An assist there for Samaras.
In that context, what the papers that Crosser was referring to are effectively saying is that football is only worth watching if you follow a big team in a big 4 league. International football gives fans in countries like Ireland a chance to be at the glamorous party on occasion rather than reading about it in Hello! magazine. Long may it thrive.Originally Posted by bennocelt
Poland giving a good example of how to put it right up to the more fancied team. Cracking game.
Super game, great context, great atmosphere, great commitment, great delivery for the first goal (iffy finish) and super goal from Poland. ITV pundits enjoyed it but were harsh on the overall standard which I thought was technically good. Some central midfielders on that pitch can carry the ball at pace better than our wingers and full backs. Some great hard tackling too and none of the dangerous lungy cr@p the EPL holds so dear. I love watching eastern Europeans play football.
Interesting Article
Giovanni Trapattoni's Tactics Have Taken Ireland as Far as They Can
Watching Ireland lose 3-1 to Croatia on Sunday was really quite depressing. Not merely because of the defeat, but because of the manner of the defeat.
Ireland looked like a prehistoric side, totally bereft of ideas and guile, with only one speed and one game plan. The effort was there and along with some bad luck, but the thing that struck me was how terrible Ireland were with the ball. At times, it was embarrassing.
Giovanni Trapattoni's tactics have gotten Ireland to the group stage and he has done a fantastic job to qualify, but that's not enough.
First and foremost, I am a football fan, and, I want to see some ambition in my team. I want to see the team try and pass the ball.
Ireland, under Trap, refuse to do this. He doesn't want the team to get the ball down and play. Against Croatia, it was embarrassing to see how limited Ireland were on the ball. Time and time again, they passed it back to their fullbacks who aimlessly hoofed the ball long up the pitch and straight back to the Croats.
The lack of movement of the Irish team was telling. No one showed for the ball in midfield, as if the idea of showing for a pass was pointless, as they knew it would be lumped up the field. It was brutal to watch.
Trapattoni's selection of Green, Whelan and Andrews—whilst leaving out the likes of McCarthy, Coleman, Houlihan—sums up his ambition or lack thereof. He doesn't want players who can play. Trap just wants workhorses in midfield, and then hopes our front players will nick a goal.
What does this say to the kids in Ireland who want to become professional footballers?
Ireland should be encouraging passing football; promoting skill and technique, and not fearing the ball. The midfield should have technical players in it who can control the tempo of the game.
The Football Association of Ireland need to make a complete overhaul of the Irish setup, and they need to get all the Irish club sides and school youth teams involved. Ireland should take a look at FC Barcelona's La Masia, and try to get Irish clubs to incorporate their coaching techniques into their youth system.
Ireland should pick a formation (personally, I'd go for the 4-3-3), and get all the youth teams to agree to use this. We need to ban long balls from the youth system and stick to passing it short at all times (including the goalkeeper).
We shouldn't worry about the scores in youth football, and instead focus on promoting passing and technique. We should also incorporate "El Rondo" ("the round" possession technique) in all youth setups.
No Irish players should be afraid of getting the ball, as was so evident against Croatia. Ireland need to be brave on the ball. I do not believe for a second that Ireland cannot produce technical players. We can and we have. The problem is that we don't encourage them.
Ireland don't like players to take risks or to keep the ball. They panic and want them to "get it up the field," and a lot of youth coaches are to blame for this.
Look at Athletic Bilbao as a example. They are like a mini-international side who will only sign Basque players and, therefore, have a small pool of players to pick from. Look at how technical they all are and how well they play.
Why is this? It's simply down to their youth setup and their philosophy on the game.
Ireland need to change their philosophy on the game as a nation, and it has to start from the bottom up. They are miles behind most teams in terms of their style of play, and its time to catch up.
The FAI need to send people to Spain and Holland and look at the setup there. Learn from the masters, apply it and stick with it as a long-term plan.
Trapattoni's tactics have taken Ireland to the Euros and it is a great achievement, but I fear for Ireland against Italy and especially Spain.
Ireland looked utterly clueless against Croatia. Imagine what the Spaniards could do to them.
Hopefully, the FAI learn from this tournament and Ireland can finally move on from this long-ball football for good.
Everything suggested there is basically what the FAI has been doing for the past 2-3 years, with the national team the only exceptional.
That's not a grey area; that's handball.An intent to handle the ball is not enough on its own with out the contact
There are plenty of grey areas, like a player leaving his hand outstretched.
In the context of that discussion and in the context of that phrase i used, I think it is pretty clear that I was referring to a penalty being awarded for handball.
That there are plenty of grey areas whether a handball in the penalty area is considered a penalty or not.
Bit unfair to accuse Trap of having left McCarthy out.
It's incorrect to say Trap left McCarthy out, but would Trap have used him as anything other than a crisis back up option?
I don't believe he would, the fact we may not even see Gibson bears this out surely.
Permutations (I think):
Regardless of any other group results:
Ireland out unless we get 4 points. End of.
But other results come into play:
If we beat Spain and draw with Italy, we can only go out if Italy beats Croatia, but even then we would still go through if Spain beats Croatia in round 3.
If we draw with Spain and beat Italy we go through in 7 of the other 9 combinations of results and in every outcome if Italy beats Croatia tomorrow.
If we draw with Spain and beat Italy, we go can only go out if Spain beats Croatia and Croatia gets something from Italy.
Put another way:
If we get 4 points, regardless of how we get them, only 2 out of 9 other remaining outcomes see us go out, although which 2 are dependent on how we get our 4 points.
If we assume we are more likely to get 4 points by beating Italy, we would prefer Italy to beat Croatia before we play Spain.
Last edited by Stuttgart88; 13/06/2012 at 9:44 PM.
Originally Posted by mark12345
Trapattoni's selection of Green, Whelan and Andrews—whilst leaving out the likes of McCarthy, Coleman, Houlihan—sums up his ambition or lack thereof. He doesn't want players who can play. Trap just wants workhorses in midfield, and then hopes our front players will nick a goal.
Wrongly attributed to me. I didn't write this.
That was a perfect game from the Germans, take it easy, pounce when the opportunity required and always in control.
You should probably reference your source in your post to avoid confusion.
Crafty and I were exchanging texts throughout today's games. What a tournament. Great games, great context, the works.
How comfortable were Germany after they conceded VP's goal? 15 mins left and I'm not sure the Netherlands got a meaningful touch in Germany's defensive third for the rest of the game. Unreal.
The Germans owned the Dutch in that game (bar Van Persie's goal).
We've had that in Europe before mind.
Handball is defined in the laws as deliberate ball to hand, or deliberately leaving the hand outstretched (which was the phrase you gave). Both are frees and, if in the penalty area, penalties.
I didn't say "deliberately leaving the hand outstretched", I wrote "leaving his hand outstretched". A player can go in to cover an opponent with the arms naturally stretched out 25cm from his body, the ball hits his hand and it is not deemed a penalty, a deliberate contact.
'the position of the hand does not necessarily mean that there is an infringement'
There is no primary requirement for defenders to hold their hand behind their backs
Last edited by geysir; 15/06/2012 at 7:19 AM.
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