Will they be parading this?Originally Posted by SkStu
(Sorry!!)
Is that supposed to be a joke?
I have just had a look at his 'pedigree' and it does not read very well apart from a brief spell at Benifca.
"However, during his 20 games at the helm, Stuttgart produced poor results. Denmark internationals Jon Dahl Tomasson and Jesper Grønkjær openly criticized their coach, claiming he was afraid to attack."
Sounds fairly credible!!
In an ideal world the FAI would not have renewed Trap's contract and would have made him earn it with a decent Euro showing. We are now stuck with him for another 2 years as the FAI can't afford the pay out.
On paper everything looks good. We are in the Top 20 in the world for the first time in years and we qualified for our second European Championships.
However, the reality of our situation is a lot different. The "loyalty" that Trap showed which was apparently central to us qualifying for the championships was essentially the undoing of our performance in this tournament. We were haunted to qualify. Absolutely haunted.
Our team was stale going into this tournament. Every player knew that their position was safe. It is far harder to play yourself out of the team than play yourself into it. Given was coming back from injury and has uncharacteristically left in a number of soft goals for Villa this season. O'Shea has had his worst season in the Premiership. Dunne has just come back from a shoulder injury and was evidently rusty. St Ledger wasn't even 1st choice for Leicester City for a large part of the season. Ward is and always will be a liability at left back. Duff has below par for the past few months and looked tired and haggard. McGeady is inconsistent. Andrews isn't good enough for international football. Whelan had a decent season with Stoke and probably merited a start. Keane has moved to a part-time league and is at the tail end of his career. Doyle should not have been anywhere near the pitch, he has had a season to forget.
A tournament is a played over a limited time frame and there is no time for off form players to "play" themselves into form. If Trap had taken time out to experiment a bit more it could have been a different story. Kelly has actually been very good for Fulham this season. Wilson for Stoke has been also very solid at left full. McCarthy has been superb for Wigan in the last 1/3 of the season and there is no doubt in my mind that he would have gone to Poland if he felt he had a chance of playing. Gibson as well deserves more respect than Trap shows him. While I wouldn't have started McClean I would have brought him on for Duff V Croatia and switched him with McGeady. Long had a good end to the season and should have started.
3 decisions why I think Trap's position would be untenable if the FAI had the money to get rid of him:
- Cox on for McGeady on the left wing V Croatia. WTF? Inexplicable. I genuinely felt sorry for Cox out there. It wasn't his fault to have been place in such a position.
- Cox in midfield V Spain. Don't get me started.
- Green on in front of Gibson V Spain. The actions of a mad man.
In the short term, it has been great. We luckily qualified for a tournament. However, it was just short term gain. On the back of being found out badly at the Euro's and being absoultely humiliated, the long term future is not looking bright for Ireland with this mad man in charge, and ultimately this man could set us back a number of years.
Trap Out.
Last edited by tommy_c12000; 15/06/2012 at 2:23 AM.
That was a sarcastic reference to Roy Keane.
As for Trapattoni, it's his club record in Italy that marks him out, not one season at Benfica.
Author of Never Felt Better (History, Film Reviews).
Have a question for ye: I'm not saying this would be the right way to go or anything but if we were to get rid of Trap everyone knows money would be close to non existent. What are people's opinions of the following:
Appointing Mick McCarthy. Tell him that it is a very low paying job for the next two years as we are broke but if he brings the team on, replaces the old guard and performs well then he would be given a decent contract to take him to Euro 16.
Asking Marco to stay on, tell him that we haven't the resources to improve whatever contract he may be on but offer the same terms as above.
Or what about Brian Kerr? After that we'd be looking at (shudder.....) O'Leary, Keane and the likes.
Personally I would give it to McCarthy. When he talks about Ireland you can tell he has a real passion for the team. Only a couple of the players were around in 2002 and those that were will be starting to leave now.
Or Harry Redknapp is looking for a job, bet he would like to show England what they could have had. Liverpool must be kicking themselves. Imagine Harry during Amhrán na bhFiann, I'd be there for that alone.
Interestingling if you remember the Uruguay match when Tardelli was in charge, Ireland playing the best passing game we have in the last 4 years. Fair enough we lost, but against the 2nd best team in the world (apparently).
Given was for me the biggest dissapointment last night. In both games the early goals killed the team spirit and frankly Given in his prime wouldn't have broken a sweat to save them. The second goal last night was mainly his fault as well imo, rule no 1 for a goalkeeper, don't parry the ball into the middle of the box.
What scares me the most is our backline. We actually have a lot of quality available for the midfield, wings and forward positions. But we don't have a one decent CB ready to come in. Duffy will be i believe, but he's a couple of years away. And although i like O'Dea, i think he's already reached his peak.
For full back positions i actually find it hilarious how many people were ranting about how disgraceful it was that Killer was starting and Ward wasnt getting his game. Killer would have been a better option in the end sadly enough. All we can do is pray that Cunningham really comes through.
What made the irish teams great historically was we always had a world class players in midfield...Whelan and Andrews simply don't cut it. McCarthy/Gibson would be such a better option it's frightening.
Since when was Ballack an expert on Irish players?
Our players are inferior, a blind man can tell you that. But most teams players are inferior in relation to what Spain have. They're not champions for nothing.
By rights, that squad shouldn't be playing at this level. The players are not good enough for it. The fact we are there is down to Trap, and his system. We paid him enormous amounts of cash so we got the chance to compete at this level. It will stand to the players that remain as we move on over the following campaigns.
4-2-3-1
Given
Coleman-Dunne-Duffy-Wilson
McCarthy-Gibson
McGeady-Ireland-McLean
Long
I hope Given doesn't retire, he still has four years left on his Villa contract if I'm not mistaken, so I reckon he could last another qualifying campaign at least. Two bad games where he's obviously carrying an injury doesn't make him a bad player overnight.
Coleman looks great for Everton but we'll find out if he can actually play right back or if he is indeed better further up the pitch. If he doesn't cut it, I can't see him getting into the team ahead of McGeady or McClean, but we'll see I guess. O'Shea is over the hill, Ferguson rarely gets rid of a player before he's past it and O'Shea is no exception. I'm not sure how many other options we have here really, open to suggestions.
Dunne - he's immense, our next captain, I hope and pray that he doesn't retire. I don't think that he will, I reckon he's good for one more campaign.
Duffy - I'll admit, I know almost nothing about him but he seems to be highly regarded, hopefully he can break into the team. St. Ledger is a good honest player but let's be honest, as one guy on here said today, he can't get a game in the Championship. 'Nuff said, this is international football.
Wilson - best young player we have, I still can't figure out what he did to get Trap to hate him so much. He plays left back week in and week out for Stoke so I don't see any reason he can't do it for us. Great passer of the ball and very versatile also.
I'd add Ciaran Clark and maybe Best and Scannell to that
I had Clark in at cb, but took him out to put in at dm, but then forgot. I'd agree with Best. Scannell will disappoint us eventually I think
Here they come! It’s the charge of the “Thanks” Brigade!
A fair few have commented on players that should be "discarded" and included Andrews. That is incredibly unfair as I think he has two fine games and the only Irish player to come out with any credit. Set up in a midfield three with a couple of better ball players he would be even better.
Also there is some fantasy land suff going on naming players like Carruthers\White\Meyler\Hendrick - these lads are going to have to do more at club level.
Lets just hope that Trap reflects on what he has seen at 2012 and makes some changes. We play a very static 4-4-2, even at home against lesser teams our full backs don't push on for example.
I have never seen so many international players so afraid to pass or receive a pass.
UCD would have made a better fist of it. I ****ing kid you not.
I agree, if all out players had put in the same level of effort as Andrews we might have picked up a point against Croatia, and we certainly wouldnt have shipped 7 goals in the two games.
Yeah - they are going to have to work hard over the next season or two to match Paul Green's glittering career in England's lower divisions.
Nice glib comment but where did I say Green is the answer? And where the logic is saying Green is out but we want Villa\Sunderland reserve players and two lads who have never played above Championship level. In my opinion to oust players like Whelan\Andrews\Hunt from the squad they will have to do more.
Chillax the kacks - I was being sarcastic not Glib.
Jebus.
Fair enough. My high horse is back in the stable.
What kind of expert do you need to be to know that a fish out of water is just that?
And you fall into the trap of comparing Spain to Ireland. Just compare the Irish players to the standard they should be judged by. And for reference use your own job as a yardstick. You are expected to do certain basic things by your boss. Right? And if you don't you're out the door.
Many of the Irish players can't do the basic things.
People keep talking about effort. Effort is a given. You would expect that of any player who pulled on a green shirt. It's the ability to play proper football using the correct technique that is needed.
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