Intertoto or bust?

Originally Posted by Éanna

just going back over a few points raised.
1. Shels managed it because the Champions League game are midweek, so they didn't have to cancel any league games, we did- leading to fixture problems etc, which I do believe has messed our season up.
2. The financial benefits of entering the intertoto as opposed to winning the league and being in the champions league the following season? Doubtful I'd say.
3. It has damaged our season, did the same to rovers last year and to pats before that- 3 consecutive years is enough to make ya think.

All those point have been made by dodgy jounalists. The last point is an old hang-up that simply isn't true, IF City intend to be a professional club as Eoinh said. I think we should get over it to be honest.

Why should we accept a competition thats regarded as second best?

How can any eircom League club regard this as second best ??

Remember .. it is the eircom League now, a league that has been on its knees for years. Not worth talkng about ..... now it is turning a very slight corner and we want to give up on a European competition. I wouldn't if it were a forgone conclusion and eL teams stonked it home every year and now we are not bothered.

While there are better teams in that comp. then it is in our interest to play in it.

Originally Posted by Colm

Well obviously we'd all prefer to be playing in the Champions league or the UEFA cup but in the event that we don't qualify for either then the Inter-toto is a far far better prospect than not playing in Europe at all.

i think not playing in europe is a far better prospect than playing in the Intertoto- just a matter of opinion i guess.

Originally Posted by A face

All those point have been made by dodgy jounalists. The last point is an old hang-up that simply isn't true, IF City intend to be a professional club as Eoinh said. I think we should get over it to be honest.

3 years in a row isn't an untrue hang-up, its evidence.

the club needs europe and will only gain more experience playing in the intertoto than not playing in it at all

Originally Posted by Éanna

3 years in a row isn't an untrue hang-up, its evidence.

Pats and Rovers are and were both sh!t and didn't and still don't have the resources to cope with the demands of such a hectic schedule.
They would both have struggled in the league regardless of them being in Europe.

We have the resources to cope and if you really look at it closely the inter toto did not effect our league form greatly. Apart from the loss to Bohs in between the 2 Malmo games I don't think it effect any of our games. Can you think of another league game (don't mind the cup) that we lost because we were playing in Europe?

The European hangover is a myth.
Anyone who seriously think that we should not play in a European competition is seriously lacking ambition. Could you imagine trying to entice a player to sign for the club and saying "we won't be able to offer you the chance to play Euro football because even though we qualified for the inter-toto we aren't going to bother playing in it".... they'd run a mile!

Originally Posted by Colm

Pats and Rovers are and were both sh!t and didn't and still don't have the resources to cope with the demands of such a hectic schedule.
They would both have struggled in the league regardless of them being in Europe.

Whatever about Shams, but that SPA team were the same team who had won the league the previous season (Marney and Livingston affairs to one side), and managed by Pat Dolan. A league winning team doesnt go to crap in one season, if it didnt have some distractions.

Originally Posted by Colm

Can you think of another league game (don't mind the cup) that we lost because we were playing in Europe?

Ya, coz we would hate to win the cup



Anyways, the point is fairly moot, as even if we do qualify this season, it will be the last Inter Toto ever.

Originally Posted by GWA

Ya, coz we would hate to win the cup

I know I'll probably get slated for this but I think the cup has been majorly devalued in recent times. It seems that only the small nothing clubs care enough or try hard enough to actually win it.
I mean look at the last three finals.....
Waterford v Longford..... two small clubs with poor teams and poor support.
Longford v Pats..... see above
Derry v Rovers..... two clubs with the potential to be big but are not up to much at the moment.

Obviously I'd like to win the cup but it wouldn't compare to winning the league. Would anyone have swapped this years Euro run for a cup run? I doubt it, I mean going to Sweden, Holland and France and playing good teams in excellent stadia is a lot more valuable to the players, fans and clubs finances than say going to Athlone or Monaghan or Belfield and playing in front of 400 people thus depressing the fans and demoralising the players.
Doing well in the league and having a good Euro run should be our priority every season imo, a cup run is nice but not as important.

Originally Posted by Colm

I know I'll probably get slated for this but I think the cup has been majorly devalued in recent times.

Ild agree with that. Thats not just true of Ireland but of all European leagues, i feel.

It may be de-valued, but surely we should be vying to win the thing every time. Its not like we are accustomed to cup success. We can de-value it all we want after we have won it a few times, until then, no.

I would easily trade our Euro run for a cup final date vs Waaherfurh at the end of the month any day.

Voted,yes no doubt.The european run did effect our league form but I knew this would happen.

I loved every minute of the european run and hopefully we will repeat it next year in the uefa cup if possible,but I would never turn down th intertoto cup.

Originally Posted by Colm

Obviously I'd like to win the cup but it wouldn't compare to winning the league. Would anyone have swapped this years Euro run for a cup run? I doubt it, I mean going to Sweden, Holland and France and playing good teams in excellent stadia is a lot more valuable to the players, fans and clubs finances than say going to Athlone or Monaghan or Belfield and playing in front of 400 people thus depressing the fans and demoralising the players.
Doing well in the league and having a good Euro run should be our priority every season imo, a cup run is nice but not as important.

I certainly would have swopped the Intertoto for beating Limerick and UCD in the Cups. Had we overcome those two particular giants of European football then we could have been looking at a real shot at the league cup (with the final possibly at Turners Cross) and a decent FAI Cup run, including a number of games at Turners Cross (remember UCD drew Drumcondra in the next round). If getting through two rounds of the Intertoto is so valuable then surely a run to the FAI Cup Final would be worth much more? Doing well in the league and bringing some silverware home should be the priority every season imho. Europe is all well and good but at the end of the day the Intertoto is Mickey Mouse stuff and, to re-iterate what GWA said, I'd much rather a crack off either Waterford or Longford at the end of the month in the final. Obviously UEFA Cup and Champions League would be a different proposition.

spot on stadler. there's no point winning a few games in europe and doing nothing at home- if our domestic cup record had been as good as our european record we'd probably have a trophy to show for it at the end of the season, and I think that would count just as much for players we're trying to attract

Concentrate on the League and go for the Champion Leauge and UEFA Cup, then the exposure willl be better for the sponsors. Inter toto my arse..

I'll prob get slated for it but I'd have swapped the Euro run for success in the Cup.
Granted City got a few bob from the gates and respect for the el but come the end of the season we have f*ck all to show for it-at least ifd we won the Cup we'd have had silverware and a place in the UEFA Cup(possibly a place in the Setanta Cup as well-not too sure if cup winners qualify)

Originally Posted by Colm

I know I'll probably get slated for this but I think the cup has been majorly devalued in recent times. It seems that only the small nothing clubs care enough or try hard enough to actually win it.

Originally Posted by from btid

What a crock of **** - the FAI Cup is the premier competition in this country. The league with four rounds is ridiculous and needs a major overhaul.

2 very contrasting posts. one from a city fan on foot and 1 from a waaaaaaaaherfur fan on btid


shows who really is the biggest club in munster

Gan dabht ar bith.
Money matters, and while Lennox said it mightn't have been such a gold mine, the publicity and enthusiasm about the city probably brought a few more back-sides to the cross on a regular basis + Sold many more jerseys etc. The gist of my point being, European competition means more than prize-money and gate revenue.

The inter-toto cup was the best part of our season. Some people seem to think that if we didnt participate we would be doing better domestically. There is no evidense to support this, we played our best football in Europe and we are only disappointed with our league form now because we havent been able to replicate our European form in the league. If people are talking about a European hang-over, they should question the players and coaching staff, not the European competition.

You wanted to know why you should settle for 2nd best?

Well its fourth best really...
and im not being smart as was suggested

Cork have not been inside the top two in the league for years and to suggest that accepting the intertoto is settling for less then you are worth is rubbish.

St Pats and Rovers didnt go anywhere near europe this year and well, look at them now. I dont think your performances in europe had anything to do with your poor league form after it as someone stated already it was similar to your form before and also similar to that of the past few seasons..

I agree that expectation was raised at cork this year through new players and the big mouth of PAT but its like that at most clubs and you should not believe the hype until its reflected on the pitch..

I think Cork would be mad to refuse the Intertoto spot...

Your no lille but just look at what they are doing having come through the intertoto??? top of the french league and into the group stages of the UEFA Cup all because of the team spirit and fitness gained in the intertoto..

You make your own bed and if your league form isnt good i suggest you look elsewhere as europe is not the problem