Our Grealish and Robbie tête-à-têtes to date will have been nothing compared to the hellfire and brimstone that shall rain down upon TOWK this instant!Originally Posted by Charlie Darwin
The Good Friday Agreement has nout to do with it. Here's a short bit I once wrote on the (non-)relationship of the Good Friday Agreement to the player eligibility issue:
Anyway, that's besides the main point. Who are you to tell someone of Irish heritage that they have no right to discover, acknowledge and realise the Irish aspect of their identity, even if they have primarily identified as English or whatever for much of their early life? As gastric said, there's no age limit by which one must decide their identity. Identity can be a very fluid and organic matter in an increasingly international/globalised world. Representing Ireland in football certainly can be a way for elsewhere-born players of Irish heritage to express and further explore their roots, just like it can be a way for the northern Irish nationals you mention to express the solitary national identity they've proudly held their whole lives. The former is how it was for the likes of Andy Townsend and John Aldridge. Ireland became their country too. It's only fitting that the national team features representation from the diaspora given our national history of emigration.Contrary to popular misconception, the Good Friday Agreement of 1998 has nothing to do with the application of FIFA’s statutes on Irish nationality. The Good Friday Agreement was a constitutional document agreed between the British and Irish governments after backing from the majority of the electorate in Northern Ireland that, amongst numerous other things, acknowledged and bilaterally endorsed, as an undisputed right of law, the will of members of Northern Ireland’s nationalist community to identify as Irish. It is frustrating to see it continually bandied about in discussions surrounding player eligibility, however, especially when the eligibility of Northern Ireland-born Irish nationals to play for the Republic of Ireland is being attributed to its terms. It is mentioned here in order to discount this misguided belief.
Players born in Northern Ireland have been lining out for FAI teams under FIFA rules identical in effect to those in place today before the Good Friday Agreement. Ger Crossley, Gerard Doherty, Mark McKeever and Tony Shields, for example, were all born in Northern Ireland and, qualifying via their birthright to Irish nationality, played for FAI teams between 1995 and 1998. Crossley was even selected in a senior squad by then-manager Mick McCarthy for a friendly game against Mexico in 1998, although he did not actually play. It would have been difficult for the FAI to turn such players away given they were Irish nationals, after all. Countless others have played for Irish teams between the signing of the Good Friday Agreement and the saga involving Darron Gibson that seemed to implant the issue of player eligibility in the minds of Northern Ireland football supporters.
By virtue of articles 2 and 3 of Bunreacht na hÉireann and sections 6 and 7 of the Irish Nationality and Citizenship Act 1956, Irish nationality has been available from birth to those born in Northern Ireland who have wished to have it recognised long before 1998; what the Good Friday Agreement did was provide a confirmation of the now-undisputed nature of this with bilateral endorsement, and whilst this might have changed mindsets and cleared up any misgivings in what might have previously been an area of diplomatic dispute, it had no effect on the application of FIFA regulations governing Irish nationality. The fact that Northern Ireland-born players represented FAI teams in the mid-1990s, years before the Good Friday Agreement’s signing, should demonstrate this.
Arguably, had the Good Friday Agreement not been signed and a perception of Ireland’s extra-territorial nationality law as irredentist remained within the psyche of the unionist community in Northern Ireland, it might have posed a greater dilemma for a FIFA unwilling to involve itself in an argument of such an overt political nature over conflicting constitutional arrangements between two states, although they certainly gave no indication of this at the FIFA Players’ Status Committee held in Zurich in 1994 when they affirmed that they “cannot interfere with the decisions taken by any country in the question of granting passports”. If anything, what the Good Friday Agreement did was expunge any possible ambiguity as to the effect of Irish nationality law in Northern Ireland along with the validity of any potential complaint about it from the IFA, but that is all it might have done in relation to this matter.
I'm not sure why you're picking on Cox and Pilkington in particular either. I've never really looked into Green's back-story, but Cox is very proud of his Galway roots and has always been delighted to advertise that fact. Being dubbed a "plastic Paddy" hurts him. Pilkington played for us at under-age level and had his under-21 international jersey framed and stuck on a wall in his house. (There was a photo floating around somewhere.) He accepted our call as soon as he was fit to do so. Who are you to dispute all this and tell another individual how they "really" feel?
He supports Ireland and has been pretty clear that he's playing for NI mainly because he has a career to think about. I thought you had no time for such mercenaries...I feel Niall McGinn is perfectly entitled to represent the country he was born and bred in. He would have been equally entitled to represent the Republic too.
Without wanting to sound like De Valera, for most people who consider themselves lucky enough, familial bond and influence in our society remains generally strong between grandparent and grandchild; I don't see any reason to curtail the existing eligibility principle by a generation if the reality is that many people still generally cherish a familial connection that goes one level beyond their parents. Your proposal would rule the likes of McGeady and McCarthy out. And, our future goalie, Stutts' wee lad!Ideally, it would be changed to parentage rather than grandparentage; or alternatively players should come up through youth teams. If we became a worse team for it, I could accept that - I doubt we would.
Ideally, more of our players would be home-grown and we'd have a steady stream of them, but that's another issue entirely.
Thank God!I don't make the rules.
That's a different argument relating to their ability. It has no relevance to their nationality, whether you think it's real, perceived, imagined, manufactured or whatever.I think it's ridiculous that players like Cox and Green get called up though. They are not good enough.
That's a selection/management issue. Such elsewhere-born players you mention though often make up squad numbers; they very rarely just waltz in and boot Ireland-born lads out of the squad for them never to be seen again. It's not as if "granny-rulers" are as numerous nowadays as they were during Jack's era either. The cream rises to the top and players are selected on merit if good enough. Promising Ireland-born players get their chance to shine too. Greater competition should be extra incentive to try harder; not an excuse to complain about never getting a chance.I would prefer the message it would send out if every U-19 and every U-21 player believed they had a genuine chance of making a senior breakthrough and their path to the senior team would not be restricted by people in their mid to late twenties who have given up on playing for England.
Last edited by DannyInvincible; 05/08/2014 at 12:45 PM. Reason: Typos.
A contentious ranking of Ireland's top defenders ever. Finnan, Carr, Kelly anyone? This could generate a bit of debate!
http://www.punditarena.com/football/...ard-dunne-rank
http://www.eveningecho.ie/2014/08/05/brianlinehan/
Firm bid turned down by Cork for Lenihan. Rumours that it's Hull.
It was Hull, supposedly a derisory bid in five figures. He's agreed personal terms with them so just remains for clubs to work out a fee, but I have a bad feeling it won't be very high.
http://youtu.be/YI3NoBeNwfk
Last edited by Stuttgart88; 05/08/2014 at 3:44 PM.
Cian Bolger to Southend on a two year contract: http://www.southendunited.co.uk/news...d-1806241.aspx
I was always a bit surprised by the way Bolton picked him up after he left Leicester, but to fair it seems they made a bit of money off it.
Cracking quote from Phil Brown here: “For the chairman to spend an undisclosed fee on a player who first appeared on the market two weeks ago for loan is a real statement of intent."
Can only assume he said the actual amount and the club edited it out, but still.
Bradley Garmston scored for WBA today in a 3-2 loss to Port Vale.
A report here on Walsall versus Villa. The MOTM mentioned here is Liam Kinsella, son of Mark. Has he played for us and is he any good?
http://www.bescotbanter.net/2014/08/...tball+Club.%29
I don't think he's actually played for us as he isn't at one of the big clubs, but he's only 18 so he has a lot of developing to do. He signed pro terms with Walsall a few months back.
http://www.expressandstar.com/sport/...at-walsall-fc/
As ever, TOWK was on top of it from the start: http://foot.ie/threads/188420-Liam-Kinsella
Cillian Sheridan scored for APOEL tonight as they beat HJK Helsinki to go through. Sheridan is the only Irish player left in this season's champions league after Anthony Stokes' Celtic were knocked out tonight.
Two Irish players on this 'five to watch' in League One.
http://shoot.co.uk/league-1-five-to-watch/
And in the Independent they identify Randolph and McGoldrick as Brimingham and Ipswich's key players for the Champipnship season about to begin. They say McGoldrick has genuine class.
I hope their judgment is right in both cases.
http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/f...5-9655420.html
Graham Carey signs a one year contract at Ross County: http://www.bbc.com/sport/0/football/28712615
Neither Patrick Cregg nor Gary Deegan are going to be offered a contract at Southend: http://www.echo-news.co.uk/sport/blu...nings/?ref=rss
Ex Hull City striker Craig Fagan is also still training with the club but trialists Ben Richards-Everton, Patrick Cregg, Gary Deegan, Ross Jenkins and Jordan Chiezodie will not be offered deals.
I cannot say that I do not disagree with you.
This weekend is always fun with the championship and League 1 and 2 starting might throw up few exciting future internationals. Here r a few I hope make an impression from today
Strikers- wilkinson at bolton and o brien at millwall hopefully will be involved from the start of the season.we r light on up and coming strikers
Gleeson and Oreilly at birmiongham can they be realistic future international midfielders?
Will Corry nail down a spot at sheff wed to show off his ball playing talents?
Will mcfadden get chance at norwich
Massive season for keepers like henderson at charlton, murphy huddersfield and westwood. If they all are first choice they can really push squad place with randolp and forde at same level
Can O Brien get a chance at Derby at last
Can McLaughlin b a starter for forest and will doherty nail a wolves spot
In league 1 some exciting midfielders. Can Henderson at cawley, damio at sheff utd, browne preston, hourihane barnsley, carruthers develop to the next level?
Will mcevoy do a grealish at peterborough?
Can williams and cunningham at bristol city show signs ofbeen future internationals?
League 2 can Clifford nail down a spot and develop at that level like hourihane did?
3 years ago brady went from been a player who played a bit for utds reserves and was not setting the world on fire and took the leap to derby. It worked out great for him. id love to see the likes of o hanlon or byrne at city take a chance to go on lone instead of hanging around to play in that under 19 champions league thing.
Paul Corry out in the cold again today. Not even in the matchday squad.
Pity. Murphy mayfind himself moving up to no 1 at huddersfield after few mistakes by their keeper today.
McGoldrick scores for Ipswich and Mick's happy with his performance. I think he could be a real asset for us. Murphy scored the opener in a 2-1 win over Fulham.
http://www.football365.com/fulham/9414906/-
Stephen McLaughlin came off the bench for Forest against Blackpool while Reid hit the post. Charles Dunne was on the bench for Blackpool who could only name four players for the bench! Not good.
http://www.sportinglife.com/football...st-v-blackpool
In other news, Liam Kinsella was on the bench for Walsall and Conor Henderson's corner lead to Crawley's goal.
Last edited by gastric; 10/08/2014 at 9:17 AM.
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