Irish team v France

[thejollyrodger]

Got a few City mates (Irish and Non Irish fans) who cannot believe that Dunne doesn't get a look in for us these days. He is deceptively quick, something that is severly lacking in Andy & Kenny and was shown up on numerous occasions against the Swiss.

But his temperment has let him down on a number of occasions. He was a loose cannon a while ago.

finnan, keane, holland, kilbane

Thats a terrible midfield. Are you trying to loose?

_________Finnan_________Keane________Kavanagh_____ ____Duff

______________Robbie Keane_________Clinton or Elliot


I wouldnt start Reid on a game like this. He doesnt have much experience and needs to go on the slim fast.

IMO I think its a fine line between Hearte and O Shea. Both are crap. I would go with O' Shea just because he has more first team football than Hearte at the mo.

[eirebhoy]

But his temperment has let him down on a number of occasions. He was a loose cannon a while ago.

Dunne's red card last month was just his second since joining Man City in 2000 (150 matches). I prefer aggresive players playing at the back as long as they don't get in trouble and Dunne certainly doesn't seem to be.

I couldn't care if Andy Reid is 18 stone, it doesn't seem to be effecting him and if he was overweight I'm sure Joe would have said something by now. Every Irish person seems to mention it so surely Reid himself would know if he was overweight.

[thejollyrodger]

Well now is no time to start tinkering with things at the back. Dunne might have a bit of pace but realistically is never going to get a start in Paris.

As for Reid, there is no point running around a football pitch carrying all that extra weight. Physics alone shows that he is going to be that bit slower lugging the extra weight around. He will have to loose it.

[eirebhoy]

Well now is no time to start tinkering with things at the back.

Agreed.

As for Reid, there is no point running around a football pitch carrying all that extra weight. Physics alone shows that he is going to be that bit slower lugging the extra weight around. He will have to loose it.

As I said, if he was overweight I'm sure the staff at Forest would have got it sorted a long time ago. I would be 90+% sure he's not overweight.

[narrowback]

_________Finnan_________Keane________Kavanagh_____ ____Duff

______________Robbie Keane_________Clinton or Elliot


midfield gonna be vital in this game and i not a big fan of kilbane but he playin well and does give us an outlet at times since he moved to centre mid with the toffees i rekon could give us a bit more in the midfield and if we needed duffer to drop onto the left. for the french its a must win game now and that could be trouble. kavanagh again i dont think has enough experiance and should be used as cover at best. is miller out?

[eirebhoy]

midfield gonna be vital in this game and i not a big fan of kilbane but he playin well and does give us an outlet at times since he moved to centre mid with the toffees i rekon could give us a bit more in the midfield and if we needed duffer to drop onto the left. for the french its a must win game now and that could be trouble. kavanagh again i dont think has enough experiance and should be used as cover at best. is miller out?

I don't understand how Kavanagh hasn't got enough experience yet Kilbane does. Kilbane hasn't played more than 10 games in central midfield. Kavanagh has played in central midfield at the age of 20 against top class players including Irish legends in Houghton, McGrath, Staunton, Sheridan, O'Leary, Townsend (just named the Irish as its fitting to this forum ). Its not as if he hasn't played against players of the quality of Dhorasoo and Pedretti (if both fit should be the French midfield partnership) before. Considering he is now 10 years older and in his prime I don't even think there is any risk involved.

Miller came on for ManU on Saturday for the last 5mins. Holland didn't make the bench for Charlton tonight.

Just one more thing on Andy Reid's "weight problem". Would you call James Beattie overweight? I certainly wouldn't and he has the exact same build as Reid.
http://eur.news1.yimg.com/eur.yimg.c.../883301746.jpg

[thejollyrodger]

I still remain unconiveced about Reid and his weight problem. Maybe he is ok, maybe he isnt. I do reckon it is better to be lean and mean.

Miller - no way is he getting a start or even on the bench. Looks like he isnt very sure footed at Man Utd IMO. Its going to take another season for him at least.

Kilbane - I would start him on the bench as he can sometimes offer that enthusium to get things going but Duff beats him in left wing and so does kavanagh in the centre.

Holland didn't make the bench for Charlton tonight.

More great news :P

What a girl in the centre of the park. Scored a few goals now and again but we need to dominate the centre of the park to be in with a fighting chance. I couldnt see Holland doing it.

[1MickCollins]

I'm more concerned about how we play than who plays where - I think we need a fit Roy Keane, Damien Duff and Robbie Keane & Clinton Morrison & Shay Given. Most of the other calls Kilbane v Holland v Kilbane or O'Shea v Finnan or Finnan v Carr don't matter so much.

We need to put France under pressure from the start and not let them settle, when we don't have possession we should have 11 men behind the ball everyone working to get it back. Against the Swiss and Cypriots we we let them play through our midefield far too cheaply. The Swiss looked like they could have walked the ball into our net several times and we gifted Cyprus 2 great chances in a game where we didn't create that many clear cut chances ourselves.

I'm looking for a hungry and brave Ireland performance, gritty and determined when not in possession and smart when in possession. France won't be there for the taking like this again any time soon.

[koneinc]

France won't be there for the taking like this again any time soon.

My thoughts exactly, now is our chance and we have to make the most of it, a win away would do wonders for our chances for reaching Germany.

[tricky_colour]

Just one more thing on Andy Reid's "weight problem". Would you call James Beattie overweight? I certainly wouldn't and he has the exact same build as Reid.
http://eur.news1.yimg.com/eur.yimg.c.../883301746.jpg

Some compare Andy Reid to John Robertson of Forests European Cup
winning Brian Clough era.

http://www.forest-gazzette.pp.se/Legendgb.htm#Robertson


"Clough switched Robertson to the left wing and there he began to blossom, using skill and "jinkery" rather than speed to beat opponents. It soon became clear that after a slow start, John Robertson had emerged as one of the best players ever to play for the Reds."


Also
http://www.justcatnaps.com/collectio...rtsonjohn.html

(I didn't realise he was playing in 70-71 though.)

So speed isn't everything, not that Reid is slow.

[4tothefloor]

This is the team i'd pick for Paris:

Given
Finnan Cunningham O'Brien O'Shea
Reid Keane Kavanagh Duff
Keane (withdrawn role) Morrisson

Would not start with Kilbane, while Holland isn't match fit. If we are in trouble and need to add a bit of urgency, we could move O'Shea up to centre midfield in place of Kav\Keane, Finnan to left-back, Carr on at right back. Of course it all depends on how individuals perform on the night. I'd worry about O'Shea and Reid as they're either on form or are ineffective. We need big games from the two Keanes, O'Brien and Shay Given. I'd take a point right now!

[Stuttgart88]

There's increasing speculation in the media that O'Shea is set for a midfield berth on Saturday. This worries me to be honest. I hear O'Shea got a lot of stick from the crowd last Sunday.

It's probably just media guff as there's 4 days to go and very little to write about. I wonder how much clout Keane will exercise in his preference for a partner.

If anyone can paste what the Irish Times is saying about the match I'd be grateful. I don't subscribe to their website (yet) and I can only buy it 24 hours late in London.

[wild rovers]

Have to go with

carr-o'brien-cunningham-O'shea
finnan-keane-holland-duff
keane-morrisson

Bringing on both Reid and Kavanagh to shake things up in the 2nd half if we need a goal but neither should start.....

[harps1954]

I started this thread about three or four weeks ago and I am still of the belief that Kerr will play five in the middle of the park as I think he is a very cautious manager. But I have changed my mind a bit on the formation of the team now that he is hinting at O'Shea in midfield. Therefore, I think the team could be:

Given

Carr - Cunningham - O'Brien - Finnan

Duff - Keane - O'Shea - Kavanagh - Kilbane

Keane

Any views? There is just something in me that says that he will be happy with his point, as we all will be, and won't take any risks.

[koneinc]

--- --- --- --- Given --- --- --- ---

Carr --- O'Brien --- Cunningham --- Finnan/Maybury

Reid --- Keane --- Kavanagh --- Kilbane

--- --- --- --- --- Duff

--- --- Keane

[tetsujin1979]

At some point in the qualification series, in order to top the group, we are going to have to take a chance, this was always going to occur in either of the France or Swiss home or away ties, as we would expect to win every one of the other ties. One of these has already passed us by. France are at their weakest right now than they have been in years, for the return leg god knows who they will have back, so the chance has to be taken now, Brian's stuck with 4-4-2 almost entirely through his tenure as manager, with a few variations (Duff / Reid behind the strikers, either given a free role, swapping wings, etc) he's not going to change this for his biggest competitive game to date (in terms of opposition anyway, we can argue whether or not Russia at home/Swiss away in Euro 2004 was bigger another time). The majority of the team picks itself - Given, Cunningham, O'Brien, Roy Keane, Robbie Keane, Duff, Carr can all expect to start
The questions begin with:
Left full - O'Shea hasn't convinced there and isn't playing there for his club
Right midfield - do we go to attack with Reid or contain and break with Finnan?
Central midfield - Kilbane is a Kerr favorite, but isn't ideal to the position against strong opposition, is Kavanagh ready for France, is Holland fit enough?
Who to partner Robbie - right now it's Clinton, and he's on form in internationals, but lack of club games and backup for him is troubling

The last time Kerr had to make decisions like this, they failed - Carsley against Russia, moving O'Shea into central defence against Switzerland and Harte at left full - so I can see Kerr making as little changes as possible to minimise any potential damage these changes to the team against France may cause.

Bearing all this in mind, I reckon the team will line out:
..................Given
Carr...Cunningham..O'Brien..O'Shea
Finnan..Roy Keane..Kilbane..Duff
.....Robbie Keane..Morrison

When the draw was made I would have taken a corner against the French, now a draw is plausible and a win isn't out of the question.
C'mon you boys in Green!

[Stuttgart88]

For all Kerr's talk after the draw with Russia about us being too rigid in shape and tactics, there's been no hint whatsoever that he's prepared to do anything different except, as Tetsujin points out, allowing Duff & Reid to swap wings.

I can't see him explicitly going 4-5-1. I think an overtly defensive set up from the start will put us on the back foot (remember away to Croatia?). I think we're better off taking the game to them with our usual shape and if Robbie & Clinton need to drop back they're usually quick to do so.

We practically have our best squad available (in Kerr's eyes we do) so if we avoid mistakes and take our chances we've every chance.

[thejollyrodger]

If we really want to go for a win saturday night I would go for a 4-3-3 formation.


___________________Given_______________________

Carr_________O Brien_____Cunningham________O Shea

________Finnan______Keane______Holland/Kavanagh__

_________Reid________Keane_______Duff____________

This can fall back to 4-5-1 when we have to defend. I.E Reid and Duff coming back and closing the french down, leaving robbie up front.

Back 4 is the usual suspects. Im hoping Carr can put on a solid performance but Finnan is there to help Carr out. The same other side, Holland/Kavanagh will be able to help out O Shea. Kavanagh especially with some solid challenges. Roy Keane in the holding role spreading the play but static enough except for defending.

Up front its up to Reid and Duff to get in quality crosses for Robbie Keane, the other winger and the midfield players Finnan and Holland/Kavanagh.

Kavanagh looks like one of the few players in the side who can really put the oppostion under pressure, make solid tackles and make his physical presence known.

If Reid looks like he isnt up to international standard it I would bring on Miller.

[koneinc]

That might just be crazy enough to work Jolly

[barglee]

Given
Carr o brien cunningham harte(he shud be in the squad as hes our only left back)
finnan kilbane keane reid
duff keane

maybe oshea in mdifield instead of kilbane.

still dunno why harte isnt in the squad.