Cycling 2013

[Stuttgart88]

I tried to find that article online but couldn't. It was an addendum to an article in the printed version. In fairness I don't think there was any insinuation regarding Evans. I think it was merely saying that those guys aren't likely to win the race again as the emerging talent looks stronger.

One thing I don't like about SKY / Froome is that they have such a big budget they can afford to send riders to every race while keeping their better riders in altitude training if they need to. I can only recall Froome competing in Oman, the Dauphine and the Tour this season. It almost shows disrespect to the classics, and also to the Giro. Ok, I know many teams keep riders out of the Giro but still, it doesn't sit we'll with me. Armstrong used to only race the Tour for a few seasons I think.

[Stuttgart88]

Apparently Froome won a crit in Belgium yesterday

[Mr A]

Good result for Roche yesterday, 5th in San Sebastian. Hopefully he'll peak for the Vuelta. Picks up 30 World Tour points as well- 50% more than a Tour de France Stage win even if the prestige isn't anything like the same.

[Stuttgart88]

Paul Kimmage very sceptical of Froome and SKY in the july 23rd Second Captains podcast. Interesting interview.

http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/second-captains

[Macy]

One thing I don't like about SKY / Froome is that they have such a big budget they can afford to send riders to every race while keeping their better riders in altitude training if they need to. I can only recall Froome competing in Oman, the Dauphine and the Tour this season. It almost shows disrespect to the classics, and also to the Giro. Ok, I know many teams keep riders out of the Giro but still, it doesn't sit we'll with me. Armstrong used to only race the Tour for a few seasons I think.

Sky only have the same sized roster as other World Tour Teams. Nibali is basically on the same race schedule as Wiggins for example.

For me, Sky's problem remains transparency. They, and their fans (journalists and otherwise) can say people don't have the knowledge to interpret the data, and that might be true, but for me the not releasing it is the issue rather than what it may or may not show. When they did release data, to a bloke who previously said Armstrong was credible, they only release Froomes data from the 2011 Veulta when he came from nowhere (not even a sky contract extension) to podium!

Sky are putting results ahead of their, and the sports, credibility. I really want to believe them, but two tour wins down it's time for them to reveal more of their innovative, clean, methods. And I mean a bit more than the old "flavoured" water bs that David Walsh seems to have fallen for.

I was talking to a friend about this at the weekend. I'm 37, and have been following pro-cycling since the late 80's (1990 was the first tour I first really followed religiously). The majority of "unbelievable" performances I've witnessed, have turned out to be, well, unbelievable. That's the background of many followers of the sport - I really don't get why Team Sky, certain journalists, and their fans can't grasp this. I'm sorry, I no longer believer in "miracles". The lack of transparency, and not getting the need for it, is really depressing. The dismissiveness of (mainly) british journalists (journalists that I've previously liked and respected) to the transparency issue is getting on my wick. The Sky fanboys are idiots. What was a great Tour of racing, has really left quite a bitter taste to be honest!

[bennocelt]

The stage Froome won on the mountain stage did seem superhuman, he was way ahead of everyone that day, it was an amazing performance. can one cyclist be really so ahead of everyone else?

Whats your opinion Macy (Spud, Sttu, Dodge and the rest!) on Bradley Wiggins? My wife is convinced he is (was) on drugs - (she is a doctor!)

[Stuttgart88]

I'm not a doctor but I think he's a tool.

[Macy]

Whats your opinion Macy (Spud, Sttu, Dodge and the rest!) on Bradley Wiggins? My wife is convinced he is (was) on drugs - (she is a doctor!)

I've less question marks than this years winner - I still keep coming back to him going into the 2011 veulta without a contract offer from Sky, and therefore Sky's superdooper analysts can't have been that impressed with his "numbers" (doesn't make him dirty, just needs proper explanation imo)! You can't say wiggins didn't look human during last years tour, or this year so far. The course was built for him with the amount of time trialling. He can be a bit of a tool and/ or contradictory, but I want to believe he is clean.

There is logic to the argument that great performances were so easy/ relatively cheap with epo and blood transfusions, that training methods and methodologies never properly moved with the times, and sky are the first ones to make the advances. But there's no good just talking a good game in this sport anymore - be open about the methods even with a loss of results/ rivals catching up, or accept the innuendo.

[the 12 th man]

Eric Zabel comes clean http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/cycling/23485910

(Not sure if this is old news but I only heard it today)

[Mr A]

The other thing about Sky is- if their training etc is so much better than that at other teams, why hasn't Mick Rogers brought that to Saxo and allowed them to apply it too?

[bennocelt]

I've less question marks than this years winner - I still keep coming back to him going into the 2011 veulta without a contract offer from Sky, and therefore Sky's superdooper analysts can't have been that impressed with his "numbers" (doesn't make him dirty, just needs proper explanation imo)! You can't say wiggins didn't look human during last years tour, or this year so far. The course was built for him with the amount of time trialling. He can be a bit of a tool and/ or contradictory, but I want to believe he is clean.

There is logic to the argument that great performances were so easy/ relatively cheap with epo and blood transfusions, that training methods and methodologies never properly moved with the times, and sky are the first ones to make the advances. But there's no good just talking a good game in this sport anymore - be open about the methods even with a loss of results/ rivals catching up, or accept the innuendo.

I am happen to like Wiggins a lot and hope he was clean, but hasnt he had a severe loss of form since the win?

[Mr A]

He has- but I think that's more down to temperament, injuries and a big problem with descending. I think he also had major issues previously after a very successful olympics- he seems to lose it a bit after major highs. Wiggins does not help himself with his constant ability to contradict himself- he seems to say whatever he thinks people want to hear at any given moment. But for the moment I'd give him the benefit of the doubt.

[Macy]

The other thing about Sky is- if their training etc is so much better than that at other teams, why hasn't Mick Rogers brought that to Saxo and allowed them to apply it too?

Think he's said they've a long way to go in implementing the methods. I've also heard it mentioned that Riis is a bit old school, and is slow to make changes (which kinda makes you wonder about Stephen pushing Nico that direction). I've also heard it said that Moviestar are taking on board a lot of new methods and sky see them as a big threat (I don't know whether Dowsett is an influence or not), but given that organisations history, that doesn't really inspire confidence tbh.

I am happen to like Wiggins a lot and hope he was clean, but hasnt he had a severe loss of form since the win?

Partied too hard, and as Mr A said, he's gone that way after every success. Even his first year with Sky didn't go great, after the high of the top 4 in the Tour with Garmin. He's also not getting any younger. I do generally like him as well, just don't be giving out about being a celebrity whilst hanging out on stage with Weller and that!

[Stuttgart88]

I think an issue with Wiggins is that he has to emaciate himself to get TdF fit, getting down to 6% body fat. This leaves him highly vulnerable to colds and infections. I think his luck ran out in a very cold Giro this year and he came down with a heavy cold which when added to his suppressed immune system became a chest infection. See, told you I wasn't a doctor.

I'd be inclined to believe in Wiggins. He's basically a super TTist and normal enough climber. Last year's course was perfect for him. Someone like Cancellara is just to big to perform on anything other than a TT or flat stage but Wiggins lost a lot of weight to be competitive in the mountains. I think I read he can only sustain that weight for a month or two.

[Mr A]

Great to see Martyn Irvine back- he's on the start list for the Volta a Portugal. Meanwhile Philip Deignan will be looking to continue his excellent season at the Tour of Utah.

[Mr A]

Philip Deignan rumoured to be in talks with Sky: http://www.stickybottle.com/latest-n...g-to-team-sky/

Meanwhile Philip Lavery is also doing Burgos with Cofidis, hoping to earn a contract there. Hopefully Irvine, Deignan and Lavery all have good races.

[Macy]

Philip Deignan rumoured to be in talks with Sky: http://www.stickybottle.com/latest-n...g-to-team-sky/

I've conflicting emotions already!

Would be a great move for him, as although he'll be a domestique (at least initially, who knows where he could go with all their secret innovative techniques), at least they're a team that appreciates that role.

[Mr A]

Another decent result for him- 6th overall in the Tour of Utah. That'll certainly help his negotiating position. Lavery seems to have done OK in Burgos. Can't find results from Portugal.

Looking forward to the Vuelta. Martin has confirmed he'll lead Garmin there and at next year's Giro.

[Dodge]

3 grand tours in a row for him? He'd hardly do a 4th with another Tour?

[Macy]

3 grand tours in a row for him? He'd hardly do a 4th with another Tour?

Would it be possible he'd go there with no GC ambitions? It's a bit early to be talking about the Giro as well for me - I would've thought he'd be focussing on the Ardennes classics, and could he hold top form from there for a GC challenge in the Giro? It'd be great to see him start the Giro here regardless of how it ends up going for him though.