Irish Football Blog

**geysir** · 19/09/2013, 9:26 PM

I have just read it and I'll give it a modest 9.5/10.
Just below your previous established gold standard.
I don't know what accounted for the marginal slip in form. I suspect it had to do with the sheer breadth of the topics over a 6 year timespan, ending with the prospective new managers review.

On Bielsa, he doesn't speak English, the key question to his candidacy is, does Manuela speak Spanish?

**Drumcondra 69er** · 19/09/2013, 9:39 PM

Originally Posted by geysir

I have just read it and I'll give it a modest 9.5/10.
Just below your previous established gold standard.
I don't know what accounted for the marginal slip in form. I suspect it had to do with the sheer breadth of the topics over a 6 year timespan, ending with the prospective new managers review.

On Bielsa, he doesn't speak English, the key question to his candidacy is, does Manuela speak Spanish?

Ah, you've smoked out my real reason for wanting him appointed!

**Junior** · 19/09/2013, 10:30 PM

Decent read. Good point about Robertson coming in with MON. Steve Walford was also a key member of that backroom staff (certainly at Celtic and Leicester anyway and I think he was at Sunderland with him also).

Interesting table on the records of former managers too. Like you say McCarthy's and Traps records are fairly comparable except for the Goals Scored column. McCarthys teams scored 31 more goals in just 4 more games. If we had just a fractionally more potent strike force under Trap then this last campaign may have been just a little different.

**paul_oshea** · 19/09/2013, 10:43 PM

But junior that's the whole thing about traps reign it wasn't down to an individual even with a Rooney in there we were just not setup and told to play in a way that could produce goals.traps motto was don't concede. That was it. We had nothing else. And then in the end we didn't even have that.

I remember sitting there watching the Austria game in the stands and its the first time in a long time that I wasn't nervous or anxious or worried it had a certain air of imevitability. I was almost glad when the result came cos I knew it meant the end of trap. We were totally out of ideas or any imagination under trap for well over a year and a half now. His goose was cooked and I'm not sure he really cared.

Contrast to how we looked 4 or so years ago against Bulgaria away. it says it all really.

**geysir** · 19/09/2013, 10:56 PM

Originally Posted by Junior

Decent read. Good point about Robertson coming in with MON. Steve Walford was also a key member of that backroom staff (certainly at Celtic and Leicester anyway and I think he was at Sunderland with him also).

The talk is (I forget where I heard it) that Walford is past it - a fancy for archaic coaching methods and Robertson is definitely not interested in coming back into the game.

**Crosby87** · 19/09/2013, 10:58 PM

Did you at least get some good Weinerschnitzel Posh?

**Stuttgart88** · 20/09/2013, 6:47 AM

I didn't realise Alan Kelly senior's record was so good!

I've been thinking about MONs back up team too and would like to think the requirement of this job would negate the need for Walford /Robertson. I'd love to see people like Cunningham, Kilbane, Kinsella, Breen etc as part of any set up.

Assuming they can coach of course!

**Drumcondra 69er** · 20/09/2013, 6:56 AM

Originally Posted by geysir

The talk is (I forget where I heard it) that Walford is past it - a fancy for archaic coaching methods and Robertson is definitely not interested in coming back into the game.

Am assuming that Robertson won't want to go back day to day due to his illness but that the part time nature plus staying based where he is could swing it.

Like Stutts, I'd be happy to see some recent ex players involved but I think O'Neill needs someone of his vintage there to bounce off...

**paul_oshea** · 20/09/2013, 9:37 AM

Originally Posted by Crosby87

Did you at least get some good Weinerschnitzel Posh?

Genau. Immer Wieder.

**Stuttgart88** · 20/09/2013, 10:56 AM

Originally Posted by paul_oshea

But junior that's the whole thing about traps reign it wasn't down to an individual even with a Rooney in there we were just not setup and told to play in a way that could produce goals.traps motto was don't concede. That was it. We had nothing else. And then in the end we didn't even have that.

I remember sitting there watching the Austria game in the stands and its the first time in a long time that I wasn't nervous or anxious or worried it had a certain air of imevitability. I was almost glad when the result came cos I knew it meant the end of trap. We were totally out of ideas or any imagination under trap for well over a year and a half now. His goose was cooked and I'm not sure he really cared.

Contrast to how we looked 4 or so years ago against Bulgaria away. it says it all really.

I thought we were comfortable and looking like nicking it for the best part of 60 minutes. When they made their telling change, we did nothing. Like with like, as usual. Set pieces rubbish, as usual.

**paul_oshea** · 20/09/2013, 11:20 AM

I think the end of the sweden game showed it. The players looked out of ideas, tired and almost bored, certainly toothless and frustrated. I think deep down they had enough of the tactics themselves. Hit and hope.

**Drumcondra 69er** · 20/09/2013, 11:26 AM

Originally Posted by paul_oshea

I think the end of the sweden game showed it. The players looked out of ideas, tired and almost bored, certainly toothless and frustrated. I think deep down they had enough of the tactics themselves. Hit and hope.

Personally think the last 20 minutes of the Austria home game did it. Had them well under the cosh around the hour mark, corner after corner, they were there for the taking but the subs and tactics were so negative and boom, 2 points dropped.

**Stuttgart88** · 20/09/2013, 11:26 AM

Originally Posted by paul_oshea

I think the end of the sweden game showed it. The players looked out of ideas, tired and almost bored, certainly toothless and frustrated. I think deep down they had enough of the tactics themselves. Hit and hope.

I agree but you were talking about Austria!

**paul_oshea** · 20/09/2013, 12:40 PM

Originally Posted by Drumcondra 69er

Personally think the last 20 minutes of the Austria home game did it. Had them well under the cosh around the hour mark, corner after corner, they were there for the taking but the subs and tactics were so negative and boom, 2 points dropped.

You had to go and remind me of that again!! That was definitely the turning point. It changed the context of the group completely. We could have drawn both the last games and still be in contention, but by drawing it put too much pressure on us needing to win our first game against Sweden. We might have found it easier to actually get the win against Sweden had that been the case.

**Stuttgart88** · 20/09/2013, 12:54 PM

As the games turned out, I think all 4 of the games against Sweden and Austria were winnable. Not on paper, but as the actual games played out.

Instead we got 2 draws.

There was probably a lack of leadership on the pitch and a lack of killer instinct. This is intertwined with the lack of a winning habit in these games. We regularly failed to win such games under Trap and his "definitely don't lose, maybe win" ethos largely contributed to this.

For years I've been noticing Sweden win games like Ireland away.

In fairness the "draw away" mantra has dogged us since way before Trap, but at least we used to win home games.

**paul_oshea** · 20/09/2013, 1:41 PM

We didnt do, we never really won the home games against teams like Sweden or even Austria. Thats the point, trap changed nothing on that front.

This is more fairytale revisionism(not at you stutts). Whoever we beat away we generally beat at home, whoever we drew away with, we drew at home with also. The difference being our results were better than theirs were against the other teams. We lost twice when before we would have drawn - home v sweden, away v austria and this time it would have us trailing sweden by a couple of points.

Had we sweden and austria in traps first or even second group the outcome i imagine would have been very similar.

**tetsujin1979** · 20/09/2013, 1:56 PM

Originally Posted by paul_oshea

Had we sweden and austria in traps first or even second group the outcome i imagine would have been very similar.

and if my auntie had balls, I'd imagine that would make her my uncle

**Drumcondra 69er** · 20/09/2013, 2:53 PM

Originally Posted by tetsujin1979

and if my auntie had balls, I'd imagine that would make her my uncle

If she was in midfield and Trap was boss them balls would probably be flying over her head......

**paul_oshea** · 20/09/2013, 3:35 PM

Originally Posted by tetsujin1979

and if my auntie had balls, I'd imagine that would make her my uncle

Thats about the 100th time you have said that on this forum. She would most likely be a transsexual but so it would purely be up to you what you called her. At any rate they would be articificial testicles.

**Stuttgart88** · 20/09/2013, 6:18 PM

Originally Posted by paul_oshea

We didnt do, we never really won the home games against teams like Sweden or even Austria. Thats the point, trap changed nothing on that front.

This is more fairytale revisionism(not at you stutts). Whoever we beat away we generally beat at home, whoever we drew away with, we drew at home with also.

I don't think that's true. For over a decade we'd turn up knowing we had a half decent shout at beating a no. 1, 2 or 3 seed. But even in those campaigns like Stan and Kerr's' we'd be competitive at home and drawing was not for won't of giving it a go (Swiss home game excepted probably). Stu posted the competitive home statistics. Traps home record was poor.