Ireland: 2002 vs. 2012?

[paul_oshea]

Keane is playing in the MLS for a reason?!

what one is that that he scored 3 in 4 games for villa and set up 2 goals?

[SkStu]

No way. Even though one couldn't be bothered, the two Keanes, Given & Duff were all at their peak then, now the ones left are all on their last hurrah. Only Dunne, on the evidence of Moscow where he was superb, and McClean if he gets in the squad are tangibly better

erm, Keane wasnt in the 2002 squad. Given is largely the same though was slightly better in 02. I think Duff is more or less the same, maybe slower but smarter. Keane has developed as a player and i prefer the Keane of today as a striker. Our back line is stronger, our wide players are better and our strike options are better, deeper and more sophisticated. In fact, for a cynic like me, i have to say the mid to long term future of the Irish football team has never been better in my opinion.

You can only play what you're up against;Cameroon were as good as the Croats now, Germany then are not quite up to a sublime Spain whilst the only major difference is the Saudis and Italy.
The latter were very poor last June (An '02 Saudi team would have given them a game.), but admit they won't be as bad surely this year?

Im not sure what your point is here, i can only assume you are agreeing that the group in the Euros is far tougher than the group we had in WC02. "An '02 Saudi team would have given them a game"? That Saudi team lost 8-0 to Germany. Jaysis. Are you real?

And the Euros tougher than the WC,after the Quarters, don't make me laugh....

Not what i said. Its tougher to do well in the Euros than the WC. Doing well for us is progress past round 1. We've done it 3 times in the WC and never in the Euros. And the quality of team is far higher in the Euros, that is not even up for debate.

[Stuttgart88]

I think it's hard to argue that the group stage in a European championship isn't harder than in a WC. I'd say the last 8 in a WC is better quality, enhanced by the typical presence of Brazil, Argentina and a team like Mexico.

[ArdeeBhoy]

erm, Keane wasnt in the 2002 squad. Given is largely the same though was slightly better in 02. I think Duff is more or less the same, maybe slower but smarter. Keane has developed as a player and i prefer the Keane of today as a striker. Our back line is stronger, our wide players are better and our strike options are better, deeper and more sophisticated. In fact, for a cynic like me, i have to say the mid to long term future of the Irish football team has never been better in my opinion.

You've contradicted yourself there. Not to mention being factually incorrect.

Im not sure what your point is here, i can only assume you are agreeing that the group in the Euros is far tougher than the group we had in WC02. "An '02 Saudi team would have given them a game"? That Saudi team lost 8-0 to Germany.

Except Ireland weren't and aren't ever going to be Germany. Am comparing our results v.Italy last summer and v.Saudis in '02. A difference of one goal.

Though I do accept the quality of the teams participating in Euro 2012 is more even than WC 2002.

[French Toasht]

Keane is playing in the MLS for a reason?!

what one is that that he scored 3 in 4 games for villa and set up 2 goals?

Well he's hardly playing for an MLS club because he's at the peak of his career now is he? I think the fact that he has played in two diddy leagues in Scotland and the US in recent seasons is pretty indicative of the direction his career has gone of late. Fair enough he has played well for Villa in his four games, but lets see that for what it is, four games. Lets not herald it as the second coming of Christ just yet.

Don't get me wrong I am Keane's biggest advocate and think he has always delivered for Ireland even when not playing particularly well at club level but to suggest you'd pick a 2012 Robbie Keane over a 2002 Robbie Keane is nothing short of ludicrous.

[Supreme feet]

Well he's hardly playing for an MLS club because he's at the peak of his career now is he? ...to suggest you'd pick a 2012 Robbie Keane over a 2002 Robbie Keane is nothing short of ludicrous.

I'd be slightly more inclined towards the 2002 Keane - based solely on his WC and Spurs form - but it's easy to forget how hot-and-cold he was back then for Ireland. Keane scored seven goals in 12 games in our 2012 qualifying campaign, following from his six in twelve in the 2010 qualifiers. He scored two from nine in the 2002 qualifiers (including a seven-game goal drought), and two from six in the Euro 2004 campaign. The latter, I would argue, was also his most ineffective campaign for us in his general play. In 2001/2, Keane scored 3 goals in 25 appearances for Leeds - a figure he's already equalled in four games for Villa.

I don't think it's necessarily ludicrous to suggest that Keane has added more consistency and intelligence to his game over the years. His goal record for Ireland suggests that he's actually improved with age. His game has never been about pace; he hasn't needed to adapt or change his game like, say, Duff, as he's aged. The move to the MLS isn't a true reflection of Keane's current ability or value, more a lifestyle/wife-appeasing choice. He's still well capable of playing and scoring regularly in the EPL, which he is currently reasserting after being messed around at Liverpool and Spurs over four difficult years.

[nigel-harps1954]

The key point I believe is that the 2002 squad had more leaders in the team.

There isn't much difference football wise in the teams. I think the 2002 team edge it though. If the right squad and right starting team were chosen though, 2012 would be miles ahead. Drop a few dead ends and bring in a few players more deserving of playing at the top.

[pineapple stu]

Except Ireland weren't and aren't ever going to be Germany. Am comparing our results v.Italy last summer and v.Saudis in '02. A difference of one goal.

So on that basis, you reckon Saudi Arabia would give Italy a game? Are you for real?

UCD beat Drogheda three times last season, and Drogheda nearly beat Dinamo Kiev in 2005. We'd give Kiev a game by your logic.

[ArdeeBhoy]

Are you for real? Ireland beat the Saudis by one more goal, that's all.They can only beat who they play?

What has a game 6 years ago to do with anything?
Another expensive university education gone to waste?

[theworm2345]

Except Ireland weren't and aren't ever going to be Germany.

[ArdeeBhoy]

Nice reminder, but think I'll settle for their international record over ours, Danke...

[pineapple stu]

And yet elsewhere you'll make comparisons based on two matches, nine years apart, one of which was a friendly?

Consistency, eh?