League of Ireland in Europe 2014

**Charlie Darwin** · 07/08/2014, 8:32 PM

Originally Posted by DannyInvincible

Certainly a big if. I don't see Legia being booted out based on the Debrecen case from 2010. Debrecen were 4-1 up when they fielded Peter Mate for the final three minutes of stoppage time in a tie against Litex Lovech. UEFA ruled that Debrecen had "no interest in fielding this player for the three last minutes of additional time, when the score was so clearly in its favour" and fined them �15,000 rather than disqualifying them. With Legia already 6-1 up, I don't see UEFA going against a precedent like that.

If Celtic can argue that the precedent goes against the letter of the law, they could have a case. The law book seems clear - a 3-0 walkover for Celtic.

**pineapple stu** · 07/08/2014, 8:36 PM

Hull have scraped by Trencin of Slovakia, 2-1 on aggregate. They were losing on away goals till the 80th minute tonight. Trencin only made their European debut last year. Puts the English league in a bit of context; the smaller English clubs to qualify have tended to struggle. Millwall, Wigan, Birmingham, Portsmouth - none have gotten out of the group stage.

**Charlie Darwin** · 07/08/2014, 8:37 PM

Good effort from Aberdeen. Were leading 2-1 on the night against Sociedad but needed two more and eventually conceded two late goals. Niall McGinn, Willo Flood and Johnny Hayes all started, and Adam Rooney was a second-half substitute.

**red bellied** · 07/08/2014, 8:47 PM

Greek side Asteras Tripoli knocked out FSV Mainz 05 beating them three one on the night. Watched the last few minutes on satellite, the camera had close ups of the visiting fans from Mainz in the last few minutes, they looked fairly desperate and a lot of them were close to tears. The Asteras players celebrated at the end like they won the world cup while three or four of the Mainz players went down to behind the goal to explain their selves to the fans and were met by plenty of abuse. Linfield knocked out a Greek side last year so maybe some sort of comparison there.

**DannyInvincible** · 07/08/2014, 9:10 PM

Originally Posted by Charlie Darwin

If Celtic can argue that the precedent goes against the letter of the law, they could have a case. The law book seems clear - a 3-0 walkover for Celtic.

How often does stuff like this happen in European competition? Seems incredible to think that such embarrassing amateurism can still occur in the modern age of information. Even Arsenal brought Ryo Miyaichi to Munich in the Champions League last year and had to name a reduced bench of six players after realising before kick-off that he wasn't actually eligible to play in the competition. It's also extraordinary that this could potentially be the second time in three or four years that Celtic might benefit from such a c*ck-up.

Does the rule-book say Celtic should be awarded the match 3-0 or the overall tie? Either way, they'd still go through. If awarded just the match 3-0, that would bring the aggregate score back to 4-4 and, of course, they'd have the away goal from Warsaw.

**DannyInvincible** · 07/08/2014, 9:46 PM

Grant Russell on Twitter saying that the Debrecen "precedent" wouldn't actually apply as Peter Mate was ineligible rather than suspended on that occasion: https://twitter.com/STVGrant/status/497462955366436864

Originally Posted by Grant Russell

Many citing example of Debrecen fined for ineligible player. Rule differs. That player wasn't banned. If a player plays banned = forfeit.

Looks like Legia might be in very big trouble then, after all.

It does seem unusual that the punishment for fielding an ineligible player would differ so much from the punishment for fielding a suspended player. Weren't Sion kicked out in 2011 for fielding ineligible players though?

**Charlie Darwin** · 07/08/2014, 9:53 PM

Originally Posted by DannyInvincible

How often does stuff like this happen in European competition? Seems incredible to think that such embarrassing amateurism can still occur in the modern age of information. Even Arsenal brought Ryo Miyaichi to Munich in the Champions League last year and had to name a reduced bench of six players after realising before kick-off that he wasn't actually eligible to play in the competition. It's also extraordinary that this could potentially be the second time in three or four years that Celtic might benefit from such a c*ck-up.

Does the rule-book say Celtic should be awarded the match 3-0 or the overall tie? Either way, they'd still go through. If awarded just the match 3-0, that would bring the aggregate score back to 4-4 and, of course, they'd have the away goal from Warsaw.

A match may be declared forfeit if a player who is ineligible under the regulations
of the competition concerned participates in the match, as long as the opposing
team files a protest. 4 The consequences of a match being declared forfeit are as follows:
a) the team forfeiting the match is deemed to have lost 3-0 (5-0 in futsal
competitions), unless the actual result is less favourable to the member
association or club at fault, in which case that result stands;

http://www.uefa.org/MultimediaFiles/...9_DOWNLOAD.pdf

**DannyInvincible** · 07/08/2014, 9:56 PM

Have you read the relevant regulations in the rule-book, Charlie? Are they somewhere in here?: http://www.uefa.com/MultimediaFiles/...9_DOWNLOAD.pdf

Or can you point me to where I can have a look?

Edit: Ha, cheers! I was having a look there as I was posting and hadn't seen your post until I re-loaded the thread.

**DannyInvincible** · 07/08/2014, 10:08 PM

Originally Posted by Charlie Darwin

A match may be declared forfeit if a player who is ineligible under the regulations
of the competition concerned participates in the match, as long as the opposing
team files a protest. 4 The consequences of a match being declared forfeit are as follows:
a) the team forfeiting the match is deemed to have lost 3-0 (5-0 in futsal
competitions), unless the actual result is less favourable to the member
association or club at fault, in which case that result stands;

http://www.uefa.org/MultimediaFiles/...9_DOWNLOAD.pdf

Article 21.3, which you've quoted, refers to fielding an ineligible player and states the game may be declared forfeit. The much less ambiguous Article 21.2 will apply in the Legia-Celtic case as Bereszyńsk was suspended rather than ineligible:

Originally Posted by UEFA

A match is declared forfeit if a player who has been suspended following a disciplinary decision participates in the match.

**PartySaint** · 07/08/2014, 10:11 PM

If UEFA were fair they'd kick Legia out of Europe, deduct Dundalk 10 points and relegate Shels to the LSL

**Charlie Darwin** · 07/08/2014, 10:13 PM

Originally Posted by DannyInvincible

Article 21.3, which you've quoted, refers to fielding an ineligible player and states the game may be declared forfeit. The much less ambiguous Article 21.2 will apply in the Legia-Celtic case as Bereszyńsk was suspended rather than ineligible:

Sorry, I thought I'd quoted that!

**jinxy lilywhite** · 07/08/2014, 10:19 PM

Originally Posted by PartySaint

If UEFA were fair they'd kick Legia out of Europe, deduct Dundalk 10 points and relegate Shels to the LSL

WTF did we do

. Would love pats to play an extra two European matches in the business end of the season

PS love the bitchy fight back from Celtic heads. They may beat a lot club 99 times out of a hundred but one chance is all you need.

**Charlie Darwin** · 07/08/2014, 10:28 PM

Originally Posted by jinxy lilywhite

PS love the bitchy fight back from Celtic heads. They may beat a lot club 99 times out of a hundred but one chance is all you need.

Or in Pats' case, Celtic would beat them 50 times out of 100.

**ger121** · 07/08/2014, 11:11 PM

Sion in 2011 and now Legia in 2014. Celtic really do lead a charmed life. Why does this stuff never happen to our clubs!

**DannyInvincible** · 07/08/2014, 11:39 PM

Originally Posted by ger121

Sion in 2011 and now Legia in 2014. Celtic really do lead a charmed life.

It's the luck of the Irish, innit...

**osarusan** · 08/08/2014, 2:32 AM

It seems that the player in question missed an earlier qualifying round, and then first leg of the Celtic tie, making three games.

But according to another forum, it's not just a matter of missing three games - they player has to be registered for the game/tournament in order for the missed games to count as a ban being served. I have no idea how accurate that is though.

EDIT: UEFA report seems to verify it.

http://www.uefa.org/disciplinary/new...d=1845491.html

**pineapple stu** · 08/08/2014, 6:25 AM

Exactly why Brian Mooney couldn't play for us against Velbazhd Kyustendil in 2000. Bohs made that same mistake and forgot to register him while suspended. We spotted the problem; no sympathy for Legia.