Even if it's true that Arter's expected recovery period is the same as Keane's I still thinks it's fair to pick Keane but not Arter. Arter will be asked to play a demanding role at a level he's not really used to. Keane will be asked to come off the bench, if he's asked to do anything, realistically if we need a goal and huff and puff isn't working. The fitness requirements are different, the demands on a recently healed injury are different, one is team captain and record goalscorer, the other has 2 caps.
That said, if both were fully fit I'd bet on Arter getting more minutes than Keane?
Quite possibly. Keane's probably looking at somewhere between zero and forty minutes, tops. I kind of hope he doesn't see any more than that anyway as it will probably mean we're down 3-0 after twenty minutes or something! Or that Long has got injured.
Last edited by DeLorean; 03/06/2016 at 8:26 AM.
are we not being a little over the top with the writing off of what keane might contribute?Originally Posted by DeLorean
Hopefully he can contribute something, but would you expect him to play any more than that (in the group stages anyway)?
Then his name is ciaran clark.
I'm a bloke,I'm an ocker
And I really love your knockers,I'm a labourer by day,
I **** up all me pay,Watching footy on TV,
Just feed me more VB,Just pour my beer,And get my smokes, And go away
I need time to figure that one out...
It'll take two years training just to learn how to cook the rice.
Thats exactly what i meant
Did you not get that Stutts?
I'm a bloke,I'm an ocker
And I really love your knockers,I'm a labourer by day,
I **** up all me pay,Watching footy on TV,
Just feed me more VB,Just pour my beer,And get my smokes, And go away
If we are going to bring someone who will realistically only be able to play a limited role, surely we should bring Arter rather than Keane?
Arter is an impact player who could provide the same kind of boost off the bench as someone like McClean. It's hard to discern what impact Keane makes judging by any of his substitute appearances. For all the limitations of someone like Murphy, he does serve a purpose. He is stronger than a lot of defender; he tires them and drags them out of position, he competes in the air, he can cause panic stations in the box - Scotland goal (h), penalty Bosnia (h). What does Keane offer any more? Obviously the best goalscorer in Irish history but we need someone who can fulfil a role for the team. We shouldn't be including someone in a motivational/spiritual guidance role; we have the oldest squad in the tournament. What is he going to impart that a 29 year old or 33 year old doesn't already know?
The only chance (I can see) he has of scoring is getting on the end of a panic in the 6 yard box at a set-piece, but we have been doing perfectly good scoring in these situations with the players we have.
Keane whenever he plays looks like he's in the land of the giants. He is easily nullified and marked out of the game by defenders; he doesn't have the pace to neutralise this, or to get into good positions.
We should bring players like Doyle who can fulfil a role for the team and run their hearts out for 90 minutes. If Doyle was on the end of a McGeady cross for the Keogh chance in Warsaw or a McGeady cross for the Murphy chance in Cork, I would bank on him to put it away 9 times out of 10.
Bit concerning hearing about players like Murphy, Walters and Keane struggling for full fitness when they are all playing in the same positions. And Long will be a target for defenders during the tournament so the importance of who is selected in those positions is of tantamount importance.
Some of these players are going to want to play no matter what. I hope MON puts the foot down more than Trapattoni who continuously played Given despite the fact he was clearly unfit during the pre-match warm up against Croatia.
Is Walters "struggling for full fitness" or did he sit out a day due to a strain?
I regularly have to take a day or two off training but it doesn't mean I'm struggling.
I'd have taken Doyle too, unquestionably.
Jon Walters & Robbie Keane (both calf) sitting out Ireland training again at Fota Island. Walters has done work in the gym (ice cream parlour)
Robbie meanwhile went for a bike ride:
- I asked if there was a reason Walters misses training sessions so much
- Several days later, he is ruled out for several weeks
- Well before this, I had already posted about how he was playing for Stoke only with painkilling injections
There was nothing nefarious about what I posted.
Bottom line it's a concern to me that his training has been limited throughout the campaign, he has played with painkilling injections, he is picking up little knocks and strains and the worry will be there in the back of my head that he may have rushed back so he would be ready for this tournament - as players are want to do.
With Murphy he has been given all the time in the world to recover by McCarthy but he has very little match practice over the last three months.
Unfortunately, Walters and Murphy's performances against Holland and Belarus didn't do much to soothe any doubts; they both looked significantly off the pace.
Keane has been picking up more injuries over the last year or so than he has probably at any point in his career, and at 36 it is harder to legislate for this - no matter what he says about being a quick healer.
The more time passes, the more I think we would have been better served by including any two (or at least one) of Doyle, Stokes or Pilkington.
I would have said McGoldrick but there are fitness doubts surrounding him too. No such doubts about Doyle who has been flying for Colorado lately.
Last edited by TheOneWhoKnocks; 03/06/2016 at 1:03 PM.
Saw some more of RObbies pictures on the bike, has he not cycled one before? Or is he in a really bad way. He was seriously struggling. It's only a bita grass Robbie!
I suppose a dub wouldnt be used to much grass other than on a soccer/gaelic pitch.
I agree with all those points, I've been meannig to mention the robbie one as well, dont be adding years on him though. But he has seemed to start picking up the injuries, almost as consistenly as O'shea has the last few years. I think thats an ominous sign in itself, and one that will help robbie with his decision after the Euros. I personally would love him to stay on till WC 2018. If Carvallho at 38 can be a CB, the oldest outfield player in the Euros, then robbie can be the oldest striker in the WC 2018
Last edited by paul_oshea; 03/06/2016 at 1:36 PM.
I'm a bloke,I'm an ocker
And I really love your knockers,I'm a labourer by day,
I **** up all me pay,Watching footy on TV,
Just feed me more VB,Just pour my beer,And get my smokes, And go away
I can't see Robbie staying after the Euros. His contributions are more and more marginal these days.
I never suggested TOWK said anything nefarious about Walters above. I just asked whether its an exaggeration to say he's struggling for full fitness. He has played through the pain barrier before, when rest would be better advised, and at the same time produced his best Irish performances. I'm not that concerned about Walters and am not that fussed that he had a poor game against the Dutch. He's a good player that suits MON's methods.
I do think that Doyle and Pilkington should be there though. They both showed enough in their cameos in the last get together. I think the back-up options lack pace and mobility which worries me. Mon obviously doesn't agree. Given Pilkington's sick note tendency, perhaps it's because he can't be trusted to stay fit for over the course of a few weeks?
I hope Stokes plays well under Rodgers because an in form Stokes might have something to offer. But I don't think a good SFA Cup Final is enough to suddenly be going to the Euros. He's done eff all of consequence over the last year other than moan and tweet about not being picked.
Yeah, I can't agree about Stokes either. He just hasn't shown enough recently to demand a place. I do, however, worry about Walters, Long lasting three games in less than a fortnight without some sort of issue. Murphy and Keane do not really inspire confidence anymore for various reasons. My thought on Pilks are well known on here, I think he would give the versatility and dynamism off the bench or to cover injury that this team thrives on.
Regarding Keane, my biggest issue with TOWK was always his attitude towards Keane and the insistence that his demise was upon us was definitely premature. However, I am there now. Outside of his experience and leadership there is little else to justify his ongoing inclusion in the quad beyond these championships. I do worry a little that he will become another Shay Given who doesn't know how to say goodbye and ends up being looked upon by a sizeable number of fans - myself included - as a bad smell.
We have a great crop of young players coming through if you ask me. We have a solid spine and we need to start blooding the promising young players. Keane, Given and O'Shea will have to retire or be ousted. Walters should stay.
I like high energy football. A little bit rock and roll. Many finishes instead of waiting for the perfect one.
I'm happy with Robbie getting a swansong at the Euros. Not just for sentimentality's sake - a motivated and invested Robbie is worth his weight in 67 goals to a squad at a major tournament.
I'd be just as happy to see him call it a day afterwards. I used to love Shay, so much so it's hard to believe how much I resent his presence these days. Can't see that happening with Robbie but still.
Ou-est le Centre George Pompidou?
His saddle was too low.
I hope Robbie is aware he can't take the bike on the pitch no matter how much pace he has lost.
Netherlands beat Austria 2-0. Despite a rubbish campaign, they're no mugs.
I agree with ye on both counts. But I can't see Robbie doing a Shay.
For starters he isn't lying about an injury.
Secondly it is very clear from the latter half of the qualifying campaign especially that his role is now a marginal and he knows this. So I can't imagine he has any notions of himself starting come September.
But yeah, Shay, feck off!
DID YOU NOTICE A SIGN OUTSIDE MY HOUSE...?
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