? How many more years of this do they have to endure.
    If a dog weighs under 50 lbs it's a cat, and cats are useless.

  19. #37
    Coach BonnieShels's Avatar
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    Tipp should have made this count earlier. Mayo will run away with this.
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  20. #38
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    I think Kerry have a great chance v Dublin on Sunday. Game will sell-out. Has to be said that two 50k plus crowds on past two Sundays show that the GAA can still pull in big crowds. However I think they could reduce adult tickets prices a bit.

  21. #39
    Coach BonnieShels's Avatar
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    They don't.


    And it's sold out
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  22. #40
    Capped Player DeLorean's Avatar
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    Them's fightin' words, Bonnie.

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