Originally Posted by dynamo kerry
paul butler, holland, macken, stpehen reid,morrison, (the mighty)mickey evans,lee carsley, mcateer,aldridge,townsend,lawrensen are examples of non-irish players playing for ireland. and while i do agree taht it the bulk of our squad has been "irish" lately, it was stioll great to see the first 11 being free of plastic paddys
the only reason fifa changed this rule was to avoid a legal battle with tim cahill beacuse he had played for western samoa under 15s or something like that.
and of course mcgrath adn o`leary are irish just like kilbane, connolly etc
and as for zak knight......don`t get me started
I think you've misinterpreted what he meant. A team of Irish born players and foreign born players who have grown up as Irish (e.g. Kilbane) as opposed to the likes of Morrison, Macken and this Knight guy whoever he is.
We're not arrogant, we're just better.
It does sound a bit like it, doesn't it? And we're not exactly short of defenders right now, either.
What kind of name is 'Zat', anyway?
If he does get in, then I'll certainly hoot and holler if he hoofs the ball away from our net, sure. But I'd prefer to see players, wherever they were born, playing in green because they're proud to wear the green, not because they didn't get into their first choice and it's us or nothing.
Tea. Corduroy. Space Travel.
mckey evans? lee carsely? never been regulars.
alrdridge, townesend, houghton? 6 years gone lad.
lawrenson? butler? scraping the barrel a little bit.
as for stephen reid I believe him to be every bit as irish as andy o'brien.
there have been several instances when it was an all-irish 'born' team. I stopped paying attention myself years ago. you're point is baseless and plucking at straws. if you mean lately as 'last 15 years" then maybe. If you're younger than 35 though you're talking sh!te.
paul butler? ffs
I can't think of a situation comparable to the Irish one in world football although there must be an example somewhere. Ireland's history of emigration led to entire communities all over England growing with a strong sense of Irishness, a sense that was heightened by the fact that they were abroad. At one point, there were over one million Irish-born people in England. I'm not aware of the figures now but it's a huge group. My point is that it's completely understandable for someone to grow up with a strong sense of Irishness although their place of birth, childhood and adulthood is England. I will always welcome someone like Kevin Kilbane - actual footy discussions aside - into an Irish team because he has always wanted to play for us and grew up believing that a part of him was Irish. Mick McCarthy, Shay Brennan and Gary Breen are other examples of this. If someone wants to play for Ireland simply because they're not good enough for England and see us as a last resort and some international status, they can get f*cked, to be quite honest, it degrades the notion of playing for your country.
That said, Irish football history is full of players who may never have felt Irish and jumped at the chance of a bit of international glory. For example, Tony Cascarino, Jason MacAteer, John Aldridge. But who would deny that these players gave their all for the cause of Irish international football? Some of these players may have been ropey with distant Irish connections - Cascarino had none - but they certainly contributed in some way. It depends on the character of the player and this guy sounds like a tosser.
this argument has been done to death before.
there are two main considerations.
1) the recent Irish team has been predominatly irish born or closely connected to ireland for the last 10 or so years with 3 or at the outside 4 exceptions (morrison, carsley and holland being the stand outs as people who played regularly but had no real irish connection prior to declaring)
2) the recent rule change has flushed a few punters out - macken, whelan and now knight. if it hadnt been for this rule change I believe we would never have heard about any of these players and the days of the granny rule would have faded to obsolesence. I reckon these are the last lads who will declare so late into their 20's.
these lads should get as much of a benefit of the doubt as holland et al. if they're good enough and take it seriously a la morrison has then I won't have a problem.
knight maybe could have been a bit more diplomatic(ie lied) and been nicer about it. he could have mentioned a granny in westmeath he's always wanted to make happy by playing for ireland. hokey but nice.
as it is he'll do well to get a game .
Zat Knight declares Irish intentions
October 18, 2004
Fulham’s beanpole central defender Zat Knight has declared his intention to follow up on the possibility of changing his international allegiance and declaring for Brian Kerr’s Republic of Ireland.
Standing at 6’6”, Knight is one of the tallest outfield players in the Premiership, and has become a regular in Fulham’s side over the past two seasons.
He has already represented England competitively at under-21 level in the past, but under the once-off Uefa rule that has already seen Manchester City’s Jonathan Macken change sides, the 24-year-old has hinted that he will investigate the possibility of declaring for Ireland.
But there is little of real Irish affiliation in the comments of the big defender, whose intention to follow up his green roots is founded in his inability to break into the England set-up.
“Maybe I should be looking at different avenues, what with the World Cup coming up in two years’ time,” said Knight after the Cottagers’ 4-2 weekend defeat to Liverpool. “I’m aware that I can still play for the Republic of Ireland and that is something that I have been seriously considering. I am at an age where I am playing regularly in the Premiership, one of the best leagues in the world.
“I don’t say that I have been overlooked by England, but if I can look down another road and try to get into their team, then maybe I should. As far as England is concerned, I know it’s going to be hard for me to break into the side.”
Taken from Eleven-a-side. What do think of this one lads, personnally I'm not in favour of it buts its such a grey area its hard to know who should play and should be told to f off and its just their tough sh*t their not good enough to play for their own country.
A man is never really poor,
if he can still laugh.
was over in london last year and took in a game over there
fulham vs birmingham
knight was one of the players at that game that really impressed me and lets face it,cunningham wont be around forever
.
Lads, Andy O'Brien played for England U21s, there was even a picture of him playing in the England jersey against France in the star last week. Clinton Morrison also declared his wish to play for England before choosing us sometime later. Tony Cascarino didn't even have a real link to this country. Look at the Charlton era.....Nobody is complaing about these guys now are they? You certainly can't question their committment or contribution to our cause either. If Knight declares, there'll be a few moaners, but once he starts performing it'll be all rosey in the garden again.
My attitude is i'll support anyone who dons the green and white, as long as he's as committed as the next guy. Those who are rubbing their hands at the potential of McGeady will equally have to accept someone like Knight, as there's no difference in their reasons for declaring, in my eyes.
If O'Brien is so "proper Irish", why did he play for England U21's before he played for us? You don't seem to have a problem with O'Brien, who is an England U21 international whether you like it or not. Knight is also an England U21. Personally, I don't see the difference. You can't tell me either that Clinton Morrison doesn't give his all for Ireland, and he's now very much a fan favourite. In fact he's the only player, along with Given, who has played well in all of our group games so far. If Knight declares, and is as committed as O'Brien and Morrison, then I don't see what the problem is. Himself and Dunne would be good back up to KC and AOB. Forget about Breen, Doherty and O'Shea as centre-halfs, unless you want to be watching Germany 2006 on the telly.i`m not a fan of picking these kind of players for our national teamwhat kind of message does it sound out to other players in the squad(r dunne etc.)and young players if we go and pick english players like this that have no idea of what that jersey means
btw, on a related topic - something that made me smile last wednesday against the faroes
i wonder when was the last time this happened
well thats because soccer in Ireland wasnt very well developed. This fella Zak is behind a right few defenders in the list so I wouldnt bother calling him up. I would like as much an Irish team as possible. No offense to any english people.
The difference for me is that the likes of Mc Geady looks like he has potential, Zak doesnt.
O'Brien said he only played for England because it was the more fasionable thing to do. He rejected the next callup he received by England. I doubt he did it just for football reasons as he was only 19 at the time and was really highly rated playing regular football.
You are way off the point. Knight wants to play for Ireland because he has admitted he is not good enough for England. Therefore, he thinks he is good enough to throw his lot in with the Oiwish. On the other hand, Aiden McGeady is more than good enough for Scotland but has chosen Ireland. Ireland have always been his first choice. There is a big difference between Knight and McGeady.
"Love many, trust few, always paddle your own canoe." Dillo
THREADS MERGED.
Éanna
Jesus, that was a hard decision!
Give Josh a break. He missed out on Japan WC because of that idiot Mc Carthy and its stunted his football development ! He was in good form then. Give Josh another year or 18 months and then make a decison about him. I would rather Josh at left back than this "Zak" fella. Such a name
He said no to Ireland once at U21 level he won't be asked again. I don't think Kerr would pick someone who refused a call-up - so you can forget Knight, Best, Nolan. That is how it should be.
Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.
Nationalism is an infantile disease, the measles of mankind
If he want's to go down other road's and look at other avenue's, then maybe he should take Charing Cross road instead of Oxford Street to get to Soho Square. FCUK HIM, as has been said he's not the first person to have a tan u21 cap or distant Irish link's take an interest in declaring for Ireland, but at least all the other's showed a bit of respect and talked about their Granny in Kildare or Athlone, or their grandfather in Limerick or Monaghan, where as this p***k's just said that he's not getting no joy from the Scum so we'll do as an alternative.
He should F**k off back to the tan's and ask them for a game the p***k.
PS, who is he anyway.
Its crazy to see people be what society wants them to be but not me.
Knight name was touted about about 3 years ago, but he decided to play for England. Personally I don't think we need him. Dunne is playing the best football of his career and has started to mature. He was interviewed on the BBC on Saturday and admitted he had things too easy: a regular for Everton at 17, regular for Ireland at 22-3. Hopefully he keeps improving.
Always look on the bright side of life
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