Have you ever even been to an Ireland game? And presumably you feel the same way about LOI fans, of whom I've met many many at such games over the years...Originally Posted by Señor Willy
So you'd rather if the fans started ripping up the seats and rioting cause Ireland were losing?
That's a ridiculous excuse for a counter-point and you know it.
I hadn't realised it was an either or situation.
If you attack me with stupidity, I'll be forced to defend myself with sarcasm.
What Nah Nah's post does unintentionally acknowledge is that singing the fields of athenry when losing 4-0 is as extreme one way as ripping up seats and rioting is extreme the other way!
Senor Willy: any comment on my post #35 above wrt "best fans in the world"?
Danny, I think there's a large degree of fabrication when it comes to putting down the locak game by following the more glamorous, more popularly supported version of the game. I think people read too much into disconcern for the LOI when the world's biggest league is only a 60 minute budget flight away. We are saturated by UK TV coverage in all aspects of our life, it's hardly a crime against football to be seduced by the world's most watched league (and only 150 or so miles from home - less than the distance traveled by some teams within their own countries).
I stayed up all night watching the Obama vs. Romney presidential election, yet I'd stugggle to tell you who my local counsellor is. Am I acting to the detriment of local politics? Am I any less interested in politics? Am I generally less entitrled to a political view? I'm confused by some of the funddamentalism on show here.
I've posted my LOI and junior football "credentials" here before, although it's largely irrelevant. LOI (only) fans can have your beef, but ROI (mainly) fans are not your problem.
Do you recall Keith Andrews' comment? He said the players were hugely grateful that the fans realised that being totally put to the sword by the world's best team was not the time to turn on them, but that the players also understood that had an abject performance against a peer been delivered that dissent would have been understood. I agree with him on that.
I was at White Hart Lane when Rovers got beaten 3-1 by Spurs, and the fans showed their love for their team by singing therir hearts out. There were more Rovers fans at WHL than any time I've been to Tallaght. Funny how the fans only ever got accolades from all quarters that night.
Get the chip off your shoulder. Every - I mean every - ROI ran I know is supportive of the LOI. NONE I know looks down on it in anyway. I live in London so some may well be not very informed, but trust me, there is no prejudice wathsover and in most cases there is a degree of affectionate pride. I suppose now I'll be told that's patronising...
What chip on my shoulder? Perhaps try reading my earlier post on this thread FFS.
The singing while being destroyed is not something well ever agree on I suppose but it's totally different to being a fan of the Irish team.
Last edited by SkStu; 06/06/2013 at 11:17 PM.
I don't think anybody is criticising EPL fans for being seduced by the league. It's when those EPL fans take an interest in the national team and criticise it, despite taking no interest in the league that produces an increasing number of its players. If you're only interested in the successful league, that's absolutely fine, but you can't then turn around and criticise the national team for not being successful when you've shown a clear lack of interest in its development.
It's not really a valid comparison. Obama doesn't gain his legitimacy from Europeans showing an interest, whereas the strength of Irish football is directly affected by the amount of support given to it.I stayed up all night watching the Obama vs. Romney presidential election, yet I'd stugggle to tell you who my local counsellor is. Am I acting to the detriment of local politics? Am I any less interested in politics? Am I generally less entitrled to a political view? I'm confused by some of the funddamentalism on show here.
I'm not sure when you were last in Tallaght but any home game no matter how insignificant the opposition has more home fans than were at WHL. And that's including all the exiled fans in London.
I'm sure the ROI fans in London are more supportive of the LOI, perhaps because they live in a city where supporting a local side is the norm rather than the exception. I'm sure a lot of London-based ROI fans would think nothing of attending a game in Tallaght the way they would at Crystal Palace. But they have the tradition, Irish-based football fans generally don't have a tradition of going to football games and supporting their local side. They watch their team on TV.Get the chip off your shoulder. Every - I mean every - ROI ran I know is supportive of the LOI. NONE I know looks down on it in anyway. I live in London so some may well be not very informed, but trust me, there is no prejudice wathsover and in most cases there is a degree of affectionate pride. I suppose now I'll be told that's patronising...
I don't think there's any fabrication at all. Try walking into a pub, or a bookies, anywhere in Ireland, and talk about League of Ireland football with 10 people.
3 of those people will ask "How is the team doing? Always meant to go watch a game, but just never got around to it".
3 of them will have been to a game, but felt no connection to it and never went again, preferring to watch Man Utd v Liverpool on a Saturday in a pub.
2 of them go when the team is doing really well, but as soon as there's a few losses, are nowhere to be seen.
2 of them will never have been to a game. They will ridicule the League, your team, and everything to do with Irish football. Support Man Utd. Hate England.
There is bigotry up and down this country. It's tough being told you're an idiot for going to Longford to watch Harps beat the league leaders in a 'crap league with crap teams', when that very same person shells out 400 quid the next week to go over to England just to say a teary goodbye to a Scottish football manager in charge of an English team.
I don't think anyone is tarring all ROI fans with the same brush. I know a few ROI fans who travel to each and every home game, and have travelled away to countries I'd only ever dream of going to. I have huge respect for the real ROI fans, who put their heart and soul into supporting their country.LOI (only) fans can have your beef, but ROI (mainly) fans are not your problem.
It's the plastic paddies. The Euro 2012 glory-hunters, the herd of sheep that followed Ireland to Poland and Ukraine, who got labelled the best fans in the world, who received such high praise from the Mayor of Poznan or whatever that guy was. These same people who ONLY went because of a session. I know a few of them too, and they sure as hell knew I didn't like it too.
It p*sses me off, that these are the same people who won't travel 10 minutes up the road to watch a League of Ireland match, for absolutely no decent excuse other than 'it's crap'.
I've heard players say similar things at every level. I've always been an advocate of a big atmosphere, love big noise, big chants. But this whole 'doing the poznan' and Fields of Athenry when getting hammered was embarrassing to watch. Like for fu*k sake, Fields of Athenry is a song about depression and the famine. At least if you're trying to lift someones spirits, sing a decent, lively, song.
Get the chip off your shoulder. Every - I mean every - ROI ran I know is supportive of the LOI. NONE I know looks down on it in anyway. I live in London so some may well be not very informed, but trust me, there is no prejudice wathsover and in most cases there is a degree of affectionate pride. I suppose now I'll be told that's patronising...[/QUOTE]
Nothing patronising at all. But I would say it's naive to think that.
https://kesslereffect.bandcamp.com/album/kepler - New music. It's not that bad.
I support the team but never JD or the FAI.
Last edited by bullit; 07/06/2013 at 3:16 AM.
There are 'Plastic Paddies' living in Letterkenny? Do tell...
Old Celtic pal of mine from Ballybofey whose family are involved with Finn Harps and who's also an enthusiastic fan of them is always 'joking' he can totally understand people not going to see the LOI, an element of self-deprecation before you all get upset!
Sorry Stu, mea culpa. The last paragraph was not directed at you at all and I realise now it read badly. The last paragraph was directed at those who continue the "best fans in the world" criticism and those who, well, clearly have a chip on their shoulder!
I support Cork City and Ireland equally. 50% each. Cork City and Ireland are like 2 children to me. I cannot love 1 more than another, but when I'm at a Cork City match I love that more than Ireland and when I attend an Ireland game I love that more than Cork City. My deep sense of guilt stays with me for days after.
The problem with threads like this is they always descend into LOI fans looking down on Ireland supporters.
People should spend their leisure time as they please, be it in the Aviva, Turners X , Belfield or up on a bar-stool even! We should be looking to attract people to games not telling them where they should be spending their time.
If at a time that more and more players that came through the league are representing the state, why is it that LoI fans are (anecdotally) feeling less connected to the team? It's really a stretch to suggest the problems are, or at least only, with the LoI fans.
I know plenty of none (and even anti) LoI people that had a problem with the carry on after the Spain game in euro's. It's not even really about the singing - it's the pathetic back slapping that followed it.
Last edited by Macy; 07/06/2013 at 11:06 AM.
If you attack me with stupidity, I'll be forced to defend myself with sarcasm.
The gurning about the Spain game really gets on my nerves. Was it the fans doing the back slapping? Nope- media to blame. Same with the the whole "Best fans in the world" thing- I have yet to hear anyone at an Ireland game say such a thing, again it tends to be a media thing.
One of the best teams in the world beat a very limited Irish team off the park. The Irish fans sang anyway. Why exactly does this offend people so much?
Last edited by Mr A; 07/06/2013 at 11:20 AM.
#NeverStopNotGivingUp
In an ideal world both the LoI teams and the national team would be strong. If one element is strong, say LoI team(s) are more regularly in the group stage of the Europa League (or ideally the CL) but the national team is underperforming (e.g. under Staunton), or on the other hand if the national team is often qualifying for tournaments but the LoI teams are struggling in Europe then at least the stronger element can carry Irish football to a degree. So long as kids can see an Irish team (either the National Team, or Shamrock Rovers or Bray or whoever) competing on an international stage, then they are likely to be attracted to game. But if both the LoI teams and the national team are doing very badly then we risk losing the next generation to the game. If there is no exopsure to Irish football then kids could be lost to other sports like Rugby, the GAA and football could suffer.
A strong league and a strong national team are not mutually exclusive, so I dont see why anyone would wish either to suffer. It's up to individuals to support what ever domestic or international teams they like and to attend matches which they wish to go to but to want an Irish team (club or country) to "get a tonking" against non-Irish opposition is to actively wish for something that can only be detrimental to Irish football. Indifference is one thing but wanting "a tonking" is very small minded, petty and smacks of cliqueness.
Bang on the money. Using that 'best fans in the world' thing as a stick to beat well meaning football fans is churlish in the extreme.
Ou-est le Centre George Pompidou?
It's been pointed out before. It's nothing to do with the team.
I have a huge sense of pride in the fact so many of the Irish team came through the League of Ireland, and those players can all be seen watching League of Ireland matches during time off.
It's the association itself that gives a sense of disconnection.
I pointed out already, I like to see the team do well. I'm happy to see them winning games. I'm happy to see them qualify for tournaments, or take big scalps along the way. I just have such a strong dislike for the organisation, that it makes me disconnected from following the team.
https://kesslereffect.bandcamp.com/album/kepler - New music. It's not that bad.
Just have to pull you up on one thing... Bray on the international stage?!...
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