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Thread: RTE Panel

  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by DannyInvincible View Post
    Maybe so, although I thought Dunphy's run-through of "solution players" the other evening could be construed as misleading.
    Misleading in what way?
    I viewed it as players he thought should be in the team in August. Was it not presented as such?

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    Capped Player DannyInvincible's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Real ale Madrid View Post
    Misleading in what way?
    I viewed it as players he thought should be in the team in August. Was it not presented as such?
    OwlsFan has already outlined why the segment was so bizarre in an earlier post of his, but I'll add to it. Bill asked, "Have we made the best of our pool of players available to us?" and stated that what irritated Dunphy more than anything else was that so many players he felt should have been involved were left at home. Dunphy confirmed his irritation and whilst he was certainly arguing that the players mentioned should be used in future, he also used the segment to attack Trap's tournament squad selection by discussing players that were justifiably not in the squad due to injury (Fahey), personal circumstances (McCarthy) or questionable ability in comparison to those already filling their recognised positions (Clark, Coleman, Pilkington). He even mentioned players that Trap had included in the squad or has utilised frequently in the past (McClean, Fahey). Brady further claimed these players "weren't integrated". What a load of nonsense.

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  4. #63
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    Still not sure how someone's wrong opinion can be deemed misleading. Newspapers carry opinion pieces everyday with incorrect information. This information itself can be misleading - but are the rte panel deliberately misleading the public ?

    The segment you refer to was populist BS from Dunphy - egged on by Bill who proclaimed Eamonn as being very passionate. But I'm not sure it was premeditated or motivated by anything other then thier own opinions.

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    First Team backstothewall's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Real ale Madrid View Post
    The segment you refer to was populist BS from Dunphy - egged on by Bill who proclaimed Eamonn as being very passionate. But I'm not sure it was premeditated or motivated by anything other then thier own opinions.
    Aww come on. That package of clips didn't put itself together and trick the producer into shouting run V.T.
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    Quote Originally Posted by backtowalsall View Post
    Aww come on. That package of clips didn't put itself together and trick the producer into shouting run V.T.
    What the hell are you on about? don't isolate the first part of the sentence without reading the rest of it. What's wrong with you ?

    The segment was put together to highlight players who should be involved in Dunphyland. It wasn't a premeditated attack on Trapatoni - it was an opininon piece!

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    First Team backstothewall's Avatar
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    I completely agree with the first half of the sentence. It was a load of populist bull. But it was also a blistering attack on Trap. Surely the fact that the clips were prepared and ready to go makes it obvious that the whole thing was planned in advance. He even thanked the production assistant who edited the clips together for him.
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    Quote Originally Posted by backtowalsall View Post
    I completely agree with the first half of the sentence. It was a load of populist bull. But it was also a blistering attack on Trap. Surely the fact that the clips were prepared and ready to go makes it obvious that the whole thing was planned in advance. He even thanked the production assistant who edited the clips together for him.
    Look we can agree to disagree. It was planned of course but after the spanish game id imagine - they hardly had it ready since day 1 - ready to stike down the Itialian as soon as we slipped up. If they had it ready the night of the Croatian game then I could agree that it was a premeditated attack on the manager, but not after the Spanish game. The game was up then and the focus was starting to shift to the future.

    And criticism of the players that he has picked can hardly be construed as a blistering attack on him either.

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    First Team backstothewall's Avatar
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    We only disagree on the meaning of the word pre-meditated it seems. For me putting it together after the Spain game is still pre-meditated. The honest thing to do would have been to show it before the Italy game and look like fools if we won and ended the tournament in a reasonably respectable position. But like cowards they waited until the game was over.

    Where was Dunphy banging on about Hoolahan before the tournament. Between November and June he was one of the cheerleaders telling us that we have good players. During the tournament the system and style and system were letting us down. And now the players he was building up 3 weeks ago were never good enough and it's all Trap fault for picking them.

    He did little else but criticise Whelan and Andrews in qualifying. After the last game against Armenia they went off air before all the groups were settled, and Bosnia were winning in Paris, meaning France would need a play-off and we wouldn't be seeded. He was scathing about Trap, and about the players not being good enough. Whelan and Andrews can't pass the ball and all the usual crap. By half time in the next game we were a goal up away from home in a playoff we had been seeded for, and Andrews had got the goal. Dunphy dropped his agenda, probably fearing a repeat of the world of pain he got himself into during Italia 90.

    Dunphy doesn't like this coaches methods, regardless of the results he gets, and will use any opportunity to attack him. He only dropped it when he absolutely had to and that ill-formed package of clips was 8 months of pent up frustration being released. The man is a worm.
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    The Cheeto God Real ale Madrid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by backtowalsall View Post
    We only disagree on the meaning of the word pre-meditated it seems. For me putting it together after the Spain game is still pre-meditated. The honest thing to do would have been to show it before the Italy game and look like fools if we won and ended the tournament in a reasonably respectable position. But like cowards they waited until the game was over.

    Where was Dunphy banging on about Hoolahan before the tournament. Between November and June he was one of the cheerleaders telling us that we have good players. During the tournament the system and style and system were letting us down. And now the players he was building up 3 weeks ago were never good enough and it's all Trap fault for picking them.

    He did little else but criticise Whelan and Andrews in qualifying. After the last game against Armenia they went off air before all the groups were settled, and Bosnia were winning in Paris, meaning France would need a play-off and we wouldn't be seeded. He was scathing about Trap, and about the players not being good enough. Whelan and Andrews can't pass the ball and all the usual crap. By half time in the next game we were a goal up away from home in a playoff we had been seeded for, and Andrews had got the goal. Dunphy dropped his agenda, probably fearing a repeat of the world of pain he got himself into during Italia 90.

    Dunphy doesn't like this coaches methods, regardless of the results he gets, and will use any opportunity to attack him. He only dropped it when he absolutely had to and that ill-formed package of clips was 8 months of pent up frustration being released. The man is a worm.
    Not sure if I agree with your first paragraph - we were out of the tournament regardless of how we got on against Italy, so for me its irrelevant when the segment aired. THe point of it was the same re. players sitting at home.

    Totally agree with the rest of your post - but as I said at the start of this - all they offer is an opinion - right or wrong. And I don't understand the constant whining about them. Although I do on reflection accept that people are entitled to have a go at them on here. I just think its pointless, thats all - they ain't gonna change.

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    Are the Irish public really not able to think for themselves? I think they appreciate that the Irish panel is far less banal than the UK panels but equally that there's a fair bit of hype and self-publicity going on.

    I do tend to agree that there is always too much of an anti-manager slant, but that has been the same around the whole media, not just TV, since Kerr if not earlier.

    Sorry to repeat an earlier remark, but what irked me most was Dunphy having to ask Brady if there's anything coming through the ranks. Anyone with a good interest in Irsih football should know this through the various channels of info available. Is Dunphy really alienated from the likes of Noel King for example, who he could just call for research? He could do worse than to go on here just for background.
    Last edited by Stuttgart88; 21/06/2012 at 12:12 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stuttgart88 View Post
    Are the Irish public really not able to think for themselves? I think they appreciate that the Irish panel is far less banal than the UK panels but equally that there's a fair bit of hype and self-publicity going on.

    I do tend to agree that there is always too much of an anti-manager slant, but that has been the same around the whole media, not just TV, since Kerr if not earlier.

    Sorry to repeat an earlier remark, but what irked me most was Dunphy having to ask Brady if there's anything coming through the ranks. Anyone with a good interest in Irsih football should know this through the various channels of info available. Is Dunphy really alienated from the likes of Noel King for example, who he could just call for research? He could do worse than to go on here just for background.
    Really good point. I read a piece in the last World Cup re the BBC and their pundit's failure to research the teams they were covering. RTE's boys are as bad, particularly Giles. They're being paid to do the work and yet they do very little research on the teams before the games.

    I think Giles has a wonderful football brain (Brady too and Dunphy does have a decent brain behind the sensationalist guff). Giles can dissect a game and articulate what he sees very well. He can take players that he's barely seen play and give a good evaluation of them. And that's great at half time or full time but it does irk me that sometimes, before a game, the panel can offer very little insight. It's their job - I wouldn't walk into mine completely unprepared coz I'd expect a kick in the nuts if I did.
    Last edited by barney; 21/06/2012 at 12:43 PM.

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    The Cheeto God Real ale Madrid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by barney View Post
    It's their job - I wouldn't walk into mine completely unprepared coz I'd expect a kick in the nuts if I did.
    And t'wod be the lads here lining up to do the kicking

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    Quote Originally Posted by Real ale Madrid View Post
    And t'wod be the lads here lining up to do the kicking
    Bring it on

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    Quote Originally Posted by barney View Post
    I think Giles has a wonderful football brain (Brady too and Dunphy does have a decent brain behind the sensationalist guff). Giles can dissect a game and articulate what he sees very well. He can take players that he's barely seen play and give a good evaluation of them. And that's great at half time or full time but it does irk me that sometimes, before a game, the panel can offer very little insight.
    Tell me though, what does Giles do other than tug on his jacket, say: "the game is all about getting the ball down and playing", "I am not advocating that we take a risk when playing" , "I agree with Eamon", "goals change games Bill", "I hope I am not repeating myself"

    Quote Originally Posted by Real ale Madrid View Post
    Although I do on reflection accept that people are entitled to have a go at them on here. I just think its pointless, thats all - they ain't gonna change.
    It's just called venting. Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
    Last edited by OwlsFan; 21/06/2012 at 1:39 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by OwlsFan View Post
    Tell me though, what does Giles do other than tug on his jacket, say: "the game is all about getting the ball down and playing", "I am not advocating that we take a risk when playing" , "I agree with Eamon", "goals change games Bill", "I hope I am not repeating myself"



    It's just called venting. Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
    That's because football is a simple game the way Giles understands it and he's right imo.
    The problem sometimes is Bill's questioning which can be very childish. If you check out Giles on Off The Ball he is asked better questions and is therefore much better to listen to.
    The man is unequalled as a pundit imo.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dong View Post
    That's because football is a simple game the way Giles understands it and he's right imo.
    The problem sometimes is Bill's questioning which can be very childish. If you check out Giles on Off The Ball he is asked better questions and is therefore much better to listen to.
    The man is unequalled as a pundit imo.
    Agree totally. Small example but you hear people peddle rubbish like "We scored too early" and people accept is as valid. I heard Giles pull Bill on it before and said you can't score too early. If an early goal has meant you've sat back and defended then it's not the scoring early that was the problem, it's the reaction to it.

    Other stuff as well like a team being one down launching it into the opponents box towards the end of the game. Giles' philosophy on it is that if it's right to pass the ball for 87 minutes then it's still right to pass it from 87-90 mins. Small thing but IMO, he's right where as the default attitude is to panic and punt the ball into your tallest player and pray for a break.

    Another example from the other night was "I'm not asking people to hold possession for possession's sake but if you have the ball you pass forward. If you can't go forward, go sideways. If you can't go sideways, then go back." It's simple but it's a very uncomplicated articulation of something that most people don't understand.

    He breaks the game down into very simple and uncomplicated philosophies while other people try to complicate it with systems, formations and tactics. Not saying they don't play a part but if you can't pass the ball, no system can turn you into a winner.
    Last edited by barney; 21/06/2012 at 3:28 PM.

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    It could be worse. You could have the BBC with Lineker and his s**t puns or ITV with Southgate and Adrian 'no personality' Chiles.

    I like having presenters and panelists who have an opinion and are not afraid to say what they think. I might not always agree with it but it's better than coming out with the same banalties week in week out (take a bow Hansen and Shearer).
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  23. #78
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    I've said it before, what Giles does better than any other pundit I know of is that, after watching three minutes of footage in the build up to any incident (goal, booking, pass, whatever) he can tell you exactly what went right or wrong, and what should have been done instead

    Best example I can give is from the last world cup when Germany broke through to score against England. I was convinced that it was simply down to Barry not being as fast as the Geman midfield, but Giles pointed out that immediately before Germany intercepted a pass, Glen Johnson had pushed forward to receive the ball from a throw in from Terry, and if he had stayed in position, then he would have been able to come across and cut out the danger before it developed into anything.
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    Quote Originally Posted by tetsujin1979 View Post
    I've said it before, what Giles does better than any other pundit I know of is that, after watching three minutes of footage in the build up to any incident (goal, booking, pass, whatever) he can tell you exactly what went right or wrong, and what should have been done instead

    Best example I can give is from the last world cup when Germany broke through to score against England. I was convinced that it was simply down to Barry not being as fast as the Geman midfield, but Giles pointed out that immediately before Germany intercepted a pass, Glen Johnson had pushed forward to receive the ball from a throw in from Terry, and if he had stayed in position, then he would have been able to come across and cut out the danger before it developed into anything.
    Not they can compare the same thing. I'm always amazed like you, when I assume one thing happened and a pundit points out something else.
    It's the expert eye that Giles and his ilk have that sees these things. That's why we aren't world class ex-players or pundits.

    Ken Early once said something telling on OTB one evening, he was commentating on an EPL match and Kenny Cunningham was his co-commentator, an incident occurred (I can't remember what) and he said he had formed his own idea of what happened and Kenny said that this, that and the other happened. Early couldn't believe it, he had seen nothing of what Kenny had said until after he watched the highlights later.
    This is a common theme on memory and expertise. Cunningham has it. Giles has it. We don't.
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    Cunny Kennigham seems to know his stuff he has his eyes on a place on the panel.

    I like Didi. Apres match do him well also

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