Euro Zone integration

**Angus** · 16/08/2011, 8:21 PM

http://www.rte.ie/news/2011/0816/euro-business.html

Really ?

These people are dangerous. Because governments have failed miserably to stand up to the international markets, their solution is, er , what they wanted all along........the United States of Europe

Happy with these people at the helm ? Let's not pretend that we fail to grasp what is going on here - they are playing on the fears of people and using it as a catalyst for greater european integration.

Makes me sick - and half of you voted for it consistently...."Lisbon for Jobs"

**culloty82** · 16/08/2011, 8:41 PM

Just to play devil's advocate, given that Spanish and Italian difficulties brought this about, wouldn't we be stuck anyway even if we had rejected Lisbon 2? Agree today's developments are ominous, but hard to see how individual countries can escape this.

**BonnieShels** · 16/08/2011, 10:36 PM

Nearly vomited when I heard this on the way home from work. The audacity. We need to get out now.

**Spudulika** · 17/08/2011, 4:41 AM

Christ, we're done for. Remember when we rejected Lisbon one we were told we were cutting our own throats. Unless we signed up to it the economy would collapse, jobs lost, banks in meltdown. The gobsheens panicked and voted it in - and we lost everything anyway. And one of the main sticks of the opposition (who were destroyed in the media) was that this would lead, after a crisis, to a common european government looked after by the krauts and frogs. When will the streets overflow with protest?

**mypost** · 17/08/2011, 5:19 AM

Originally Posted by BonnieShels

The audacity. We need to get out now.

Get out of what? Leaving the EU isn't going to happen. Leaving the Euro is no use to us. Look at the Americans, and the Brits. Both with their own currencies, and not able to pay their bills either.

We had our say on our EU future two years ago. 1.4 million people did what they were instructed to do. The promises turned out to be a load of rubbish, but the rest of us knew that, and told them that before the vote was held. There's no going back now.

**BonnieShels** · 17/08/2011, 6:44 AM

Okay. It wasn't as bad as I feared but its the thin end of the wedge.

No I ask ya? Why isn't there any going back? Politics isn't organic no more than the banking system is. We can do what we want! In theory that won't happen but it's still possible. We need to see this plan fleshed out fully.

Then we can panic!

**Angus** · 17/08/2011, 6:54 AM

Originally Posted by mypost

Get out of what? Leaving the EU isn't going to happen. Leaving the Euro is no use to us...... There's no going back now.

I think in absolute terms you are right. This is a failed state - economically, civically (governance and control over banks), morally (successive state and church agencies could not have cared less about children in their care). The place is screwed - nothing is going to change that - except for a genuine visionary inspirational leader - of which we have none

So what to do ? I am afraid that there comes a point when we need to take action for reasons other than economic interest - walking away from the EU would be too far - but I wouls suggest that we should walk away from the Euro. It doesnt actually make much economic difference if we are in that or not - any exchange or interest rate movements can be hedged - and significanltly - it would dent their beloved project

I hate the EU - and yes I know we have benefited financially but now we are seeing the cost - but leaving the EU would undoubtedly come with such significant penalties, it would be a set too far IMO

This is now a time for Cameron - a glorious opportunity for him to change the new cycle away from the NOTW and the riots and to jam the brakes on Europe - is he man of substance or a man of straw ?

**Spudulika** · 17/08/2011, 7:09 AM

I am a supporter of the EU, though disappointed in the operation of many of it's agencies and projects. I am a believer in what it has set out to achieve, in what it has achieved and what it can achieve, however what we are seeing now is a hijacking of this to pad the pockets of the backers of governments. I want Ireland to stay in the EU, I want Ireland to stay in the Euro, I also want the EU to continue protecting minority rights (Irish language speakers and culture for a start) and to be a strong block against the US, Russia-ICS and China.

I do not believe in this irish government or the last or their crooked allies. I am still disgusted with Labour for going in with FG and further selling out their voters. I do not believe that this crisis is the be all and end all, that it's not the catastrophe that some of the cheerleaders are making out. Noonan is not a strong man, Kenny is a clown (his rant against the catholic church was more smoke and mirrors to grab headlines) and until we have an Irish leader of substance we are never going to have any type of progress.

We will continue on with bread and games, being patronised and spoken down to. We will continue to have our plasma tvs, 500channels and internet porn, and nothing will change. We will be told that "social media" is the best and brings about change - while sitting on our growing backsides and doing nothing about anything. Ireland doesn't do revolutions, we don't do street protest. The march of the pensioners best typified that when well heeled members over 60 got what they wanted, which was little after all. Yet the less advantaged pensioner still loses.

In some ways it'd be as well to be taken over by the EU fully, as how much worse could it be to be governed by sausage and cheese munching nouveau colonialists in Brussels than by boghoppers and D4 heads in Dublin?

**mypost** · 17/08/2011, 7:40 AM

Originally Posted by Angus

So what to do ? I am afraid that there comes a point when we need to take action for reasons other than economic interest - walking away from the EU would be too far - but I wouls suggest that we should walk away from the Euro. It doesnt actually make much economic difference if we are in that or not - any exchange or interest rate movements can be hedged - and significanltly - it would dent their beloved project

I hate the EU - and yes I know we have benefited financially but now we are seeing the cost - but leaving the EU would undoubtedly come with such significant penalties, it would be a set too far IMO

This is now a time for Cameron - a glorious opportunity for him to change the new cycle away from the NOTW and the riots and to jam the brakes on Europe - is he man of substance or a man of straw ?

He's not going to leave the EU. Too many jobs for the UK at stake. That pragmatism will override other concerns.

There was a good column in one paper last weekend, explaining in detail what would happen if we left the Euro. The few advantages were heavily outweighed by the instant armageddon that would immediately follow, if we had Punts again. The grass isn't greener for those with their own currencies. The last thing we need here is more financial armageddon.

As regards leaving the EU, it's a pipe dream. At least 133 of the 166 Dail TD's alone are Europhiles. The economic elite are fully signed up to Brussels, most of the media are too. The general public are grateful for the financial benefits and trading conditions of the membership, and always throw it at you when you criticise it.

The reality is, the nation signed up to these agreements with Brussels through the ballot box, and we now have to live with the decisions and agreements made. It's too late to say we want out now, the EU is not an "a la carte" club.