Group C Euro 2012 General Discussion

**Yard of Pace** · 03/12/2011, 1:36 PM

Originally Posted by osarusan

What makes you think this? I can't see us doing anything differently than what got us to the Euros in the first place.

When I see freedom I mean just slightly more free, tbh! But Trap just needs to figure out how to replicate the Paris performance. Playing the same way as we did in qualifying is simply pointless. We'll be beaten handily by Spain and Italy and perhaps get a point against Croatia. Trap is clever enough to know this (I hope).

**Stuttgart88** · 03/12/2011, 1:40 PM

No realism required on my part - it's a tough draw. That doesn't mean we can't hope to get something out of it though. I think this may be a group that sees a second placed team go through with 4 points and we just about have that in us. We could quite easily get zero points but 4 years ago I'd have bitten your hand off for zero points at a finals.

When I was out running this morning the same thing that YoP said above came into my mind. Jon Walters could prove a real handful for someone, even Spain.

**Bungle** · 03/12/2011, 1:40 PM

I'm optimistic and I think we have a very decent chance of getting out of the group. We have a very wily manager and a very organised and effective team. We don't have anywhere near the talent of 88,90,94 or 2002, but at the same time we have a good squad that I don't think will let us down.

Spain: The best team in the world with players that will be rightly recognised as some of the greats of their era when they retire. They have particular strength in midfield where we are particularly weak. However, they don't exactly hammer teams and they're bound to have a tournament that they disappoint in. It would be fabulous if Real and Barca get to the latter stages of the Champions League as they should, so that some of their players might pick up knocks. They should have too much for us though.
My prediction would be: Spain 2 Ireland 0

Croatia: The type of team that could reach a semi final without breaking sweat. However, they could also implode and fight amongst themselves. They have a magnificent playmaker in Modric and some other very good players. However, I wouldn't fear them.
My prediction: Croatia 1 Ireland 1.

Italy: Italy are very poor compared to their great teams of the past. However, they have the pedigree and tradition that make them a bit like the Germans in 2002. However, for me, this is the game where we are most likely to get 3 points. Ballotelli could be a star, but equally he could be sent off in either our game or be already suspended by the time of the Ireland game. Trap knows them inside out and they already would seem to be without Cassano and Rossi who are very good strikers.
My prediction: Italy 0 Ireland 1

**Stuttgart88** · 03/12/2011, 1:45 PM

Originally Posted by Yard of Pace

When I see freedom I mean just slightly more free, tbh! But Trap just needs to figure out how to replicate the Paris performance. Playing the same way as we did in qualifying is simply pointless. We'll be beaten handily by Spain and Italy and perhaps get a point against Croatia. Trap is clever enough to know this (I hope).

I actually reckon that we start games on the front foot, have a great habit of scoring early and it's only then that we go into our shells. That's why we're perceived as being negative.

We beat (an understrength) Italy with a back 5 of Forde, Kelly (McShane), SSL (first game in months), O'Dea and Ward. That can only give us grounds for cautious optimism!

**French Toasht** · 03/12/2011, 2:23 PM

Barring injuries and suspensions, we should be competitive. Of our big players, Given, Dunne, Duff, Keane and McGeady, the only one that is really indispensable and irreplaceable is Dunne. Of the other players, no doubt they would be a big loss, but we do have adequate cover.

**geysir** · 03/12/2011, 2:25 PM

We could perform very respectably and still finish 4th, even lose all 3. It's a tougher group than we had at Euro 88, when there were just 8 teams at the Finals

I suspect that Croatia believe the gap between us and them is much wider than what we think it will be, when the teams line out together in June. Yesterday Bilic let it slip that he thought they were much the better team in the August friendly, but it was the way he said it.

**Stuttgart88** · 03/12/2011, 2:43 PM

That was such a dull game I can barely recall a single incident from it.

**geysir** · 03/12/2011, 2:45 PM

Slaven remembers it.

**French Toasht** · 03/12/2011, 3:13 PM

It has to be said, many of us wanted Greece from pot three. But in fact, Greece finished above Croatia. Greece a team with a similar playing style to ours were able to stifle and beat Croatia, even with Georgios Samaras up front. Let's respect Croatia but not pay them any more respect than they deserve.

**Olé Olé** · 03/12/2011, 4:36 PM

Looking at those 3 sides, you can't but think Ireland have been pitted against 3 talented footballing sides. Each side can boast plenty quality, possibly more quality than the Irish squad.

However, I think that's the reason why this group could go any way. Listening to Andrews, he's fully confident that Ireland can get something against Croatia and Italy and is anticipating the Spain game greatly. This epitomises what we can expect from Ireland; fearlessness from a less than world-class player and the old clichés from Big Jack's tenure are somewhat applicable.

That's why next summer will be so exciting. The pressure upon Spain and Italy will be immense in comparison to what Ireland will experience. And the likes of Walters, Andrews and Dunne will only relish the opportunity to take on Chiellini, Modric and Villa.

That said, a loss to Croatia in the first game out could burst the bubble and spirits facing into a game against a buoyant Spanish side could not be but low. But a similar fate awaits an Italian side who must face Spain first. Should Ireland and Italy lose their first games and Spain win all 3, even one victory per side could (Croatia to beat Ireland, Ireland to beat Italy, Italy to beat Croatia) would make for something great.

**Razors left peg** · 03/12/2011, 5:03 PM

Originally Posted by Stuttgart88

When I was out running this morning the same thing that YoP said above came into my mind. Jon Walters could prove a real handful for someone, even Spain.

Italy really struggled to deal with Caleb Folan if I remember rightly and Walters is just as physical while being a better footballer

**Crosby87** · 03/12/2011, 6:32 PM

What would happen if all 6 games in a group were 1-1 draws?

**DannyInvincible** · 03/12/2011, 6:45 PM

Originally Posted by Crosby87

What would happen if all 6 games in a group were 1-1 draws?

Regulations of the UEFA European Football Championship 2010-12:

Equality of points after the group matches

8.07 If two or more teams are equal on points on completion of the group matches, the following criteria are applied, in the order given; to determine the rankings:

a) higher number of points obtained in the matches among the teams in question;
b) superior goal difference in the matches among the teams in question (if more than two teams finish equal on points);
c) higher number of goals scored in the matches among the teams in question (if more than two teams finish equal on points);
d) superior goal difference in all the group matches;
e) higher number of goals scored in all the group matches;
f) position in the UEFA national team coefficient ranking system (see Annex I, paragraph 1.2.2);
g) fair play conduct of the teams (final tournament);
h) drawing of lots.

8.08 If two teams which have the same number of points, the same number of goals scored and conceded play their last group match against each other and are still equal at the end of that match, the ranking of the two teams in question is determined by kicks from the penalty mark (Article 16), provided no other teams
within the group have the same number of points on completion of all group matches. Should more than two teams have the same number of points, the criteria listed under paragraph 8.07 apply.

**legendz** · 03/12/2011, 7:54 PM

If all teams finished level on points after all 1-1 draws, should both games go to a penalty shoot-out to provide the two teams? It'd be a bit fairer than drawing of lots. Having penalties if it's just two teams finishing level is a good option though but could it be expanded on the unlikely event it was to happen?

**DannyInvincible** · 03/12/2011, 9:35 PM

Originally Posted by legendz

If all teams finished level on points after all 1-1 draws, should both games go to a penalty shoot-out to provide the two teams? It'd be a bit fairer than drawing of lots. Having penalties if it's just two teams finishing level is a good option though but could it be expanded on the unlikely event it was to happen?

The game would only go to a shoot-out if there are just two teams even on points and goal difference after they've happened to play each other in the third and final round of games in the group. From my reading of that, the result in the last game need not even be a draw as it seems to suggest goals for and against in the game with that particular team on the same points and goal difference aren't decisive. Am I reading that correctly?...

In the case of more than two teams ending even on points and goal difference, lots would only be drawn in the event that they couldn't be separated by seven other ordered criteria including the teams' respective UEFA rankings and number of red and yellow cards they've picked up. It's highly unlikely a group would ever be decided by lots under such circumstances.

**ArdeeBhoy** · 03/12/2011, 9:39 PM

Originally Posted by Crosby87

What would happen if all 6 games in a group were 1-1 draws?

The group would be investigated for match-fixing.

And it won't happen, IMHO.

**geysir** · 04/12/2011, 12:29 AM

Before penalty shoot outs, did they not use to toss a coin?
I suppose you'd send your best poker player to call the toss.

**TrapAPony** · 04/12/2011, 2:42 AM

**gastric** · 04/12/2011, 5:23 AM

Originally Posted by TrapAPony

Love the photo of Joey Lapira!

**French Toasht** · 04/12/2011, 1:27 PM

Off topic for one second, but just out of interest what did people make of the Russian delegations rauchous cheer, when they were drawn into the group with the Poles, Czechs and Greeks? Will they be judged by their opponents as arrogant in a similar way to how John Delaney was vilified when we drew Estonia, or will it be seen as just a natural display of human emotion arising out of the circumstances?

My own opinion, it lacked decorum, yes, but arrogant, no.