O'Shea and Miller start in midfield tonight

**Superhoops** · 20/10/2004, 1:35 PM

Originally Posted by drummerboy

How old do you reckon Paul McGrath was when he made his ROI debut? As far as I can remember he was about 25-26.

He was 25 when he got his first cap in 1985, having joined MU in 1983?.

McGrath's route into top flight football was completely different from O'Shea's. If O'Shea turn out to be even half as good as McGrath he will be a big success.

**Donal81** · 20/10/2004, 6:05 PM

[QUOTE=Superhoops]He is 23 and will be 24 when this season over. Not sure how much time you envisage he needs but most 'special' players have made their mark by this age...In these two years we have seen several players progress and blossom into half decent players, Andy O'Brien and Andy Reid for starters, yet O'Shea appears to have gone backwards. The big question is why? Is he not good enough? Is his role at MU stiffling his development? Hence the reason for the debate and not for having a pop at him. QUOTE]

Jesus, 23 years of age. Players tend to reach their peak several years after an explosive but unsustainable start to their careers. Keano became a true legend of football in the 1999-2002 seasons, leading up to the Saipan world cup. He'd been with Man U for over 5 years at this point and was certainly a lot older than 23. While O'Shea is obviously not of Keane's calibre, he's still learning and, I believe, will become a better player in time, I don't think he's levelled off at Man Utd. Andy O'Brien and Andy Reid have shown real potential but who is still playing for what was up until very, very recently one of the strongest teams in the world? I'm not saying he's brilliant or a future leader of Man U or Ireland but he's a good player who still has bags of potential, which is important to remember.

**eirebhoy** · 20/10/2004, 6:43 PM

I didn't want to open a new thread for this but is anyone watching the Chelsea match on Sky? I just found out that RTE are showing highlights of the Arsenal match so I won't get to see how Duff does. I'll be watching Celtic, if anyone's watching Chelsea let us know how Duffer does. I hate not getting to see him play, surely more people would want to see Duffer than Arsenal.

Cheers.

**thejollyrodger** · 20/10/2004, 6:48 PM

Im watching the Celtic match too. Terrible shame that they arent showing the Chelsea match. Another shame is why dont they show the best match on tonight - Barca Vs Milan !!!

**eirebhoy** · 20/10/2004, 7:50 PM

Duff set up the second goal from a free kick.

Duff can feck off for the moment though, Come on Celtic!!!

**zinedineontour** · 21/10/2004, 7:37 AM

Originally Posted by eirebhoy

Duff set up the second goal from a free kick.

Duff can feck off for the moment though, Come on Celtic!!!

How the duffer is doing is a lot more important than a second rate scottish side

**Peadar** · 21/10/2004, 7:53 AM

Originally Posted by eirebhoy

Come on Celtic!!!

The most consistant team in the Champions League.
Conceded 3 in every game so far.

**Stuttgart88** · 21/10/2004, 8:31 AM

I was at the Chelsea match last night. Duff was OK, but not one of his better games. He protects the ball well and got bundled over for free kicks a few times as a result. Sometimes a bit leniently.

He was subbed after about 75 mins though the game was pretty much won by then. He put in a great ball for Gudjohnson's goal. He had a great opportunity to shoot in the first half but opted to take the ball on a bit further instead.

The pattern of the game was interesting. Chelsea went ahead without even trying, an easy goal from a corner. They then had a few chances but Moscow gradually took a grip on the game. Like the English national side Chelsea conceded possession easily & could only put 3 passes together without running out of options. The Russians could keep the ball forever but couldn't get past a very good defence. When they did the Chelsea 'keeper saved everything. He looks a real class act, as does John Terry. Bridge (the answer to England's left sided problem!) was rubbish.

Other than their defence Chelsea didn't really impress me. Kezman was a disaster.

Did McGeady feature at all last night?

**inexile** · 21/10/2004, 8:41 AM

mcgeady came on as a sub last night didnt see how he did but it was 2-0 at that stage good to see him getting a run out

**Colm55** · 21/10/2004, 8:46 AM

Originally Posted by Stuttgart88

Did McGeady feature at all last night?

He did indeed, came on in place of Juniniho in about the 70th minute, not long enough to make much of an impression seeing as celtic were down and out at that stage, but i thought he had a few good touches, looked confident on the ball and has plenty of potential which can only develop given his tender age of 18. I was recently informed by some celtic fans who are actually scottish that the general concensus is that he is the next big thing at celtic!

**eirebhoy** · 21/10/2004, 9:36 AM

Originally Posted by zinedineontour

How the duffer is doing is a lot more important than a second rate scottish side

I support Ireland about 10 times more than I do Celtic but you are crazy if you think the performance of one Irish player is more important than watching your team in the CL.

BTW, Celtic are a top rate Scottish team, second rate European team.

Thats enough on Celtic for a while though.

**Peadar** · 21/10/2004, 10:20 AM

Originally Posted by Colm55

I was recently informed by some celtic fans who are actually scottish that the general concensus is that he is the next big thing at celtic!

That's Hartson off his pedestal then!

**fergalr** · 21/10/2004, 12:42 PM

Originally Posted by Stuttgart88

I was at the Chelsea match last night. Duff was OK, but not one of his better games. He protects the ball well and got bundled over for free kicks a few times as a result. Sometimes a bit leniently.

He was subbed after about 75 mins though the game was pretty much won by then. He put in a great ball for Gudjohnson's goal. He had a great opportunity to shoot in the first half but opted to take the ball on a bit further instead.

The pattern of the game was interesting. Chelsea went ahead without even trying, an easy goal from a corner. They then had a few chances but Moscow gradually took a grip on the game. Like the English national side Chelsea conceded possession easily & could only put 3 passes together without running out of options. The Russians could keep the ball forever but couldn't get past a very good defence. When they did the Chelsea 'keeper saved everything. He looks a real class act, as does John Terry. Bridge (the answer to England's left sided problem!) was rubbish.

Other than their defence Chelsea didn't really impress me. Kezman was a disaster.

I was over at the game as well and agree totally with all of the above. Have to add that Duffer worked very hard tracking back all night - his opposite number was a handful. As noted, he wasted one great opportunity to shoot - if he has one weakness its his lack of goals.

**Peadar** · 21/10/2004, 12:45 PM

Originally Posted by fergalr

if he has one weakness its his lack of goals.

Isn't that part of the requisite criteria to be a Chelsea player this season?

**eirebhoy** · 21/10/2004, 12:54 PM

Originally Posted by fergalr

I was over at the game as well and agree totally with all of the above. Have to add that Duffer worked very hard tracking back all night - his opposite number was a handful. As noted, he wasted one great opportunity to shoot - if he has one weakness its his lack of goals.

He scored 6 last season. He's just not suited to the way Mourinho is playing him IMO. I remember saying last season that Duff is one of the most consistent player in world football, I wouldn't say that now.