Trapattoni - who would you replace him with?

[BonnieShels]

What's Philippe Troussier up to these days?

I was wondering who would mention it first... To the top of the class Mr Kyne...

http://www.theguardian.com/football/...thefiver.sport

[paul_oshea]

We're only allowed compare first campaigns (Paul's rules ).


Stan had an average of (1.41 pts per game if you include Wales game when he was actually gone... otherwise it's 1.45 per game)


-We got 18 points from 10 matches in Trap's first campaign... two games less than Stans with no San Marino. (1.8 pts per game)


Oh to hell with it...

-We got 21 points from 10 games in Trap's second campaign... again two games less. (2.1 pts per game)

-We have 11 pts from 8 games in this campaign... (1.38 pts per game)


The latter is the real telling stat and why he had to go, not his home record even if they are slightly connected.

So against very similar level( and sweden are not as good as that czech team)opposition his record is in fact a lot worse than Stans with relative teams? And from pot 4 seedings against pot 3 for this group, stan probably did better! You shifted the goal posts first! :P

The problem is he should have been gone well before this. Thats the real problem here, and there were too many blinded by his previous managerial record especially in the last year that were still hiding in the bunkers. Had we got someone in after Germany or after the Euros who knows where we could be now, we certainly couldnt be any worse

We always seem to let things go too long wrt the management of our international team. Too often we say he should see out campaigns etc, to the detriment of our own hopes. Its never happened where anyone has ever turned it around.

[DeLorean]

You have to be joking me? You're now comparing Stan's first campaign to Trap's last because it suits you best... that after saying it's unreasonable to compare anything other that both manager's first campaigns? Bulgaria/Montenegro are very comparable to Sweden/Austria in any case.

Anyway, it's pointless because we are in agreement that this campaign has been a shambles and he had to go. I don't think anybody is disputing that.

[osarusan]

What's Philippe Troussier up to these days?

Managing in the Chinese league. Before that he was managing a Japanese non-league team.

He was crap even when he was the manager of Japan. The team couldn't score under him.

[paul_oshea]

I saw that you wrote the stats for his previous campaigns so then I thought a little more about it.

If we were to compare the teams from stans first group was easily as difficult as any of Traps groups. But again it doesn't matter he is gone now, and he should have been gone well before now, and we might well have still been in with a chance of qualifying at this stage.

[paul_oshea]

Managing in the Chinese league. Before that he was managing a Japanese non-league team.

He was crap even when he was the manager of Japan. The team couldn't score under him.

Sounds familiar.

[geysir]

Managing in the Chinese league. Before that he was managing a Japanese non-league team.

He was crap even when he was the manager of Japan. The team couldn't score under him.

I thought he did okay with Japan, they did win games, managed to play well at WC2002 and were definitely not any better at WC 2006.
Not that I'm plugging PT.

[osarusan]

They weren't really that good at all. Top seeds as hosts - got out of a group with Russia (who hadn't qualified for Euro 2000), Belgium (who'd had a nightmare as hosts of Euro 2000) and Tunisia. Went out in the next round to Turkey. He also left Shunsuke Nakamura out of the world cup squad to focus on defensive strength.

No better in 2006 because they weren't top seeds like in 2002. And because Zico was useless too.

[geysir]

They weren't really that good at all. Got out of a group with Russia (who hadn't qualified for Euro 2000), Belgium (who'd had a nightmare as hosts of Euro 2000) and Tunisia. Went out in the next round to Turkey. He also left Shunsuke Nakamura out of the world cup squad to focus on defensive strength.

No better in 2006 because they weren't top seeds like in 2002. And because Zico was useless too.

Ah well, in that case you must have thought we were rubbish at WC2002.

[Junior]

Could Joe Kinnear be tempted from his Newcastle role?????

Not read his name linked this time around.........


Thank fcuk!

[geysir]

If there's any linking, Joe will be the one to tell us.

[tricky_colour]

Well, there's no obligation upon an international manager to select players who won't work with him. He can always select someone else as a replacement.

The problem is he is often severely restricted in choice. At club level you can sell a player for his market value and bring in one of the
same quality, at national level you will always be replacing him with someone who in your own opinion is lesser player (otherwise he would be your first choice). Sometimes it is not too bad as people will have different opinion as to who is the best player for that position, but other times you really feel you are bringing in an inferior player. Having said that it is quite often the case that the 'inferior player' turns out to be a lot better than people predicted I think we have seen a few cases of that, Gary Breen being one example perhaps? Paul Green another.

[tricky_colour]

I'm not sure comparisons between the two are worthwhile. Both had to go.

The most telling statistic of all is Trap's home record. The worst in 40 years.

True but I think he also had the best away record? You occasionally do get teams who do better away from home,
I guess these are teams who can defend, but are limited in attack.

[Stuttgart88]

Yes, his away record was far and away the best.

[Deckydee]

Gus Poyet anyone?

[Stuttgart88]

No, because he is unlikely to last the course. He had a great gig at Brighton but had his sights set on bigger things. Managing Ireland would not be one of those bigger things!

[DeLorean]

No matter who we get it's going to be a gamble. I think MON is probably the safest gamble. If he's a failure, so be it... I don't think anybody could really look back and say it was a foolish appointment. If we get anybody else and it doesn't work out... I would certainly look back and say "f*** sake, we really should have got Martin O'Neill".

We don't have the pace in our side that Villa had under his management, so it wouldn't surprise me if he went with more of an early days Celtic approach. We have decent wide players who can do a good defensive job also so maybe he'd use the wing back system as a starting point.


----------Westwood---------

---O'Shea---Dunne---Clark---
Coleman-------------McClean

----McCarthy------Gibson----
----------Hoolahan----------

-------Long-----Keane-------


You could swap McGeady for McClean maybe but I think McClean would be more suited to this particular role. It would be made for Coleman.

Hoolahan could be our Moravcik, with McCarthy and Gibson doing the work of Petrov and Lambert.

[ArdeeBhoy]

No-one can replace Lubo!

And how much better was Trap's away record over Big Jack's?

[Razors left peg]

Martin O Neill would be fantastic for us I think. Great manager who knows the players and wouldn't need to spend the first campaign simply trying to learn what players he has.

If he wants the job I would give it to him now in time for the last games in the group

[Stuttgart88]

Martin O Neill would be fantastic for us I think. Great manager who knows the players and wouldn't need to spend the first campaign simply trying to learn what players he has.

If he wants the job I would give it to him now in time for the last games in the group

Yeah, I think you can analyse things to the hilt but I agree with the above.